"The Law is a Ass - a Idiot"

[Calliope]

Mr Bumble certainly got that right. Our judicial system is so full of contradictions, inequities and stupidities that I thought it was worth a thread. Every day provides us with a new example.

A BRISBANE man today will mark his 19th birthday in custody for the alleged rape and murder of mother-to-be Joan Ryther.

He was remanded in custody this morning and will appear in Beenleigh Magistrates Court on Monday.

His lawyer Michael Bosscher said his client was extremely anxious about his situation and would be contesting the charges.

The accused - who cannot be named because one of the charges he is facing is rape - was arrested in Brisbane early this morning just hours into his 19th birthday.

He taken to Logan Central Police Station for questioning and then to Logan Watchhouse.

He met his lawyer this morning after a family member organised representation.

The accused told Mr Bosscher that he denied any role in the offences.

Ms Ryther was on her way to work at McDonald's at Logan Central on Tuesday May 21 when she was killed.

A resident found her partially-clothed body at 7am Wednesday in a yard on Leichhardt St, just 900m from her Mayes Ave home on May 22.

(my bolds)

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...r-of-joan-ryther/story-e6freoof-1226654913835

 

[Ladybyrd]

Totally agree. I can understand that they wouldn't release his name at the victims request if it was going to cause embarassment etc to the victim. But as that is clearly not the case and everyone knows who the victim is, I fail to see the reasoning

 

[McLovin]

What's the issue?

The law may work on the principle of innocent until proven guilty but people don't.

 

[Ves]

Whilst, this is more a general comment, and probably not 100% relevant, I read the text Calliope posted, and I, without really making any logical connections, or using any real thought processes, assumed the guy was innocent.

I'm not really sure why I came to this, admittedly, superficial conclusion, but is it a pre-conceived bias? Is it due to the way the article was worded? Is it something else from my previous experiential database? These are probably interesting questions that form part of the doubt that we can have in the judicial process in this country.

 

[McLovin]

Whilst, this is more a general comment, and probably not 100% relevant, I read the text Calliope posted, and I, without really making any logical connections, or using any real thought processes, assumed the guy was innocent.

He is innocent.

 

[Ves]

He is innocent.

... as in until proven guilty or has he actually been cleared?

 

[McLovin]

... as in until proven guilty or has he actually been cleared?

Until proven guilty. I can certainly understand why they don't release the name of people accused of certain crimes. There would be a sizeable minority of the population that don't delineate between accused and guilty.

 

[Ves]

Until proven guilty. I can certainly understand why they don't release the name of people accused of certain crimes. There would be a sizeable minority of the population that don't delineate between accused and guilty.

I agree. The world is full of preconceptions and biases, as my own thoughts demonstrated, we don't really need to make everything public until there is a need.

 

[Calliope]

Until proven guilty. I can certainly understand why they don't release the name of people accused of certain crimes. There would be a sizeable minority of the population that don't delineate between accused and guilty.

It has nothing to do with guilt or innocence as you well know. It will be interesting to see if they will release his name after he has been formally charged on Monday.

 

[Ves]

Calliope - I know you deleted your post, but to answer the question, rape cases give anonymity to the accused because the % of convictions in sexual assault cases is very low. There was plenty of debate on this in the UK a few years ago when they were legislating the "rape shield" laws. Lots of backlash.

 

[Julia]

It has nothing to do with guilt or innocence as you well know. It will be interesting to see if they will release his name after he has been formally charged on Monday.

Why do you say it has nothing to do with guilt or innocence?
To release his name before he has been convicted would be a travesty imo.

Aren't you equally saying that if the police rocked up and charged you with an offence, you would be happy to have this accusation - naming you - splashed all over the media even if you know you are innocent?

 

[McLovin]

It has nothing to do with guilt or innocence as you well know. It will be interesting to see if they will release his name after he has been formally charged on Monday.

And until he has had his charges presented before a magistrate or (I'm assuming for murder) judge, his name should continue to be suppressed. At that point a judge can either issue a suppression order or allow him to be named.

I still don't see what the issue is? Assuming that the bolded bits of your OP are what you object to.

 

[Calliope]

Why do you say it has nothing to do with guilt or innocence?
To release his name before he has been convicted would be a travesty imo.

Melbourne man Adrian Ernest Bayley was charged with the rape and murder of ABC staffer Jill Meagher and he has not been convicted. Do you really think that the fact that we know his name is a travesty? Very few people go to trial with their identity concealed as you well know.

From the police point of view the main benefit of naming these people is so that other people who have information can come forward.

 

[Calliope]

For those who think the law is not an ass, consider this;

Former police officer Ken Olsen was taking a weekend drive south of Brisbane in December last year when he was rear-ended by a black ute.

The ute's driver Edward Sullivan, 21, relentlessly attacked Mr Olsen's car, putting the former police officer through 12 terrifying minutes of mindless road rage.

The attack ended when Sullivan leapt onto the bonnet of Mr Olsen's car and punched in the windscreen, all of which was caught on Mr Olsen's dashboard camera.

Sullivan was charged with dangerous operation of a motor vehicle and wilful damage.

Yesterday Sullivan was handed two years probation and six months licence suspension.

 

[Julia]

Melbourne man Adrian Ernest Bayley was charged with the rape and murder of ABC staffer Jill Meagher and he has not been convicted. Do you really think that the fact that we know his name is a travesty?

No. Because he confessed.

You have not responded to my hypothetical about whether you'd think it was just quite fine for your name to be splashed across the media if the police took it into their collective heads to charge you with something you did not do.

 

[Calliope]

No. Because he confessed.

Sorry, my mistake. I thought you said;

"To release his name before he has been convicted would be a travesty imo." when obviously you meant:

"To release his name before he had confessed would be a travesty imo."

As for your hypothetical. I don't walk into traps; and what did you mean by "if the police rocked up?"

 

[MrBurns]

For those who think the law is not an ass, consider this;

Perhaps the former policemen and his connections would prefer this bloke be free so they can deal with him in a more personal manner.

 

[Calliope]

Perhaps the former policemen and his connections would prefer this bloke be free so they can deal with him in a more personal manner.

He pleaded guilty of course and got the plea bargain...hence he got a rap over the knuckles for an offence that was apparently attempted murder. As the victim said, this guy was using his vehicle as an offensive weapon.

This thug, Edward Sulivan has previous form.

 

[DB008]

He pleaded guilty of course and got the plea bargain...hence he got a rap over the knuckles for an offence that was apparently attempted murder. As the victim said, this guy was using his vehicle as an offensive weapon.

This thug, Edward Sulivan has previous form.

This Edward Sulivan guy, what a goose. Just imagine this thug behaving like this to your mum/dad or even a elderly lady/man? He should have had his license suspended for more than 6 months.

Another thread title says it all - 'Sentencing in Australia is a joke'

 

[MrBurns]

This Edward Sulivan guy, what a goose. Just imagine this thug behaving like this to your mum/dad or even a elderly lady/man? He should have his license suspended for more than 6 months.

Another thread title says it all - 'Sentencing in Australia is a joke'

In the UK or USA he would have got substantial jail time.

We are so weak it's not funny and the consequence is we have more than our fair share of nut jobs roaming the streets.

The mafia dispense their own justice, I know why.