- Joined
- 6 January 2009
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hello,
Satanoperca, so you shorting with CFD's, would be the ultimate bet, put 500k on it, they will take the bet
Sinner,
I cannot short property per say but I can short those companies who are largely involved in the supply of huge amounts of credit/debt to the sector, our banks until KRUDD & Co place a ban on these golden angels once more.
Cheers
Incorrect, but keep on assuming.
Gee, put down 10% deposit and buy and IP, that seems like betting to me.
Everything is a gamble it just depends on how much risk you can tolerate.
Cheers
hello,
what percentage do the banks get from overseas sinner? isnt the race on for deposits from the local community
man some spruiking goes on
thankyou
professor robots
While we are on the subject of debt, there was something on the ABC news the other nite that caught my attention...apparently about 75% of Australians personal debt is held by people earning over 75K per annum...so it would seem that the vast majority of personal debt is reasonably well serviced by our high income earners and thus low risk.
Hi satano,
You give a good example of leverage on the retail side of the market, i.e. those taking out loans.
I put it to you and all others on this forum that the question we as Australian citizens - who through the Treasury have guaranteed the huuuuuuuge amounts of debt of the Big 4 banks (especially all the new foreign currency denominated debt they have issued for huge profits since 2008 guarantee came in place) - should be asking is what about the leverage of our banks?
Especially CBA and WBC who hold as more than half the "assets" on their books as mortgage debt. Banks are fully leveraged into the real estate trade - which has traditionally been "buy short sell long" or buy short term debt and sell long term debt. They have sold a lot of this debt into foreign currency denominated bonds and the like.
What will the market cap/asset book of CBA or WBC look like if house prices decline by say, 5% (so I am not accused of picking a sensational number) in a contracting credit environment where they cannot find bidders for new debt? Please ask yourself if the global market for debt is contracting or increasing.
We have already allowed these banks to take bad/nonperforming assets off their balance sheets, otherwise they would already be insolvent. So let's ignore those assets just like they do, and pretend all is rosy for a second then ask the hypothetical two part question:
1. What is the actual leverage of our big 4 banks in the residential Aus RE and Aus CRE market? Domestic demand for Aus government debt is not especially high compared to say US Treasuries, Japanese Government Bonds or German Bunds. So our banks did, do and will continue to fund our RE appetite on international debt markets. Is this leverage and method of obtaining funding sustainable from a macro perspective and ethical from our citizens perspective as debt guarantors to these banks?
2. Assuming this is not a bubble, but rather a healthy bull market, we can also assume house prices make a healthy correction of 5% at some future point before making new highs. What will happen to the balance sheets of our big 4 banks in such a correction scenario? What would be the trigger for such a correction? Are the banks or even Australian society prepared for such a trigger event?
For all you property bulls living in a fools paradise, click on this link and pay attention to slides 21-22.
http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/...presentation-on-scribd-on-australian-housing/
Enjoy while it lasts.
CBA and WBC have >50% in residential mortgage debt on their books, USA and UK banks were in a healthier state before their collapse. Lookout below.
Beej,
I do see the banks falling over as they are heavily exposed to the RE sector, just cannot see them writing huge amounts of loans like they did last year without govnuts assistance.
Cheers
Catch-22. How can they possibly stop offering that huge cash splash without burning their own electoral fingers?
For example, even without the federal govnuts FHOB (Boost), NSW alone still forked out $780 Million in $7,000 FHOG's (Grant) in the 12 mths between start Jun 2009 & end May 2010. http://www.osr.nsw.gov.au/lib/doc/stats/fhb_top20.pdf
With all the other states as well as NSW still running that $7,000 FHOG scheme into the foreseeable future, that is a substantial whack ($Billions) of govnut support Australia-wide being continually pumped each year in to the RE sector.
Catch-22. How can they possibly stop offering that huge cash splash without burning their own electoral fingers?
One word.... "Referendum"
Now that would be an interesting proposition
One word.... "Referendum"
Now that would be an interesting proposition
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