The Albanese government

[SirRumpole]

Therein lies the problem, why should one flag be more allowable, than another.

An exception can be made for the ATSI's as they were here before us, the rest can suck it up.

 

[sptrawler]

An exception can be made for the ATSI's as they were here before us, the rest can suck it up.

Exceptions, aren't they the start of discrimination issues?

 

[JohnDe]

There is no link in the heading. Why not just say who it was?

I didn’t take note, read it on my phone and agreed with it. The only time I take notice of the author is when I read the article in the paper or computer. Sorry, when I get home I’ll check for you.

 

[IFocus]

Exceptions, aren't they the start of discrimination issues?

Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics when really its just paying long over due respect no big deal.

Dutton's position is his right but pretty much rules him out of being fit to be an Australian PM, described as thug by Turnbull also clearly a grubby coward attacking Australia's most marginalized group for no other reason than political.

 

[farmerge]

Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics when really its just paying long over due respect no big deal.

Dutton's position is his right but pretty much rules him out of being fit to be an Australian PM, described as thug by Turnbull also clearly a grubby coward attacking Australia's most marginalized group for no other reason than political.

Perhaps we should just ditch the current Australian flag and have in its place the Rainbow one instead.
That would keep a small percentage of the populace happy and the upset the majority no end.

 

[JohnDe]

There is no link in the heading. Why not just say who it was?

Here you go -

Why Peter Dutton is right to fly one flag for unity
Peta Credlin

 

[JohnDe]

Dutton is playing his usual distraction politics, going off on a tangent on rides to nowhere on issues that don't really matter. He's now trying to distract from his ridiculous nuclear policy because it knows it will bankrupt the country for little in return.

He and the LNP is as useless as ever. Labor need to lift their act as well and the Greens have to stop blocking. But this is all wishfull thinking, politics doesn't change that much. It will take a disaster for either side to get them back on track.

A larger proportion of business and the public believe that the nuclear option is better, and that the current renewable power road that Labor and the Greens have taken us down is the disaster.

Coalition says nuclear policy, at over $300 billion, is cheaper than renewables

By political reporter Tom Crowley​

Mr Dutton said the cost of his plan would be $263 billion cheaper than the cost of Labor's policy, which Frontier Economics has estimated is around $600 billion. Labor disputes that cost. The Coalition argues it can save money on "unnecessary infrastructure expenses" including transmission, if nuclear power plants could be "plugged in" to transmission lines currently used by coal.​

Frontier Economics also costed SA Labors hydrogen plan, amongst other projects.

Hydrogen storage and power plant combination proposed by SA Labor

Economic Modelling Consultants

With our economic modelling expertise, we build custom economic and financial models to forecast and solve issues for clients in energy and other sectors.

www.frontier-economics.com.au

 

[SirRumpole]

Here you go -

Why Peter Dutton is right to fly one flag for unity
Peta Credlin

Thanks.

 

[sptrawler]

Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics when really its just paying long over due respect no big deal.

Dutton's position is his right but pretty much rules him out of being fit to be an Australian PM, described as thug by Turnbull also clearly a grubby coward attacking Australia's most marginalized group for no other reason than political.

As I keep saying, they need to work out an acceptable compensation package and move on, constantly going over the same ground just wears the narrative thin.

There are no people alive that were here 60,000 years ago, and the fact the indigenous forefathers were, is already acknowledged.
So the only real issue that keeps cropping up is dispossession, fix that and move on as one nation, or else we well turn into another rabble society like most of the other areas that have multiple factions claiming ownership.

Of course it is divisive, when one group of citizens has more right to be in a country than another group of citizens, just because their ancestors were there first, how can you develop a cohesive society with that mantra? I used to have some very heated debates with my father and brother over cricket, because they barracked for England, when we had adopted Australia as our chosen country to live in.

If you keep telling people that they are visitors in Australia and can never be equal to people who arrived here first, you will never build any patriotism, as is happening currently no one wants to join our armed forces the lack of patriotism and lack of loyalty is growing IMO.
Just another unintended consequence of pizz poor planning and pizz poor outcomes, of tribal politics.

You say Quote "Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics".

Then you say something as divisive as anything I've ever read Quote.
"Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

So in your eyes immigrants are and always will be second class inhabitants, because their ancestors were born in a different country. Nice and racist.
Don't you think people should be judged on what they do, rather than on where they were fortunate enough to be born?

 

[JohnDe]

Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics when really its just paying long over due respect no big deal.

Dutton's position is his right but pretty much rules him out of being fit to be an Australian PM, described as thug by Turnbull also clearly a grubby coward attacking Australia's most marginalized group for no other reason than political.

Those words are awfully close to crossing a dangerous line, "immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level."

Our grandparents and great grandparents fought a war against similar nazi ideology of removing all immigrants, regardless of how many generations they had been there.

The whole debate has been divisive, the referendum was and still is divisive with the Yes campaigners calling No voters all sorts of names, you are being divisive by playing the 'immigrant' versus original 'inhabitant's card'.

We cannot turn back the clock, we can only move forward. Moving forward includes accepting that we are all Australians, everyone born on this great continent is now indigenous to it.

Albanese and his front bench got it wrong with the referendum, it is time that they unite us all.

Inevitably, the eruption of modernity onto an ancient continent was initially devastating for the original inhabitants. And almost inevitably, there were episodes of violence, injustice and racism as two very different cultures tried to come to terms with each other – despite officialdom’s constant injunctions that Aboriginal people were entitled to the full protection of the law.​

​

None of this has stopped modern Australia from being among the most colourblind and least racist of countries, with Aboriginal people fully accepted and respected as the first Australians. And analysis of our parliament shows the respect voters have for strong Indigenous voices (provided they do not abuse our institutions like Lidia Thorpe).​

One country, One people, One flag.

 

[JohnDe]

.... Moving forward includes accepting that we are all Australians, everyone born on this great continent is now indigenous to it.

That reminded me of a conversation I had several weeks ago. A friend works for a non-for-profit women's legal organisation that offers free assistance to women that can't afford a lawyer. They had a training day, everyone had to attend, the subject was Aboriginal culture. One aspect of the training session was to explain that the term 'indigenous;' is no longer acceptable. What is acceptable is Aboriginal and first nations people.

It may be possible that indigenous opens up a can of legal worms, anyone born in the country of residence could claim the term.

 

[macca]

That reminded me of a conversation I had several weeks ago. A friend works for a non-for-profit women's legal organisation that offers free assistance to women that can't afford a lawyer. They had a training day, everyone had to attend, the subject was Aboriginal culture. One aspect of the training session was to explain that the term 'indigenous;' is no longer acceptable. What is acceptable is Aboriginal and first nations people.

It may be possible that indigenous opens up a can of legal worms, anyone born in the country of residence could claim the term.

And many Aboriginal elders say that the place you are born is "your country" so anyone who was born in Australia is an aborigine and or is indigenous.

Millions of people born here have nowhere else to call home so they must be Australian regardless of their heritage or skin colour

 

[IFocus]

As I keep saying, they need to work out an acceptable compensation package and move on, constantly going over the same ground just wears the narrative thin.

There are no people alive that were here 60,000 years ago, and the fact the indigenous forefathers were, is already acknowledged.
So the only real issue that keeps cropping up is dispossession, fix that and move on as one nation, or else we well turn into another rabble society like most of the other areas that have multiple factions claiming ownership.

Of course it is divisive, when one group of citizens has more right to be in a country than another group of citizens, just because their ancestors were there first, how can you develop a cohesive society with that mantra? I used to have some very heated debates with my father and brother over cricket, because they barracked for England, when we had adopted Australia as our chosen country to live in.

If you keep telling people that they are visitors in Australia and can never be equal to people who arrived here first, you will never build any patriotism, as is happening currently no one wants to join our armed forces the lack of patriotism and lack of loyalty is growing IMO.
Just another unintended consequence of pizz poor planning and pizz poor outcomes, of tribal politics.

You say Quote "Trying to frame it as divisive is real nasty politics".

Then you say something as divisive as anything I've ever read Quote.
"Discrimination is not recognizing the original inhabits (geezas only here for 20K to 60k years, pick a number) immigrants on the other hand hardly qualify to the same level.

So in your eyes immigrants are and always will be second class inhabitants, because their ancestors were born in a different country. Nice and racist.
Don't you think people should be judged on what they do, rather than on where they were fortunate enough to be born?

FFS I though we were talking about a flag.

You wanted everyone to have a flag.

I was stating the bleeding obvious that perhaps...you know....people who here 1st by 10's of thousands of years might have a higher claim than blow ins like your self who turn up and 5 mins later start sprouting one nation one flag (pommy flag at that nothing Australian about it) that's straight after totally pucking over the 1st mob.

I give up ....you win.

 

[sptrawler]

FFS I though we were talking about a flag.

You wanted everyone to have a flag.

I was stating the bleeding obvious that perhaps...you know....people who here 1st by 10's of thousands of years might have a higher claim than blow ins like your self who turn up and 5 mins later start sprouting one nation one flag (pommy flag at that nothing Australian about it) that's straight after totally pucking over the 1st mob.

I give up ....you win.

That was easier than I thought it would be, just compensate them and they will be happy.
All the reps say it, they want reparations and self determination, a treaty is the first step to it.
Which IMO is fair enough, as usual there is too much white noise clouding the real issue.
Give them compensation and self determination in the communities and let them get on with it, obviously us supplying the services isn't working.
Give them the tools and the accountability and see if it works.
It would be interesting.
I stayed on Navajo land in the U.S recently, they are getting on with it and still fly the U.S flag, didn't seem to carry the victim issues we do.

 

[wayneL]

Whose money should these reparations be paid with,and who should get them? Should the 15/16ths of their white blood pay themselves for the 1/16th?

Should those of us with no fault be forced to pay?

This is not the answer, not in any sense.

 

[wayneL]

Whose money should these reparations be paid with,and who should get them? Should the 15/16ths of their white blood pay themselves for the 1/16th?

Should those of us with no fault be forced to pay?

This is not the answer, not in any sense.

Additionally, how much have we all paid already through various programs? It is already many many billions.

 

[SirRumpole]

Just how bad it has got in Alice Springs. I don't think many would support treaty when these sorts of things happen.

https://www.news.com.au/finance/real-estate/selling/living-in-fear-residents-flee-alice-springs-as-violent

 

[sptrawler]

Whose money should these reparations be paid with,and who should get them? Should the 15/16ths of their white blood pay themselves for the 1/16th?

Should those of us with no fault be forced to pay?

This is not the answer, not in any sense.

You already are paying and it is a lot more than it should be, if the money is used to give the kids jobs, fixing stuff that they break it would actually cost less in the end.

 

[farmerge]

That was easier than I thought it would be, just compensate them and they will be happy.
All the reps say it, they want reparations and self determination, a treaty is the first step to it.
Which IMO is fair enough, as usual there is too much white noise clouding the real issue.
Give them compensation and self determination in the communities and let them get on with it, obviously us supplying the services isn't working.
Give them the tools and the accountability and see if it works.
It would be interesting.
I stayed on Navajo land in the U.S recently, they are getting on with it and still fly the U.S flag, didn't seem to carry the victim issues we do.

It has been proven time and time again that the various Aboriginal communities and Corporations are not capable of running anything.
They would not even be able to run a chocolate wheel successfully

 

[wayneL]

You already are paying and it is a lot more than it should be, if the money is used to give the kids jobs, fixing stuff that they break it would actually cost less in the end.

Exactly, which is why I vehemently and against any modern day reparation.