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Is TA a viable tool for predicting future prices?
If so, why?
If not, why not?
What alternatives are there and are they any better?
(forget tainting the thread with money management and regurgitated lines borrowed from books)
I am interested in what people think or believe.
Hi Snake,
What does TA or technical analysis actually mean?
Is it the study of:
*Price action?
*Volume?
*Indicators?
All of the above?
We should define this before we move further.
Yeah it's a very broad church.Nizar,
Nice to have you comment.
TA might mean different things for different people. I believe it is the analysis of visual action of price historically displayed in hindsight on computer or paper. It can and often does involve the above or can involve other tools that posters may want to talk about. It may be a bit simple to simplify it to the small list you gave.(expand on indicators, uses, studies etc) Why not include all of the available visual stuff in the meaning?
Yeah it's a very broad church.
There are three broad churches as far as I know
1/ fundamental - the study of value via company reports
2/ quantitative - the development of mathematic models
3/ technical - study of price movement, volume and interpretation of such.
IMO there can be a blurry line between quantitative and technical, but basically, if there's a chart involved, it's technical.
My 2c. I'll leave the question of prediction to others.
Techniques don't predict the future, people try to and no-one can...it's just not possible...my unshakable belief. I think there are people who make bets, get it right and say, "see, I told you I knew what would happen!". Some people are better guessers than others. Betting with probabilities is not prediciting the future.Is TA a viable tool for predicting future prices?
What alternatives are there and are they any better?
Is TA a viable tool for predicting future prices?
No
If so, why?
If not, why not?
Technical analysis is a deterministic construct that incorrectly assigns higher probabilities than 1/3
As the future is unknown, information that will move price is by definition unknown, allowing a positive/negative outcome to move prices, or a 1/2 probability to make money [no movement is a loss due to transaction costs and the time value of money] Then, 2/3 you lose money, 1/3 you make money. Or as far as prediction goes, no change would be a null outcome.
What alternatives are there and are they any better?
*Fundamentals
*Quantitative
*Arbitrage
*Market making [Bid/Ask spread
Not necessarily better, different.
(forget tainting the thread with money management and regurgitated lines borrowed from books)
I am interested in what people think or believe.
Some people have the skill to chart-read by forward-thinking of likely events happening because those same patterns have occurred in the past. This is the theory of all forward looking methodologies. Some people like to call it predictions. But they are simply modeling patterns of likely events that might or might not take place.
These type of traders will use this skill, but will only trade when the alignments occur and subject themselves to trade when it conforms with the view. Elliot-wave is an example of forward-looking methods. So is mine. Whether the trade works or not, they simple move on to the next.
There are others like ASX gorilla who can’t, or don’t want to forward-think in probabilities using modeling patterns. They believe it can’t be done and believe that no one else can. They don’t understand it so they dismiss it. These traders rely on systems and price-based indicators to trade, and don’t give a rats-**** about trying to predict the market. When the trade comes along they take it regardless of any view, prediction or perception others make. Whether the trade works or not, they simply move on the next.
Both methods are the same: - Whether the trade works or not, they simply move to the next.
Regardless of whether you can or can’t, it makes no difference whether you use forward-looking models or not. The only thing that matters is making money by subjecting yourself to the markets, whichever method you use.
But in reality, every ‘systematic’ trade placed is literally ‘predicting’ the market, because of the belief that the past will repeat into the future. If not you wouldn’t place the trade.
I don’t think there are to many dart throwers amongst us.
BTW…fundamentals and fundamental analysis is the only thing that will make you wealthy in the market.
Technical analysis is at its best; only good for lifestyle choices and achieving an income. Sadly most traders using technical analysis would be lucky to be making more money than if they were working for someone else.
Just my view
Frank Dilernia
Techniques don't predict the future, people try to and no-one can...it's just not possible...my unshakable belief. I think there are people who make bets, get it right and say, "see, I told you I knew what would happen!". Some people are better guessers than others. Betting with probabilities is not prediciting the future.
I actually don't believe there is anything better for trading the stock market for retail level investors than technical analysis. Fundamental analysis is too time consuming and you're too distanced from where the real wheeling and dealing happens to stand a chance at getting it right. I don't care for a discussion about why I'm wrong...I believe it and am not currently at a place in time where I'm willing to accept counter arguements, sorry.
The only superior alternative to technical analysis IMO is macro economic analysis...in other words, the big picture. The stuff that Richard Farleigh made his fortune doing. But even he describes using what I interpret to have been a rudimentary form of trend analysis to make sure that he was getting with the herd. The big picture analysis helps you identify imbalances and build theories about what trends could occur and trend analysis tells what trends are occuring.
Motorway put it best I think.
Technically we Anticipate rather than predict.
I like this.
You can not predict the future no matter what tools you use. If it could be done it would have been done by now. Spending a lot of time trying to 'perfect' your predictive tools is therefore time wasted imho. Makes for entertaining reading though..Is TA a viable tool for predicting future prices?
If so, why?
If not, why not?
What alternatives are there and are they any better?
(forget tainting the thread with money management and regurgitated lines borrowed from books)
I am interested in what people think or believe.
You can not predict the future no matter what tools you use. If it could be done it would have been done by now. Spending a lot of time trying to 'perfect' your predictive tools is therefore time wasted imho. Makes for entertaining reading though..
Some people have the skill to chart-read by forward-thinking of likely events happening because those same patterns have occurred in the past. This is the theory of all forward looking methodologies. Some people like to call it predictions. But they are simply modeling patterns of likely events that might or might not take place.
But in reality, every ‘systematic’ trade placed is literally ‘predicting’ the market, because of the belief that the past will repeat into the future. If not you wouldn’t place the trade.
I don’t think there are to many dart throwers amongst us.
BTW…fundamentals and fundamental analysis is the only thing that will make you wealthy in the market.
Technical analysis is at its best; only good for lifestyle choices and achieving an income. Sadly most traders using technical analysis would be lucky to be making more money than if they were working for someone else.
Just my view
Frank Dilernia
So W.D Gann was a lier and he wasted his whole life learning to predict markets accurately.
You may have noticed I used the word "TOOL". (see red) Yes, which is why I started the thread on PREDICTION.Techniques don't predict the future, people try to and no-one can...it's just not possible...my unshakable belief. I think there are people who make bets, get it right and say, "see, I told you I knew what would happen!". Some people are better guessers than others. Betting with probabilities is not prediciting the future.
Biased?I actually don't believe there is anything better for trading the stock market for retail level investors than technical analysis. Fundamental analysis is too time consuming and you're too distanced from where the real wheeling and dealing happens to stand a chance at getting it right. I don't care for a discussion about why I'm wrong...I believe it and am not currently at a place in time where I'm willing to accept counter arguements, sorry.
So your philosophy is disclosed. Thanks.The only superior alternative to technical analysis IMO is macro economic analysis...in other words, the big picture. The stuff that Richard Farleigh made his fortune doing. But even he describes using what I interpret to have been a rudimentary form of trend analysis to make sure that he was getting with the herd. The big picture analysis helps you identify imbalances and build theories about what trends could occur and trend analysis tells what trends are occuring.
You can not predict the future no matter what tools you use. If it could be done it would have been done by now. Spending a lot of time trying to 'perfect' your predictive tools is therefore time wasted imho. Makes for entertaining reading though..
Motorway put it best I think.
Technically we Anticipate rather than predict.
I like this.
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