Religious leader condemns RAPE

[Hershy]

I was once told that the origin of women covering their faces and to some extent virtually hiding their bodies was a caliph aflicted with pathological jealousy who has decreed that all his wives cover up when in public. Then the fashion spread to all corners of the caliphate. And with the spread of Islam, went the habit.
And let's not forget that the vestments that nuns wear are derivatives.

 

[2020hindsight]

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[2020hindsight]

And now for today's sermon ... By Sheik THENARDIER
http://www.lyricsdownload.com/les-miserables-dog-eat-dog-the-sewers-lyrics.html
"It's a world where the dog eats the dog
Where they kill for bones in the street
And God in His Heaven
He don't interfere
'Cause he's dead as the stiffs at my feet
I raise my eyes to see the heavens
And only the moon looks down
The harvest moon shines down!"
PS Thenardier is rarely put forward as an example of an honourable character But he has this marvellous way of comparing the world with hungry animals.

 

[new girl]

Newgirl - its called brainstorming , we feed on each others ideas around here the ABC call it type back radio i think. I was of course responding to your challenge (whether I realised it or not) :-



It was your idea this concept of this sexy singlet dude
and so vulnerable that women in an instant saw him nude
the TEMPTATION there to TACKLE him and HAVE YOUR WAY - so kissible -
...
I just added "brickies cleavage" - just to make him irresissible

This is my pathetic and sad attempt to use the right side of my brain. Being an engineer, I mainly use a keyboard and the computer does the rest (both sides of brain on permanent holiday, broker notified).

So out of pure jealousy, of you 2020, I decided to step out of my comfort zone and risk making a fool of myself. Here I go:

A fatwa was declared for sexy dudes to cover up; does this Mufti have a clue??
OH NO! Take off your shirts boys, preferably the singlets too!!
Don’t worry, no cats in sight, they’re on pillow-cased veggies now
It’s only us poor girls, waiting, hoping, feeling...oh…so… blue.

PS: English is my second language; please direct all complaints/insults towards English teacher. Hell you can even blame the Mufti.

 

[Happy]

From ABC, October 30, 2006. 9:47am (AEDT)

Sheikh will step aside, Muslim colleague says

An open letter has been sent to senior Sydney Muslim cleric Sheikh Taj El-din Al Hilaly, asking him to step aside from his position as the leader of Australia's largest Muslim congregation.

Last night a meeting was held behind closed doors by the Lebanese Muslim Association (LMA), which runs the main mosque in Sydney's south-west.

Already Sheikh Al Hilaly has been asked not to preach for three months, after it was revealed he had compared some women to uncovered meat during a sermon.

Dr Jamal Rifi is a close friend of the Sheikh and founder of Muslim Doctors Against Violence.
Dr Rifi sent the letter and says he thinks the Sheikh will step aside.
"I have no doubt whatsoever," he said.

"He knows where I stand, he knows where he stands and he has no option whatsoever but to put the interests of the community and society."

Not definite yet, but he will be probably persuaded to wait aside for dust to settle down

From ABC, Sunday, October 29, 2006. 7:47pm (AEDT)

Labor's 1980s Al Hilaly decision 'blatantly political'

The Prime Minister John Howard says a 1986 decision not to deport the Sydney Muslim cleric, Sheikh Taj el-Din Al Hilaly, was blatantly political.
Mr Howard has again called on the Muslim community to resolve the furore surrounding the sheikh's comments about women and sexual assault.
Sheikh Al Hilaly likened scantily clad women to uncovered meat, and then expressed a wish to rid the world of the White House.
Labor has been accused of preventing the sheikh's deportation in 1986 to avoid angering Muslim voters.
But Mr Howard says he is not dwelling on it.
"Plainly the Hawke government at the time took a blatantly political decision," he said.
"But it has happened now and he has rights as an Australian citizen."
The Labor leader Kim Beazley says the sheikh must be sacked.
"This is a bloke who should go, as simple as that," he said.
Mr Beazley says the decision of 20 years ago is irrelevant.
"We all carry our baggage in politics, all of us, the Labor Party and the Liberal Party," he said.
"We all have to live with that.
"The question is what do we intend to do? What do you intend to do about this situation now, what do you intend to do in the future?"

Imagine how many were guided by his preaching and possibly influenced since 1986 when he was almost deported?

 

[2020hindsight]

Good one newgirl you's a poet lol.
I liked the one (what's her name divine's column yesterday - most of her articles are seriously prejudiced - but this was surprisingly tame - even discussing the option of Sheik AH staying , "the devil you know etc". Yet again I think not too many would agree with her.

BUT she points out that gang rape of one of the girls was when she was dressed in her best suit - just been to a job interview.
Also that one of the fathers said " if these girls just STAYED HOME at night, then there wouldn't be any of these problems and my boys wouldnt be in trouble.

I was wondering - perhaps someone should explain to that father.... "Perhaps if your boys stayed home, then the rest of us Australians females and (civilised) males (by which I mean the ones that are a few steps up from the concepts of night clubbing with a real club)- could get on with what they like doing - VIVE LIFE!.

PS I was also wondering - if the sight of girls in bikinis is so heathen to this bloke, then presumably his followers wont be interested in going to the beach this summer - Cronulla for instance.

LATE EXTRA _ NICE POST HAPPY :bier:
Say can my daughter come out of hiding now?:couch
maybe we can even go to the beach showing some skin ? lolesok:

 

[nioka]

News just in . The sheik has collapsed at the Lakembla mosque and is being worked on ny paramedics???????

 

[Happy]

From ABC, November 1, 2006. 7:00am (AEDT)
Amnesty chief says Sheikh doesn't deserve to lead Muslims

Amnesty International's first female Muslim secretary-general, Irene Khan, says a Sydney Islamic cleric does not deserve the privilege of leadership after a comment comparing some women to "uncovered meat".
Ms Khan says Sheikh Taj el-Din Al Hilaly's views are not representative of the majority of Muslim people and it is up to Muslim communities to take action.
She told ABC TV's Lateline program says it is time for the debate to move on.
"I think people like him should not be given the privilege of being considered as leaders," she said.
"Because the question on part of the Muslim community - and there is a question on the part of the larger community - as to how much space do you give to views that reflect only a very narrow part of the community?"
She says Muslim communities should take their own action.
"I think a lot of the responsibility lies with the Muslim communities themselves and they need to rise to that responsibility here and take action," she said.
"At the same time the Government should not target or demonise the Muslim community itself because of what one individual is saying and there is a sense among the Muslims that this man does not represent them any more than [former One Nation MP] Pauline Hanson represented Australian views."

Actually this is what is needed, some comments from Muslim community.

 

[Happy]

From Yahoo7,


Wednesday November 1, 02:41 PM

Police 'won't tolerate' rally violence

NSW Police Minister John Watkins says authorities will not tolerate violent behaviour at rallies held in support of embattled Sheik Taj Aldin Alhilali.
The sheik has been under pressure to resign after he compared scantily clad women to uncovered meat, saying they invited sexual assault.
Supporters of Sheik Alhilali plan to rally outside Sydney's Lakemba mosque in Sydney's south-west on Saturday.
The minister briefed police commissioner Ken Moroney on preparations for the rally and another possible rally on Friday.
Mr Watkins later said rally organisers planned peaceful protests but police would have sufficient resources in place to deal with any outbreaks of violence.
"Police will do their job on Friday or Saturday," he told reporters.
"They'll be there in numbers. If there's anti-social or criminal behaviour they will take action. There is no place for a softly, softly approach here."
Sheik Alhilali was released from Canterbury Hospital after collapsing on Monday with chest pains.

Why rally?

 

[Happy]

From ABC, November 1, 2006

Large police presence expected at Al Hilaly rally


Police are expected to turn out in force at a rally to support the controversial Muslim cleric Taj el-Din Al Hilaly later this week.
Organisers say it will be a peaceful protest, but authorities are taking no chances.
The Government admits it will be a test for police after recent reports showing failures during last year's Cronulla riots.
After two days in hospital, Sheikh Al Hilaly's family gathered up the many flowers sent by well-wishers while the mufti slipped out a side entrance.
His supporters are planning a rally in the shadow of Lakemba Mosque, at Parry Park on Saturday.
Like in the build-up to the Cronulla riots and reprisal attacks, text messages are being used to spread the word, reading: "Get prepared! Peaceful protest in support of Mufti Al Hilaly. This is a critical day to show our solidarity and to silence the hypocrites!"
Police are preparing for unrest either at the rally, at the popular Friday prayers, or both.
New South Wales Police Minister John Watkins has issued a public warning.
"The police will be there in numbers and they will take action if there's any antisocial behaviour or criminal behaviour," he said. "If that is your intention do not come.
"There is no place for a softly softly approach here, and I've made that clear in my discussions with the Commissioner and the Deputy Commissioner."
But that confidence isn't shared by everyone after well-documented failures at Cronulla.
New South Wales Liberal leader Peter Debnam says it is critical that police have the resources they need to monitor the situation.
The president of the Islamic Friendship Association of Australia, Keysar Trad, says he believes the protest will be peaceful.
"We don't believe that anything will go wrong, we certainly hope that nothing will go wrong," he said.
While the sheikh has not decided if he will join his supporters at the protest, his critics continue to grow in number.
Amnesty International has urged the Muslim community to abandon the sheikh.
Sheikh Al Hilaly is still deciding if he will save them the trouble.

Part of SMS message is disturbing -

This is a critical day to show our solidarity and to silence the hypocrites!"

Some people have more nerve in making questionable statements.

This is another example of one nation with them and us.
Does multicultural society really work?

 

[insider]

"uncovered meat" LMFAO... I'm offended that the retard also suggests that men are like animals that can't control their urges... You can tell he ain't getting any ... Did you know that his comments were all over international television... even in Brazil which is 99 percent catholic. Let me finish off with saying he certainly doesn't speak for me and certainly not for my muslim buddies... HAPPY TRADING

 

[robert toms]

I am certainly offended by the comments by the Muslim spiritual leader.He is trying to deprive us grandfathers of a free daily peep show.There is not much for free these days and now he is threatening our happiness!
The best things in life are free ,or thats what we are told.

 

[insider]

I think he just needs a hobby! :

 

[Happy]

From ABC, November 2, 2006

Howard urges Muslim community to resolve Sheikh row


Prime Minister John Howard has expressed frustration the Muslim community has not resolved the situation with Sheikh Taj el-Din Al Hilaly.
The Sheikh has been criticised for his comments referring to the way women dress and comparing them to "uncovered meat".
He was taken to hospital on Monday after falling ill during a meeting about his future.
Mr Howard has told Sky television that the community is harming itself by failing to make the Sheikh's future clear.
"I've said repeatedly and I have to say it again, that unless this matter is resolved - and time is running out to resolve it - there will be left a sadly diminished view of the willingness of the Islamic community to integrate into the broader Australian community," he said.

Stalling tactics somehow ring the bell; this must be their norm.


Rally is going to be there merely to give proof, that he is loved so much that he will not be allowed to go, by popular demand.

Hope John and the crew have thought on few solutions, and hope they didn’t leave it for too long to get resolved by the community.

 

[nioka]

I think he just needs a hobby! :

Deep sea diving? very deep sea!!!

 

[Out Too Soon]

Something has been bugging me about this thread, "Religous Leader Condemns rape". Actually he condones rape on the grounds that his supporters it seems can't control there more base sexual urges.
Really religous leaders of all persuasions should stick to there field of expertise (which is not sex).

 

[Sean K]

Something has been bugging me about this thread, "Religous Leader Condemns rape". Actually he condones rape on the grounds that his supporters it seems can't control there more base sexual urges.
Really religous leaders of all persuasions should stick to there field of expertise (which is not sex).

I was thinking that too OTS.

 

[Happy]

From SBS


ASKING FOR IT

Sydney Muslim leader Sheikh Taj Eldine Elhilali has sparked outrage by saying women invite rape by dressing provocatively.

Members of the powerful Lebanese Muslim Association have fiercely condemned Elhilali’s comments, and some Muslim women have been quick to express their anger.

However, large sections of Sydney's Islamic community hosted a meeting on 3 November in support of the cleric.

Australia’s highest profile Muslim cleric says his words have been misinterpreted, but his critics claim they demonstrate a failure to understand Australian culture. So who does speak for Australia’s Muslims, and is Peter Costello right when he says Elhilali's community has tolerated him for far too long?

Our forum guests include Muslim women who support Elhilali, and those who think he should be sacked. They talk about the role of Muslim women and the way they’re viewed by other Australians.

“ASKING FOR IT” will be broadcast on SBS TV on Tuesday 7th November at 7.30pm. The program is repeated on Fridays at 1.00pm and Mondays at 2.00pm.

Debate bit provocative, both sides seem to have dug in and were just defending their position.

Only few voices said how it is, that –lack of appropriate dress provocation- is deeply entrenched in first generation migrant’s minds.

It’ll take bit longer for some women to liberate and be equal.


Best comment?:

-If dress is sign of modesty, why only women are obliged to dress appropriately and cover faces too?-



Anybody interested might see “ASKING FOR IT” on SBS TV, as it will be repeated on Friday 10 Nov at 1.00pm and Monday 13 Nov at 2.00pm.

 

[Rafa]

i felt sorry for the woman they who spoke close to the end...

pretty much she said muslim women like her are stuck between a rock and a hard place...

on one hand they have muslim men forcing them to wear the hijab, and on the other hand they are not getting the REAL support of the general australian community to stop wearing it...

its seems to be more a game of politics at the moment...

the final comment was most interesting when another woman said there are plenty of dissenting voices amongst the muslim community, but they don't make good news stories...!!!

the quotes of crazy sensationalist muslim clerics make for lot better headlines.


all in all, a very intersting program none the less...

 

[Happy]

Last part of transcript which can be found on –

http://news.sbs.com.au/insight/trans.php

From SBS



JENNY BROCKIE: Randa, why haven't we heard that many voices, women's voices, speaking out about this? We have tonight which is terrific that we've had a real debate here tonight about what's going on, but why aren't people speaking out more, Muslim women, speaking out more?


RANDA ABDEL-FATTAN: This is often - this question is often posed to the Muslim community. Why aren't more moderate voices being heard when it comes to condemning terrorism, when it comes to the status of women in Islam. The point is that there are many voices out there but they're not the voices that usually get the headlines because they're not sexy enough for the media. Sheikh Omran is good, but there are many other Sheikhs who could have spoken out eloquently, about this issue but he provides a lot more entertainment value and…


JENNY BROCKIE: Do you think he's in touch with the view of people like you?
RANDA ABDEL-FATTAN: He is but he doesn't express it very well. I don't see the benefit in having someone - I'm sorry, I just feel that we have such a public relations campaign, such problems, people who can communicate effectively is what is needed in our community. There are moderate voices but they're just not being heard enough.


JENNY BROCKIE: Joe?


JOSEPH WAKIM: I think that ironically what happens here is that when people are told too integrate, that's often when they stop integrating. I think that if the PM handled this differently and said say “I've got full faith in the leadership of the Islamic community in Australia, they'll hand this well," but people's dignity has been insulted.


JENNY BROCKIE: Shakira, a final comment from you, what do you think needs to happen now?


SHAKIRA HUSSEIN: I think what needs to happen is people need to recognise, Muslims and noon Muslims that Muslim women are being done over twice. They being done over because they are the object of the kind of vilification that's been directed at the community as a whole and I'm sorry, Keysar Trad but they are also being done over because too many Muslim men are using racism as an excuse for not dealing with appropriately, because there is a media beat up, then that's an excuse for just going away and saying the poor man, he's being vilified, character assassination, let's just let it all pass.


JENNY BROCKIE: Irene a quick final comment from you, what do you think about what was said. Is that right, are people not speaking out and not having a debate about the real issues because they feel defensive?


IRENE KHAN: What I find rather sad is the way in which we are so keen to see what differentiates us rather than what brings us together. There's lot of talk about Australian values and about Muslim values but I think what is common about us is thing that I would call values of human rights and human dignity that needs to come into play here so that there can be more mutual respect and understanding on both sides. Without that, I'm afraid things will get worse. I would like to see leaders like the PM emphasise those global values and try to bring communities together.


JENNY BROCKIE: All right all right. A good note to end. I'd like to thank everybody very much for joining this discuss tonight. Terrific to have you all here and thank you Irene Khan in London and thank you Sheikh Omran in Melbourne.