Poll on Action on Global Warming

[2020hindsight]

It's been a bit over a year since we had a poll on GW.
I was wondering if people's attitudes have changed.

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9058

a) there is no reliable evidence that indicates global warming (GW)

b) there is GW, but the manmade contribution is UNPROVEN (brd),- and we should ignore it

c) there is GW, the manmade contribution is PROVEN (brd), but the matter is not urgent – ignore it

d) whether AGW or even GW is proven or not - we should act to reduce greenhouse gas effects anyway – starting with a 5% commitment now, increasing to 15% when USA, China and India come on board

e) ditto but with significantly higher cuts to CO2e output.

f) other (plus reasons)


Another way to ask this I guess is (adapted from previous poll) :-

a) are you where Johnny Howard was 4months before the election?
b) are you where Johnny Howard was 3 months before the election?
c) are you where Johnny Howard was 2 months before the election?
d) are you where Johnny Howard was 1 months before the election?

and/or (working backwards) …
d) are you where Kevin Rudd is now?
e) are you where Kevin Rudd was 12 months ago ?

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

It's been a bit over a year since we had a poll on GW.
I was wondering if people's attitudes have changed.

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9058

a) there is no reliable evidence that indicates global warming (GW)

b) there is GW, but the manmade contribution is UNPROVEN (brd),- and we should ignore it

c) there is GW, the manmade contribution is PROVEN (brd), but the matter is not urgent – ignore it

d) whether AGW or even GW is proven or not - we should act to reduce greenhouse gas effects anyway – starting with a 5% commitment now, increasing to 15% when USA, China and India come on board

e) ditto but with significantly higher cuts to CO2e output.

f) other (plus reasons)


Another way to ask this I guess is (adapted from previous poll) :-

a) are you where Johnny Howard was 4months before the election?
b) are you where Johnny Howard was 3 months before the election?
c) are you where Johnny Howard was 2 months before the election?
d) are you where Johnny Howard was 1 months before the election?

and/or (working backwards) …
d) are you where Kevin Rudd is now?
e) are you where Kevin Rudd was 12 months ago ?

Its weather mate, you are getting hammered by science.

Don't do a Kev and have another bloody inquiry.

Back to the Weather thread.

gg

 

[2020hindsight]

gg
I think it's fair to say that the talk of recession has had an effect - on everyone (ASF members, pollies, the works). It's had a significant effect on the drafts of Garnaut's reports as well.

Just curious if people's vote has changed.

Poll closes in 6 weeks btw. (about end Jan)

... getting hammered by science.

lol - well one of us is thats for sure .
And I don't recall a single scientific comment you've made lol

 

[2020hindsight]

btw, options d) and e) (= Action and ACTION!! respectively ) differ slightly from the previous poll - pooling all those who want action whether or not every "t" in the science is crossed or not. - i.e. maybe it's just the wise cautious option in your opinion

 

[Panacea]

d) whether AGW or even GW is proven or not - we should act to reduce greenhouse gas effects anyway – starting with a 5% commitment now, increasing to 15% when USA, China and India come on board

This is, to me, the most reasonable position to take.

My attitude hasn't changed significantly. I would have preferred bigger targets, but I don't think Kevin Rudd had any option other than to announce the numbers he did. Anything higher would have been seen as economically irresponsible (given current circumstances), while anything lower would have been seen as a doing nothing. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

[So_Cynical]

f ) I'm where Kevin Rudd will be 3 months before the next election.

 

[wayneL]

Wrong questions.

 

[2020hindsight]

Its weather mate, you are getting hammered by science.
Don't do a Kev and have another bloody inquiry.
Back to the Weather thread. gg

sounds like, reading a couple of these answers, I should have had another option ..

"I don't understand the question"

Wrong questions

see wayne this is the problem I have with your raft of answers on this one ...

there's one question not several.
"ignore GW? -
or not"

PS I preferred your reply #22 to the previous poll on this.

 

[2020hindsight]

f ) I'm where Kevin Rudd will be 3 months before the next election.

interesting answer
might need a Danish crystal ball for that one.

Or the bigger questionmark - where will the Libs be on this 3 months before the next election?

To be fair, Labor and Libs have almost identical policies at the moment yes? (as much as you can second guess the Libs these days) - or more accurately - that has obviously been Kevin Rudd's plan - to give Malcolm Turnbull no leeway if he still wants to maintain some cred.

 

[wayneL]

see wayne this is the problem I have with your raft of answers on this one ...

there's one question not several.
"ignore GW? -
or not"

PS I preferred your reply #22 to the previous poll on this.

This is the very least of your "problems", but I digress; it is the wrong question on several fronts.

• Is there GW?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If GW is A, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• Should we ignore junk science?
• Should we prosecute promulgators of junk science as fact?
• Should Al Bore give his fraudulently obtained Nobel prize back?
• Should climate scientists declare their pecuniary interests? (Oh that would be a can of worms LOL)
• Are we moving into a cooling cycle?
• Is a new Ice Age possible?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If cooling is anthropogenic, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• etc + a million pertinent questions I haven't thought of.

 

[GumbyLearner]

This is the very least of your "problems", but I digress; it is the wrong question on several fronts.

• Is there GW?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If GW is A, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• Should we ignore junk science?
• Should we prosecute promulgators of junk science as fact?
• Should Al Bore give his fraudulently obtained Nobel prize back?
• Should climate scientists declare their pecuniary interests? (Oh that would be a can of worms LOL)
• Are we moving into a cooling cycle?
• Is a new Ice Age possible?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If cooling is anthropogenic, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• etc + a million pertinent questions I haven't thought of.

Just dont have SEX you might get fined!!!!!

:

 

[2020hindsight]

btw, thinking aloud, and given man's ability to plan ahead, - how we vote next time probably depends on the weather at the time.

- it could be that we have a La Nina (milder) weather pattern developing at the moment - a brief reprieve for a year or two maybe - which would make it pretty controversial leading into the next election. Unless people are sweating, and /or dying of (local) drought, they don't seem to want to listen.

Here's BOM on the latest state of El Niño / La Nina (ENSO index)

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/enso/

ENSO Wrap-Up
A regular commentary on the El Niño-Southern Oscillation
About El Niño & La Niña
Product Code: IDCKGEWW00

CURRENT STATUS as at 10th December 2008
Given current conditions and recent trends, the development of a La Niña during the southern summer cannot be ruled out. Some computer models do, in fact, forecast this to occur, although the majority of climate model forecasts show neutral conditions, with a cooler than normal Pacific, until the end of the southern summer.

Next update expected by 23rd December 2008 (about two weeks after this update).

A La Nina for Xmas maybe?

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/05/el-nino-global-warming/

El Niño events tend to recur every 3-8 years.

The last El Niño as of today was in 1997-98, and was the strongest or second strongest (after 1982-83, depending on what you look at) event observed in modern times. The Bureau of Meteorology (BOM) in Australia provides an Internet page on ENSO with a nice ENSO wrap-up for up-dated information.

an amusing comment, given that it's the festive season :-

As an aside, it's amusing to note that in some early papers, the opposite of El Niño was described as the 'anti-El Niño' but given the religious connotations described above, this usage did not get a lot of support …

 

[2020hindsight]

This is the very least of your "problems", but I digress; it is the wrong question on several fronts.

• Is there GW?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If GW is A, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• Should we ignore junk science?
• Should we prosecute promulgators of junk science as fact?
• Should Al Bore give his fraudulently obtained Nobel prize back?
• Should climate scientists declare their pecuniary interests? (Oh that would be a can of worms LOL)
• Are we moving into a cooling cycle?
• Is a new Ice Age possible?
• Is it anthropogenic?
• If so, to what extent?
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• Is it natural? (solar cycles etc or whatever combination of other factors)
• If so can we respond?
• If so should we respond?
• If so how should we respond?
• If cooling is anthropogenic, and we can respond, how urgent is it?
• Are there other environmental problems that should take priority?
• Should we consider all science on any of these matters, or should we ignore science that contradicts the prevailing dogma?
• etc + a million pertinent questions I haven't thought of.

gee wayne , I'd hate to be on a battlefield with you beside me ..

do we attack ?
well let's think about that ....

should we act? - knowing what we know ? - yes or no.

granted there are options given there for what action degree of cuts etc .
plus "other" if you insist.

 

[2020hindsight]

a battlefield etc

btw, this is a battlefield in one sense ...
the lives of
millions of critters and
millions of humans
are at risk.

...very real risk according to the vast majority of specialist scientists in this area.

and you want to gamble with how long you can make your shopping list of questions to think about.

PS perhaps you're gonna have to reveal your credentials wayne. That you can question them on whether we should act (at all ??) - with so much at stake.

 

[wayneL]

gee wayne , I'd hate to be on a battlefield with you beside me ..

Yer damn right, I'd shoot you in the back because you would cost us all our lives eventually.

do we attack ?
well let's think about that ....

should we act? - knowing what we know ? - yes or no.

granted there are options given there for what action degree of cuts etc .
plus "other" if you insist.

You have to know the enemy... if there is an enemy. No sense attacking the wrong one and costing you the ability to attack the right one.

eg IRAQ

 

[2020hindsight]

Yer damn right, I'd shoot you in the back because you would cost us all our lives eventually.

no wayne
I'd be defending the worlds population - and its critters

and you'd be running around in circles of ever decreasing radius lol

 

[GumbyLearner]

Now as a 20 year gromit ipso facto

Dont expect Asia to not want the Industrial Revolution that England and the USA had, but maybe we can show these fellas a thing or two where we went wrong....

www.youtube.com/watch?v=952F8OFlybc

It's not BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[wayneL]

no wayne
I'd be defending the worlds population - and its critters

and you'd be running around in circles of ever decreasing radius lol

OK, we're back to kindergarten stuff. Time for me to check out and go and find an adult conversation somewhere.

Ciao

 

[GumbyLearner]

Now time to buy some PLI!

 

[GumbyLearner]

Maybe its all garbage!! This global warming garbage.

You know what.." If the AIR gets too thick, try breathing money."

Now if that fails, why not listen to the THE FAUVES from Mornington Peninsula way.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQASn7ijbZc