NBN Rollout Scrapped

[NBNMyths]

1. I don't know what people in the city think, I don't live in one. Do you live in a country town, or are you talking for us with your city perspective?

2. I have never said that businesses will not need access to faster internet. BUT do you actually realise that there are businesses with faster access speeds than NBN?? I am sure that the entire CBA head office does not run off ADSL2. Also, why not then invest in the infrastructure to businesses only?

Why should everyone need access to 100mbit connections? This is stupidly crazy, and a waste of $40 billion plus.

1. How much income for Australia will Eastmon generate with faster internet. Show me the ROI.

2. Why does eastmon require faster than ADSL2 or multiple ADSL2 connections

3. Why should Glenn Innes receive full NBN for 1 business which will increase consumption in that area?

4. Being a regular visitor to Glenn Innes, I don't think they need faster than ADSL2 there.

What a ridiculously short-sighted response.

As I wrote, the internet is still in its infancy. In just 15 years, we have seen speeds rise from 14kbps to a typical 10,000kbps over that period.

Surely, no-one could deny the economic and social growth that has followed this rise in speeds, and all the applications that have stemmed from it?

Like it or not, the World is moving more online every day. We are doing things over the internet today that we couldn't even have imagined 20 years ago. Entertainment, business, education, medicine.

I seriously cannot believe that anyone could think that the 1,000 times increase in online speeds over the last 15 years will suddenly stop now. That we have achieved everything the internet can deliver, and there is no need to let it improve any further? That every use for it has been done already, so there's nothing out there that could take advantage of faster speeds? Surely nobody is that naive.

The rest of the World are rapidly improving their networks. Apart from all the Asian countries that are orders-of-magnitude faster than us, the US has set a target of 70% of their premises having access to 100Mbps speeds within 10 years, and the major infrastructure in every town (schools, hospitals, local govt etc) having 1Gbps. Europe is full of FTTP and fast FTTN installations. Even NZ is rolling out FTTP.

For average advertised broadband speeds, Australia ranks 17/31 in the OECD. For fibre penetration we rank 24/31. According to Akamai (an international internet download mirroring service), Australian ranks 51st in the world for actual download speeds, down 10 spots on 2 years ago.

If you think this lack of speed isn't affecting the competitiveness and productivity of our businesses, then you're crazy. The amount of data flying around the country is always increasing. Every minute spent waiting for a file is a minute of lost productivity.


As for Eastmon....Well, since their entire business revolves around the receiving of huge amounts of high-resolution digital imaging so they can print their books etc, I have no doubt that ADSL2+ wouldn't even come close to satisfying their needs.

You asked about our local production....Well, if places like Eastmon can't get decent connections, then people will just buy their photobooks etc from Singapore.

Why should everyone need access to 100mbit connections?

Why should every house have a telephone. Why not just run the phone to a couple of buildings in town?....

Imagine if you'd said to someone 60 years ago, that they should get the phone connected, because there is going to be this thing called the internet that would use your phone lines. You'll be able to sit in front of a little screen, and talk to someone on the other side of the World. You'll be able to buy things. You'll be able to look at photographs and videos. You'll be able to have a school lesson from someone on the other side of the country. You'll be able to have meetings, or remotely control machinery.

I can only be grateful that such short-sighted luddites weren't running the show when the PMG were tasked with rolling out the telephone network.

 

[medicowallet]

What a ridiculously short-sighted response.

As I wrote, the internet is still in its infancy. In just 15 years, we have seen speeds rise from 14kbps to a typical 10,000kbps over that period.

Surely, no-one could deny the economic and social growth that has followed this rise in speeds, and all the applications that have stemmed from it?

Like it or not, the World is moving more online every day. We are doing things over the internet today that we couldn't even have imagined 20 years ago. Entertainment, business, education, medicine.

I seriously cannot believe that anyone could think that the 1,000 times increase in online speeds over the last 15 years will suddenly stop now. That we have achieved everything the internet can deliver, and there is no need to let it improve any further? That every use for it has been done already, so there's nothing out there that could take advantage of faster speeds? Surely nobody is that naive.

The rest of the World are rapidly improving their networks. Apart from all the Asian countries that are orders-of-magnitude faster than us, the US has set a target of 70% of their premises having access to 100Mbps speeds within 10 years, and the major infrastructure in every town (schools, hospitals, local govt etc) having 1Gbps. Europe is full of FTTP and fast FTTN installations. Even NZ is rolling out FTTP.

For average advertised broadband speeds, Australia ranks 17/31 in the OECD. For fibre penetration we rank 24/31. According to Akamai (an international internet download mirroring service), Australian ranks 51st in the world for actual download speeds, down 10 spots on 2 years ago.

If you think this lack of speed isn't affecting the competitiveness and productivity of our businesses, then you're crazy. The amount of data flying around the country is always increasing. Every minute spent waiting for a file is a minute of lost productivity.


As for Eastmon....Well, since their entire business revolves around the receiving of huge amounts of high-resolution digital imaging so they can print their books etc, I have no doubt that ADSL2+ wouldn't even come close to satisfying their needs.

You asked about our local production....Well, if places like Eastmon can't get decent connections, then people will just buy their photobooks etc from Singapore.



Why should every house have a telephone. Why not just run the phone to a couple of buildings in town?....

Imagine if you'd said to someone 60 years ago, that they should get the phone connected, because there is going to be this thing called the internet that would use your phone lines. You'll be able to sit in front of a little screen, and talk to someone on the other side of the World. You'll be able to buy things. You'll be able to look at photographs and videos. You'll be able to have a school lesson from someone on the other side of the country. You'll be able to have meetings, or remotely control machinery.

I can only be grateful that such short-sighted luddites weren't running the show when the PMG were tasked with rolling out the telephone network.

I read this codswallop.

I saw not one example of how income for the country would be increased by faster internet, and on those lines, no where near how a ROI of $50 billion would be justified.


Keep towing the ALP line mate, at least that way you can live a wasteful, low productivity and inefficient life.

Business owners make money by being efficient, and this NBN is the least efficient way of investing $50 billion I have ever come across.

RAIL, PORTS, MANUFACTURING/VALUE ADDING.

Learn about the real world, the real economy and how things work, then come back with an attempt at an argument as to how we need FASTER speeds.


You are accusing me of discounting the advances that telephone and internet have afforded, where have I said this?

Why don't we spend $100 billion improving phone lines so that the voice sounds clearer?
Why go 100mbit, why not 1000mbit?


What medical technology do we have access to that requires greater than ADSL2?

You are aware that ADSL2 covers most of australians aren't you?

Keep up your CONSUMPTION agenda, at exactly the time the world needs to moderate consumption, but then again, you probably believe CONROY, mate, he is a complete clown, and I hope we are around in 10 years to debate any (lol) benefits the NBN will have given us.. for it will not give anywhere near what an appropriate investment of $50 billion would if the federal government was competent.

PS.

You limited understanding of reality does not comprehend that if the business grows and more people get photos developed, we will import more and send $$$ offshore.

If we spent it on manufacturing, we could keep $$ here and generate more $$$, but this is probably too complicated for you to understand.

 

[IFocus]

I love it when opinions argue with facts

Has anyone here have any idea what applications businesses use now and what they could use with greater bandwidth?

As for manufacturing you would have to compete with China labor costs...........

 

[medicowallet]

I love it when opinions argue with facts

Has anyone here have any idea what applications businesses use now and what they could use with greater bandwidth?

As for manufacturing you would have to compete with China labor costs...........

Oh I agree, what is hamstringing business at the moment?

I hope it

1. Results in export earnings.
2. Does not increase consumption.
3. Validates a $50 billion investment

As for manufacturing, we do compete on the world market eg steel. Obviously we cannot compete with everything, but to value add to commodities (just to name one thing) just makes sense.

 

[NBNMyths]

Speaking of codswallop....

You limited understanding of reality does not comprehend that if the business grows and more people get photos developed, we will import more and send $$$ offshore.

Perhaps you don't get it. Eastmon is a local producer. They are competing against the importers. If their business grows, then it will mean fewer imports, not more of them.

I am a business owner, and I know how inefficient the current network is. It costs me time and money every day, and there are plenty more like me. From the statements you are giving about the state of business connectivity in Australia, you obviously don't depend on it because the internet reality you live in is one of fairies and unicorns.

I seriously cannot believe that anyone would think that faster network speeds won't increase productivity, especially as more and more of our working lives are spend waiting for online content.

You want examples?

The business transferring media files across the country. With ADSL2+ upload speeds, a 1GB transfer takes about 10 hours. Even a reasonably basic NBN connection will reduce that to 30 minutes. There's 9.5 hours of productivity right there. I know many business people that jump in a car and drive files around rather than transfer them electronically, because it's just too slow. I do it myself quite regularly.

Imagine the savings if SMEs could have real teleconferencing, instead of the generally useless systems available now to anyone without fibre. Imagine the savings in time and money if 20% of Sydney-Melbourne meetings could take place via video, instead of wasting 4 hours flying between the offices.

What if just 5% of people could telecommute in future, thanks to reasonable data speeds (and no, ADSL2+ doesn't cut it if you have high data demands, such as an SAP system to access remotely).

Imagine 5% less traffic on the roads into the city. Imagine the gains in productivity for those people who do still have to travel. The reduced delivery times, the reduced number of trucks on the road delivering fuel (and the reduced fuel imports).

You want some more ideas? Have a read of this:
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...dband-network-20110603-1fj9j.html?from=smh_sb

and particularly this, if you don't get where a need for 100Mbps comes from:
http://technologyspectator.com.au/nbn-buzz/i-spy-100mbps

ADSL2 might cover most Australians, but that doesn't mean it delivers ADSL2 speeds. You do realise that DSL is distance-dependent, don't you? 2km from the exchange and it officially drops to pathetic.

As for the investment....Where does this constant $50 billion figure come from? You do realise that the total capex is $36bn, and $27bn is the Government investment?

I realise 50 sounds scarier than 27, but is there a reason you've made up that particular value? Why not just round it up to $100bn and be done with it?

As for spending it on manufacturing.....Look, I love Australian stuff and I buy it whenever I can. I'm actually quite passionate about it. But throwing $50bn into manufacturing in this country would be $50bn down the drain. If we want decent wages and low tariffs, then we can't compete with the likes of China for manufacturing.

If I recall correctly, the decline of manufacturing and value-adding in this country began well and truly before the ALP came to power. The Newcastle steel mills is an example that comes to mind....

That aside, you still don't seem to understand the NBN funding model. The Govt investment in the NBN is off-budget, because it's being funded by infrastructure bonds at ~5%, and repaid by revenue at ~7%. It doesn't affect the ability to invest in other projects at all. If Govt wanted to throw $50bn at ports or rail, the NBN is not standing in their way.

 

[NBNMyths]

Ohh, look. I've been going on an Eastmon and they've made an NBN video, which says everything I've been writing, but better. Medicowallet, take note:

 

[So_Cynical]

Speaking of codswallop....
Perhaps you don't get it.

I don't think there is any other conclusion to come to.

Some people see the light and others don't.

 

[IFocus]

As for manufacturing, we do compete on the world market eg steel. Obviously we cannot compete with everything, but to value add to commodities (just to name one thing) just makes sense.

You need access to cheap power which we don't have, very cheap labor, no environment rules, large population etc.

The only real manufacturing that is possible is to manufacture technology and export it like the Germans but Australia stopped thinking some time ago just go through the treads and read the intellectual analysis and facts presented..................very little.


Myths is really the only person that turns up here with any real knowledge facts and numbers and the best people can do is call him some sort of Labor supporter nothing about the issue............nothing of substance.

 

[medicowallet]

Speaking of codswallop....

Perhaps you don't get it. Eastmon is a local producer. They are competing against the importers. If their business grows, then it will mean fewer imports, not more of them.

I am a business owner, and I know how inefficient the current network is. It costs me time and money every day, and there are plenty more like me. From the statements you are giving about the state of business connectivity in Australia, you obviously don't depend on it because the internet reality you live in is one of fairies and unicorns.

I seriously cannot believe that anyone would think that faster network speeds won't increase productivity, especially as more and more of our working lives are spend waiting for online content.

You want examples?

The business transferring media files across the country. With ADSL2+ upload speeds, a 1GB transfer takes about 10 hours. Even a reasonably basic NBN connection will reduce that to 30 minutes. There's 9.5 hours of productivity right there. I know many business people that jump in a car and drive files around rather than transfer them electronically, because it's just too slow. I do it myself quite regularly.

Imagine the savings if SMEs could have real teleconferencing, instead of the generally useless systems available now to anyone without fibre. Imagine the savings in time and money if 20% of Sydney-Melbourne meetings could take place via video, instead of wasting 4 hours flying between the offices.

What if just 5% of people could telecommute in future, thanks to reasonable data speeds (and no, ADSL2+ doesn't cut it if you have high data demands, such as an SAP system to access remotely).

Imagine 5% less traffic on the roads into the city. Imagine the gains in productivity for those people who do still have to travel. The reduced delivery times, the reduced number of trucks on the road delivering fuel (and the reduced fuel imports).

You want some more ideas? Have a read of this:
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...dband-network-20110603-1fj9j.html?from=smh_sb

and particularly this, if you don't get where a need for 100Mbps comes from:
http://technologyspectator.com.au/nbn-buzz/i-spy-100mbps

ADSL2 might cover most Australians, but that doesn't mean it delivers ADSL2 speeds. You do realise that DSL is distance-dependent, don't you? 2km from the exchange and it officially drops to pathetic.

As for the investment....Where does this constant $50 billion figure come from? You do realise that the total capex is $36bn, and $27bn is the Government investment?

I realise 50 sounds scarier than 27, but is there a reason you've made up that particular value? Why not just round it up to $100bn and be done with it?

As for spending it on manufacturing.....Look, I love Australian stuff and I buy it whenever I can. I'm actually quite passionate about it. But throwing $50bn into manufacturing in this country would be $50bn down the drain. If we want decent wages and low tariffs, then we can't compete with the likes of China for manufacturing.

If I recall correctly, the decline of manufacturing and value-adding in this country began well and truly before the ALP came to power. The Newcastle steel mills is an example that comes to mind....

That aside, you still don't seem to understand the NBN funding model. The Govt investment in the NBN is off-budget, because it's being funded by infrastructure bonds at ~5%, and repaid by revenue at ~7%. It doesn't affect the ability to invest in other projects at all. If Govt wanted to throw $50bn at ports or rail, the NBN is not standing in their way.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/07/30/2968355.htm

Obviously you do not teleconference on a regular basis, I do.

I also like how they tout medical consultations over the internet, this is the biggest joke of all. How is this going to work mate? Doctors CANNOT and WILL NOT make a Dx over an internet connection.

I also note the benefits in the pathetic article you link all relate to CONSUMPTION, you have been sold a dud.

You also don't understand that Eastmon helps Australians CONSUME and does not generate any income for the country. So you are prepared to connect the entirity of Glenn Innes to NBN so that one company can avoid getting business speed internet. Sorry, but a business like that should help itself out with internet.

BS people import from overseas as opposed to dealing with locals for printing needs, AND if there was evidence to that, then you contradict yourself "WHY WOULDN'T THEY GET IT FROM CHINA THEN" lol.

Sorry champ, the cost will be $50 billion, EVERY SINGLE ALP initiative has had a massive cost blowout, and the tendering system proves that this will be the same.

$50 billion into INFRASTRUCTURE and manufacturing, as I CLEARLY pointed out but you conveniently, in your naivity of how the world works, ignored, has to come from SOMEWHERE.

Where?

Australians. Where did this $50 billion come from? NOT from people importing photo paper, frames and printing machines, but from FARMING, MINING and export industries.

But go ahead, increase CONSUMPTION, whilst credible people think of ways of increasing income.

HOW MUCH EXPORT $$ does your business generate?

Perhaps you are not aware that there is a steel industry in Australia, and a government with initiative could easily grow this back to traditional levels. We have the ore, the coal and the expertise.

And PLEASE answer me this.

WHICH BUSINESSES TRANSFER 1GB FILES ON A REGULAR BASIS?????lmao.

and then

HOW DO THESE PARTICULAR BUSINESSES GENERATE INCOME FOR AUSTRALIA?

Oh it is ok, I know you will not answer these questions, because you cannot, because there is no benefit in spending $50 billion for faster piracy, youtube and pr0n downloads.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-TA57L0kuc

 

[Knobby22]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/07/30/2968355.htm

And PLEASE answer me this.

WHICH BUSINESSES TRANSFER 1GB FILES ON A REGULAR BASIS?????lmao.

and then

HOW DO THESE PARTICULAR BUSINESSES GENERATE INCOME FOR AUSTRALIA?

Oh it is ok, I know you will not answer these questions, because you cannot, because there is no benefit in spending $50 billion for faster piracy, youtube and pr0n downloads.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-TA57L0kuc

The business I work for does.
We regularly and large files, though often we have to post them to some clients because they can't handle the download.
I am talking of architecture and engineering consulting. The new standard involves designing in 3D which is making the files absolutely massive. Our data network has had major upgrades over the last 10 years to keep up and we are finding even though we are in the CBD, that we are starting to need more bandwidth.

Of course we represent only a tiny tiny part of the economy being one on many companies involved in new buildings, new manufacturing and the mining industry. Of course all the companies we deal with would love it to take place as a lot of the works take place out of the CBD.

Two companies we deal with, Lumascape and Planet Lighting (look them up) are based in towns and are our last two lighting companies that have massive lighting exports made in Australia.

Many of my family live in the bush. They would love it also for medical and business reasons.

I hope this helps your perspective Medicowallet.

It could have been done in a different way, that is a fair argument, but its need in this large country is self evident and this is why the Coalition had a plan for a rollout also.

Hope you looked at Inside Business with Alan Kohler and NBNco today? Interesting interview.
I'm sure you are aware that Siemens have signed to deliver the network to the budget.

Just remember 20 years ago, fax machines were cutting edge. I find that hard to believe today bit it is true.


I watched his countenance closely, to see if he was not deranged ... and I was assured by other senators after he left the room that they had no confidence in it.
Reminiscence by Oliver Hampton Smith, Senator for Indiana, upon meeting Morse at the demonstration of his telegraph to the U.S. Congress in 1842.
— Oliver H. Smith

Early Indiana Trials and Sketches (1858), 413


[It would not be long] ere the whole surface of this country would be channelled for those nerves which are to diffuse, with the speed of thought, a knowledge of all that is occurring throughout the land, making, in fact, one neighborhood of the whole country.
— Samuel F. B. Morse

Samuel F.B. Morse: His Letters and Journals (1914), vol. 2, 85.

Which person was right? The Visionary or the Conservative?

The first quote reminds me of the reception that CFU ceramic fuel cells got from the Australian parliament - that is why the company is now manufacturing in Germany and on Inside Business today, was the highest rising shareprice for the week.

 

[medicowallet]

The business I work for does.
We regularly and large files, though often we have to post them to some clients because they can't handle the download.
Of course we represent only a tiny tiny part of the economy being one on many companies involved in new buildings, new manufacturing and the mining industry.

Two companies we deal with, Lumascape.

Many of my family live in the bush. They would love it also for medical and business reasons.

I hope this helps your perspective Medicowallet.

It could have been done in a different way, that is a fair argument,

Yes it should be done in a different way. If you look at my prior posts, I say we could give it to businesses, schools and hospitals. Why do we need it for home use?

I also looked up only the one business, located in a town called Brisbane.

What benefits for medical treatments and access does your family expect?

In all there is a massive waste of $50 billion, which would be much better off spent elsewhere (eg helping the backlog at ports, improving access to energy, manufacturing). You know, targetted spending to income generating areas, instead of a highly inefficient shotgun approach which will result in increased consumption.

 

[NBNMyths]

This is too easy.

You also don't understand that Eastmon helps Australians CONSUME and does not generate any income for the country. So you are prepared to connect the entirity of Glenn Innes to NBN so that one company can avoid getting business speed internet. Sorry, but a business like that should help itself out with internet.

BS people import from overseas as opposed to dealing with locals for printing needs, AND if there was evidence to that, then you contradict yourself "WHY WOULDN'T THEY GET IT FROM CHINA THEN" lol.

Sorry buddy, but it's consumption that makes the World go round. If there was no consumption, there would be no economy.

If the US weren't huge consumers, then China wouldn't be buying our iron and coal, and our economy would be cactus.

Local consumption is no different to international consumption. People work, they buy stuff, which gives jobs to other people, which let's them buy stuff to.

Consumption didn't lead to the GFC, bad debt did. You don't have to have bad debt to get increased consumption.

It's not a hard concept to grasp, surely?

HOW MUCH EXPORT $$ does your business generate?

Bugger all actually. Maybe a thousand dollars a year. But what does that matter?

WHICH BUSINESSES TRANSFER 1GB FILES ON A REGULAR BASIS?????lmao.

and then

HOW DO THESE PARTICULAR BUSINESSES GENERATE INCOME FOR AUSTRALIA?

Oh it is ok, I know you will not answer these questions, because you cannot, because there is no benefit in spending $50 billion for faster piracy, youtube and pr0n downloads.

That one is actually very easy. Pretty much anyone working with photographs, video or artwork will be sending such files around all the time. You've already had the design example given above.

About 5 minutes of decent HD video hits a GB.

Then there's still images.....The files from a Nikon D3x camera are about 140MB in size, so sending just 7 images is over a GB. How many images do you think get shot for a fashion show, as one example. Then there's artwork. For every billboard. Every brochure. Every advertisement.

Do these businesses generate income for Australia? You bet. How do you think the video and image files than make up our tourism campaigns get around? What about our film industry, particularly animation?

Australia's manufacturing industry in uncompetitive with places like China for the reasons already given: High wages, 1st-world energy prices, employment conditions, strict environmental laws, strict OH&S laws. Without watering down these things, no amount of money thrown at the industry will help them compete.

We need to reduce our dependence on mining and farming, and improve our income from technology and creation, because those are more dependent on talent than on costs alone. And they are areas where we can compete internationally, given the right infrastructure.

Oh, and you want examples of photobooks being produced overseas? Look no further than Apple's very popular iPhoto books, ordered online and delivered direct from Singapore. And yes, they are often cheaper than local places. The only thing that saves them is shipping costs.

I also like how they tout medical consultations over the internet, this is the biggest joke of all. How is this going to work mate? Doctors CANNOT and WILL NOT make a Dx over an internet connection.

I don't think anyone expects a large percentage of initial consults being done over the net. But there's certainly the opportunity to do mild/routine/followup stuff over the net if the equipment is there, or the video is good enough.

eg, off the top of my head: Regular checkups using a terminal for BP, pulse etc; Issuing repeat scripts for the pill etc; Scripts for mild illnesses. Conjunctive itis comes to mind. Got it a few weeks back, and had to drive to the Doc, spend half an hour in the waiting room, for him to spend 30 seconds looking at my eye, and another minute for him to write the Chlorsig script. There would have been no issue at all with doing that over the net, with an HD webcam letting him look at my eye. Imagine the savings in time, fuel etc if people didn't have to go to the doc for such small issues?

Australians. Where did this $50 billion come from? NOT from people importing photo paper, frames and printing machines, but from FARMING, MINING and export industries.

But go ahead, increase CONSUMPTION, whilst credible people think of ways of increasing income.

Sorry champ, the cost will be $50 billion, EVERY SINGLE ALP initiative has had a massive cost blowout, and the tendering system proves that this will be the same.

$50 billion into INFRASTRUCTURE and manufacturing, as I CLEARLY pointed out but you conveniently, in your naivity of how the world works, ignored, has to come from SOMEWHERE.

Oh OK, so the $50bn is just your personal made-up estimate basd on your obviously extensive knowledge of the telecommunications industry. I guess you must know better than KPMG or Caliburn too. And I guess the fact that all the tenders are now coming in on budget makes no impact on your assessment, since it's based solely on your seething hatred of the ALP, rather than any actual evidence? Fair enough.

 

[NBNMyths]

I watched his countenance closely, to see if he was not deranged ... and I was assured by other senators after he left the room that they had no confidence in it.
Reminiscence by Oliver Hampton Smith, Senator for Indiana, upon meeting Morse at the demonstration of his telegraph to the U.S. Congress in 1842.
”” Oliver H. Smith

Early Indiana Trials and Sketches (1858), 413


[It would not be long] ere the whole surface of this country would be channelled for those nerves which are to diffuse, with the speed of thought, a knowledge of all that is occurring throughout the land, making, in fact, one neighborhood of the whole country.
”” Samuel F. B. Morse

Samuel F.B. Morse: His Letters and Journals (1914), vol. 2, 85.

Which person was right? The Visionary or the Conservative?

The first quote reminds me of the reception that CFU ceramic fuel cells got from the Australian parliament - that is why the company is now manufacturing in Germany and on Inside Business today, was the highest rising shareprice for the week.

Plenty more where they came from:

"This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication. The device is inherently of no value to us."
- Western Union internal memo, 1876.

"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
- Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943.

"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
- Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital Equipment Corp., 1977.

But perhaps the best example is from Clifford Stoll's embarassing-in-hindsight 1995 article about the internet. Yes, this is from just 16 years ago:
http://www.newsweek.com/1995/02/26/the-internet-bah.html

With classics like:

“….Nicholas Negroponte, director of the MIT Media Lab, predicts that we'll soon buy books and newspapers straight over the Intenet. Uh, sure.”

“Then there's cyberbusiness. We're promised instant catalog shopping - just point and click for great deals. We'll order airline tickets over the network, make restaurant reservations and negotiate sales contracts. So how come my local mall does more business in an afternoon than the entire Internet handles in a month? Even if there were a trustworthy way to send money over the Internet””which there isn't””the network is missing a most essential ingredient of capitalism: salespeople.”

----

Now, does this sound familiar?

"Why should everyone need access to 100mbit connections? This is stupidly crazy, and a waste of $40 billion plus."
- Medicowallet, 2011

----

I think I'll finish with this one:

An enduring characteristic of human nature is our inability to understand and accept the rate of technological change and its impact on society.
- Professor Rod Tucker, University of Melbourne

 

[medicowallet]

I am sorry you do not understand economics.

Seriously, how do you think you do not look like a clown when you think that consumption did not cause the GFC, what else did Americans do with their $$$ borrowed from the rest of the world?


I am also sorry that you do not understand the driving force of the Australian economy and are prepared to waste $50 billion on faster internet, which 99% of people do not need, when we actually NEED at the moment, port and rail upgrades.

Certainly you live in your own little world without an understanding of WHY Australians are so wealthy.

You can live with your imported computers, and technology, which I assume your job revolves around. You can keep advocating for increased consumption,

but spare a thought for the miners, farmers and manufacturers that make goods that we export to the world to give you the money to consume.

I apologise for supporting them so that they can make us all wealthier.


THAT we do need now. 99% of people would do just fine with ADSL internet, and ADSL2 is perfectly adequate for many years to come

unless you want better gaming pings, or want to pirate movies faster.

 

[boofhead]

Where I work for export 100% of product. They require various results from a variety of tests and logs to verify integrity. Difficult to get permits (and finance) to develop industrial processes in CDBs. Ships going to various parts of the world can be difficult to get at a suitable time. High volumes require storage somewhere.

Also having major shoreholders of the comany overseas requires a lot of communication. 1500 kbit can only pump so much data. Sometimes people can't wait.

 

[So_Cynical]

I am sorry you do not understand economics.

Seriously, how do you think you do not look like a clown when you think that consumption did not cause the GFC, what else did Americans do with their $$$ borrowed from the rest of the world?

This is a little like the "guns don't kill people - people kill people" argument that the anti gun lobby is so fond of....consumption did not cause the GFC, cheap debt, greed, predatory leading and the financial creativity of the US finance industry created the GFC.

Also calling someone a clown is a clear personal attack and a sure sign your loosing the argument which of course is somewhat inevitable when any one argues against progress and human development.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Interesting that, once again, I'm having to defend myself against accusations of being some Government troll.

Why is that? Let's face facts. With very few exceptions, the only people speaking publicly against the NBN are conservative commentators and politicians. You don't find too many business groups, leaders, execs speaking against it. The IT industry, experts, the business community, the telco community are all backing the NBN, albeit sometimes with assorted qualifications.

Take off the blinkers people, turn off the AM radio, put down the Bolt column and you might see just how popular this network is with the business community.

While not agreeing with you, I will join the mob and buy some more TLS when the market crashes in 2 weeks.

It is a tulip measure, this NBN, but if there is a quid to be made from tulips, the Gumnut mob should be in the trough with IT and all the other wasters benefiting from it.

gg

 

[todster]

While not agreeing with you, I will join the mob and buy some more TLS when the market crashes in 2 weeks.

It is a tulip measure, this NBN, but if there is a quid to be made from tulips, the Gumnut mob should be in the trough with IT and all the other wasters benefiting from it.

gg

From the man who brought you NBN roll out scrapped lol

 

[NBNMyths]

I am sorry you do not understand economics.

Seriously, how do you think you do not look like a clown when you think that consumption did not cause the GFC, what else did Americans do with their $$$ borrowed from the rest of the world?

Certainly you live in your own little world without an understanding of WHY Australians are so wealthy.

You can live with your imported computers, and technology, which I assume your job revolves around. You can keep advocating for increased consumption,

but spare a thought for the miners, farmers and manufacturers that make goods that we export to the world to give you the money to consume.

I'm sorry that you don't understand the absolute ridiculousness of your own argument.

What do you think it is that drives our exports of minerals? What do you think those minerals are being used for? Are we exporting them to China, where they evaporate?

Or, are they being used to manufacture goods for consumption in places like the USA?

Without consumption, there would be no mining boom. Get it?

 

[medicowallet]

I'm sorry that you don't understand the absolute ridiculousness of your own argument.

What do you think it is that drives our exports of minerals? What do you think those minerals are being used for? Are we exporting them to China, where they evaporate?

Or, are they being used to manufacture goods for consumption in places like the USA?

Without consumption, there would be no mining boom. Get it?

Well we sure as hell don't e-mail it all to the docks do we??

No DO YOU GET that we do not have to manufacture trinkets, we only need to turn ore into steel.

Do you get that sunshine?

Of course I know that China uses our raw materials to manufacture stuff to sell to the USA and to customers of photo labs.

But what would it hurt to value add a bit to our product.... you do understand that concept, don't you?