NBN Rollout Scrapped

[orr]

What I'm saying is that politics is a game of relativities.

This government's record is that it has scaled back its commitment from before the election while the previous government has delivered very little from 6-years in office and through their rigid ideology, wasted vast sums of taxpayer money.

'
Dear Doctor I'm with you and 'good-ol' Howard era communications Minister, Richard Alston. The whole 'fandango's' only good for pornography and gambling. What's all the fuss.
For others the future seems only shrouded in mist. For you and me it's as impenetrable as concrete.

 

[drsmith]

'
Dear Doctor I'm with you and 'good-ol' Howard era communications Minister, Richard Alston. The whole 'fandango's' only good for pornography and gambling.

That stereotype has never been my position.

 

[orr]

That stereotype has never been my position.

That's good to know. But if you want to bring up past government preformance with regard to communications infrastructure, the period in which Alston was in-charge, a lost period in developing community understanding of what was on the horizon, all for the Ideological privatisation mantra. This is the reason we're stumbling, years late, toward a National 'Class A Solution" , That was only ever possible, to begin with at least, as; A socially provided platform.

The coalition has offered up some duds... It's a tradition set to continue. Thanks and congratulations to the good voter's of 'Indi' who saved us from a truly awful prospect, who'd done nothing to forward the communication interests of her constituents and bugger all of anything else as well. Viva a Democratic meritocracy free from 'Pre selected Plonkers'

 

[drsmith]

That's good to know..

It was wrong of you to suggest otherwise in the first place.

But if you want to bring up past government preformance with regard to communications infrastructure, the period in which Alston was in-charge, a lost period in developing community understanding of what was on the horizon, all for the Ideological privatisation mantra. This is the reason we're stumbling, years late, toward a National 'Class A Solution" , That was only ever possible, to begin with at least, as; A socially provided platform.

The current government is no more responsible for the Howard government than the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd government was for Hawke/Keating or Hawke/Keating for Whitlam. A new government's starting point though is the legacy of what the previous government has left.

Labor had 6-years in office to bring a policy platform to effective fruition and failed.

 

[Calliope]

Oh noes, a quote from Malcolm Turnbull in the Australian. There's some accurate objectivity right there.

The Australian's objectivity certainly infuriates you, as it did your NBN guide and mentor, Stephen Conroy.

The Oz certainly couldn't exist in Russia.

Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin tightened his control over Russia's media on Monday by dissolving the main state news agency and replacing it with an organization that is to promote Moscow's image abroad.

The move to abolish RIA Novosti and create a news agency to be known as Rossiya Segodnya is the second in two weeks strengthening Putin's hold on the media as he tries to reassert his authority after protests against his rule.

 

[NBNMyths]

The Australian's objectivity certainly infuriates you, as it did your NBN guide and mentor, Stephen Conroy.

The Oz certainly couldn't exist in Russia.

No, it doesn't infuriate me. I perfectly understand that they feel the need to push an agenda that ties with the opinions of their ever-declining readership. The last thing they want to do is start printing stories that upset their readers, so why start with the NBN?

I am confident however, that the NBN will be sending its 1s and 0s down the line long after The Australian has passed into the annals of history.

Oh, and this: http://www.zdnet.com/advance-australian-fair-1339306784/

and this http://delimiter.com.au/2012/03/27/oops/

On the upside, the Oz will indeed be compulsory reading in a few decades.... "wrong side of history" stories always make for great comedy for future generations.

 

[sydboy007]

The Australian's objectivity certainly infuriates you, as it did your NBN guide and mentor, Stephen Conroy.

The Oz certainly couldn't exist in Russia.

Objectivity is a central philosophical concept, related to reality and truth. A broad meaning of the term refers to the ability in any context to judge fairly, without bias or external influence (see journalistic objectivity); this second meaning of objectivity is sometimes used synonymously with neutrality.

It seems you don't understand the word so I though I'd help clear up your misunderstanding.

I'd argue the Oz would do very well in Russia as Rupert does not rock the boat when it's not good for business. I dare say Rupert would be quite capable of running Russia Today broadly along the lines of Fox News.

 

[Calliope]

Objectivity is a central philosophical concept, related to reality and truth. A broad meaning of the term refers to the ability in any context to judge fairly, without bias or external influence (see journalistic objectivity); this second meaning of objectivity is sometimes used synonymously with neutrality.

It seems you don't understand the word so I though I'd help clear up your misunderstanding.

Another Whiskers!

 

[sydboy007]

http://www.sortius-is-a-geek.com/fudged-numbers-abound-review/

an interesting read. major points are

..the review rewrites history by stating that only 66 000 and 82 000 total premises had been passed by June 30 2011 & 2012, even though BOTH NBN Co Corporate Plans (2012-15 and 2013-16) show that in 2011 183 000 premises had been passed in total. The 2013-16 Corporate Plan shows that 213 000 premises had been passed as of June 30 2012.

This is where much of the assumptions of a 2024 finish for an FTTP NBN come from. The worst part is that they don’t even try to hide the fact they are removing premises already passed from the figures, to the tune of 120 000 and 130 000 respectively.

The next thing fudged is the take-up rates. This would drastically affect any predictions on revenue, and we can clearly see that Turnbull’s flying monkeys have done him proud here.

Not only did they fudge the total take up rates, but also the speed tiers. Claiming that 19% of people in an area serviced by FTTP were taking up the service (overall, this is closer to 37%, and over 60% in some areas), and revising down figures for the higher plans.

...with Henry Ergas being appointed to head up the Cost/Benefit Analysis. Why? This is the same Henry Ergas who claimed we’d all have to pay $215 a month to get returns that NBN Co predicted and that any costs over $17b was unacceptable for the NBN.

I'm sure Calliope will see the Strategic review and CBA as totally objective, even though a recent Tweet has confirmed Turnbull and Russelot are "partners in brine"

I'm starting to think Don Randall didn't get a fair shake of the stick considering what Turnbull has been up to. Just standard political behaviour of jobs for mates that the ASF right only seem to think the Labor party engages in.

nb The highest cost data only NBN plans currently sit at around $130 / month for 100/40 with 1TB (terra byte) of downloads which is EXCEPTIONAL value.

 

[So_Cynical]

That stereotype has never been my position.

Doc here's a news flash...your a stereotype.

 

[sydboy007]

Doc here's a news flash...your a stereotype.

I actually find the Doc about the only centre right ASFer on here. He at least has an understanding of the NBN plans from Labor and and the LN+P which is more than I can say for most of the other right ASFers who post on this topic even though they have no knowledge of it, but feel knowledgeable enough to comment on based mostly on their ideological biases.

Lets play the ball, not the man when we comment.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Whoa everyone.

Going Troppo usually occurs after Xmas.

Let's get back to the topic.

The NBN Rollout has been scrapped.

Why is the question, and the follow on, what will replace it?

It was a silly brainfart by a government drunk on unearned money, with a need to make an impression.

It was never a goer in it's original iteration, uncosted, unfunded, no governance, with an unfair distribution to luvvie ABC suburbs, bypassing workers houses and units.

Mundingburra, in Townsville, full of hairy legged Greens of both sexes, got it first up north.

Disgraceful.

gg

 

[sydboy007]

http://www.sortius-is-a-geek.com/hybrid-fibre-farce/

If we look at the review’s “findings”, even without taking into account the technological problems, we can’t go past the redaction of prices. We cannot believe the “$100 per premises” figure earlier in the document when the actual upgrade cost and the actual cost per premises has been redacted.

One can only assume this cost is far higher than the Liberal party would wish us to see. This is all without including ANY cost of the actual network. In fact, the review clearly states that only renegotiation would be required to get this HFC farce off the ground.

One can only assume this cost is far higher than the Liberal party would wish us to see. This is all without including ANY cost of the actual network. In fact, the review clearly states that only renegotiation would be required to get this HFC farce off the ground.

One would assume that Foxtel aren’t just going to shut their pay TV network down to accommodate this new and unimproved NBN for free. Something that is a real possibility when we look at the review’s claims that they will attempt to open up another 70+ channels for data on the cable network.

What’s troubling is that peak speeds aren’t actually being quoted. There are examples of 3:1 ratios, minimum speeds (the 4-7Mbps figure), but no actual figures on what speeds would be offered through the HFC network.

A bigger problem is that they intend to move from 64-QAM to 256-QAM AND increase the number of channels available for HFC. Both these actions alone present some large risks, and high costs to NBN Co.

Firstly, QAM doesn’t tend to play nice once pushed into the higher numbers. Essentially, the larger your QAM constellation, the more susceptible to radio frequency interference (RFI) the system is. While HFC’s cable does actually have great shielding, the weak points in the network (notably the Optical Node and the HFC modem) that can suffer greatly from interference, especially if not shielded well.

There’s many frequency ranges that overlap with HFC, and any attempt to move from DOCSIS 3.0 (the current standard used by Telstra) to DOCSIS 3.1 pushes the top end frequencies deeper into the 3G/4G sphere (topping out at 1750Mhz). There’s cases of LTE phones distorting cable TV and causing drop outs for users.

The key with HFC networks is that they were designed to cover as many premises as possible between nodes. The current split is around 1 node to every 600 premises on the Telstra network, although much higher in areas that have Multi-Dwelling Units (MDUs). Redesigning this network will make deploying FTTN look like child’s play.

All this review is designed to do is line Rousselot’s mates at Telstra’s pockets. There is no logical reason to buy a network that the current owners don’t even want people signing up on (have you tried to sign up for Bigpond Cable or Optus Cable recently?), that one even had plans to fully dismantle by 2018 with Singtel-Optus’ Australian CEO citing:

This decision enables Optus to focus on delivering better service standards and more choice for customers through the NBN.

 

[Calliope]

Whoa everyone.

Going Troppo usually occurs after Xmas.

Let's get back to the topic.

The NBN Rollout has been scrapped.

Why is the question, and the follow on, what will replace it?

It was a silly brainfart by a government drunk on unearned money, with a need to make an impression.

It was never a goer in it's original iteration, uncosted, unfunded, no governance, with an unfair distribution to luvvie ABC suburbs, bypassing workers houses and units.

Mundingburra, in Townsville, full of hairy legged Greens of both sexes, got it first up north.

Disgraceful.

gg

You are right GG, although some on these pages are still in denial. However in the Xmas spirit we should forgive them their trespasses.

 

[So_Cynical]

Whoa everyone.

Going Troppo usually occurs after Xmas.

Let's get back to the topic.

The NBN Rollout has been scrapped.

Why is the question, and the follow on, what will replace it?

It was a silly brainfart by a government drunk on unearned money, with a need to make an impression.

It was never a goer in it's original iteration, uncosted, unfunded, no governance, with an unfair distribution to luvvie ABC suburbs, bypassing workers houses and units.

Mundingburra, in Townsville, full of hairy legged Greens of both sexes, got it first up north.

Disgraceful.

gg

(5th-February-2011) I have it on good opinion from one of my Queensland ALP contacts , that the NBN is to be "modified".

gg

Have to hand it to you gg, almost 2 years later and your right...the NBN rollout as we knew it has been pretty much been scrapped, most likely to be replaced with a half arsed assortment of mostly dated technology and a dogs breakfast of connections, nodes and anything else that's not fibre.

That's the true disgrace.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Have to hand it to you gg, almost 2 years later and your right...the NBN rollout as we knew it has been pretty much been scrapped, most likely to be replaced with a half arsed assortment of mostly dated technology and a dogs breakfast of connections, nodes and anything else that's not fibre.

That's the true disgrace.

I can hear your pain about a venture not achieved S_C , and respect your opinion.

I just don't believe it was ever affordable.

gg

 

[drsmith]

Simon Hackett on HFC in the NBN.

http://simonhackett.com/2013/12/14/hfc-in-the-nbn/

 

[overhang]

Simon Hackett on HFC in the NBN.

http://simonhackett.com/2013/12/14/hfc-in-the-nbn/

That certainly clears up many of the concerns with the HFC but still doesn't answer at all how much NBN Co intend on purchasing the HFC network for. This is critical as we're talking billions of dollars that would actually leave FTTP as the economically viable option as well as the common sense option.

On another note you're right that this is Labors fault, they had 6 years to get this network up to a position that Turnbull and the coalition couldn't make a mess of. They have now provided a cash cow for LNP mates.

What happened to Turnbull's transparency? “Plainly the NBN Co should not release the unredacted document,” Mr Turnbull said in the letter to NBN Co.
http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/govern...tails-of-strategic-review-20131217-hv60v.html

 

[sydboy007]

What happened to Turnbull's transparency? “Plainly the NBN Co should not release the unredacted document,” Mr Turnbull said in the letter to NBN Co.
http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/govern...tails-of-strategic-review-20131217-hv60v.html

I get the feeling they have maybe been honest in what they're forecasting / willing to pay in the redacted sections, which probably means the figures we've been shown don't add up.

It will be interesting to see how hardball Telstra and Optus play next year. They don't have to be as bad as Sol T, but if negotiations take over a year it's going to be further delays that the LN+P will likely try to blame on Labor.

 

[sydboy007]

http://www.zdnet.com/nbn-vdsl-trials-a-success-nbn-co-cto-7000023290/

MT will be happy.

Shame it was for a single user connection.

Maybe it should read "Single user VDSL trial via 3 to 4 year old internal copper a resounding success"

I also like how Ziggy and the NBN board are now trying to weasel out of the minimum speed guarantees.

They are obfuscating by interchanging line / sync speeds and data throughput speeds.

NBN should be able to provide minimum sync speeds easily enough. In theory these speeds should be obtainable to any server on the RSPs network ie not out onto the real internet. Most ISPs / RSPs have their own speedtest servers to show if this speed is being delivered.

NBN are trying to argue that they can't guarantee internet minimum speeds, but then no ISP does either. I may not be able to get my full line speed to 1 particular site, but I should be able to use the full line speed across multiple sites, which in a share is easy enough to do.

So the NBN should be able to guarantee minimum sync speeds, but it sounds like they are not going to even do this, whereas the current FTTP and Wireless NBN are providing guarantees of 12 / 25 / 50 / 100 depending on the plan purchased.