More Religious Nuts

wayneL · 26 June 2009

Old Mate said:
Simple logic proves that at least the Christian version of God does not exist. And it's probably only a matter of time before science proves it somehow. I'm not saying there's definately no super powerful being up there, (I don't think there is though,) I'm just saying he/she/it isn't anything like most religions claim he/she/it is.

This is the "Dude in the Sky" meme. Our Abrahamic religions have us all thinking about a separate, individual being most likely with a long white beard, floating around in the sky, tut tutting and taking notes and throwing lightning bolts around.

If there is a "God" or whatever, it could be something else, 1001 other possibilities.

One can let go of the dude in the sky meme and not be an atheist. It opens up a whole infinity of possibilities.

Green08 · 26 June 2009

Why does it have to be the guy in the sky? or a guy? or a human? or a thing? or only a thing?

Why do people need to believe in anything?

Can't they find belief in themselves?

Alot of insecure people out there.

bellenuit · 26 June 2009

Simple logic proves that at least the Christian version of God does not exist. And it's probably only a matter of time before science proves it somehow.

'fraid not. Even though I do not believe in God, from my knowledge of science, I understand that it is not possible to prove something doesn't exist. You can prove it is extremely unlikely or improbable, but you cannot prove something doesn't exist. This is something Richard Dawkins also concedes.

Old Mate · 26 June 2009

I would be interested in hearing your simple logic proving that the Christian God doesn't exist.

There's just so many contradictions and flaws in the Christian beliefs. Eg: the whole hey he's all powerful, yet he can't banish the devil and eradicate the world of all evil. Christians will reply oh it's all part of his plan or something. What does an all powerful being need a plan for? What possible contigency could occur in the future that he needs to plan for right now?

And do you remember how your parents used to tell you to be good and santa will bring you presents, but if you're bad the boogie man will come get you. Now that you're older you realise that's stuff they made up to make you behave, (hopefully) yet adult Christians buy the same BS. Be good and go to a magical perfect place and live for eternity, but if you're bad you will suffer in hell. Seriously, just think about how stupid that sounds.

Plenty of other reasons I can expand on if you like.

This is the "Dude in the Sky" meme. Our Abrahamic religions have us all thinking about a separate, individual being most likely with a long white beard, floating around in the sky, tut tutting and taking notes and throwing lightning bolts around.

If their is a "God" or whatever, it could be something else, 1001 other possibilities.

One can let go of the dude in the sky meme and not be an atheist. It opens up a whole infinity of possibilities.

A very good point Wayne.

Why does it have to be the guy in the sky? or a guy? or a human? or a thing? or only a thing?

Why do people need to believe in anything?

Can't they find belief in themselves?

Alot of insecure people out there.

My feelings exactly. Well said.

'fraid not. Even though I do not believe in God, from my knowledge of science, I understand that it is not possible to prove something doesn't exist. You can prove it is extremely unlikely or improbable, but you cannot prove something doesn't exist. This is something Richard Dawkins also concedes.

Yeah I suppose you're right actually. People need to realise that there is no need to belief in this being we refer to as God. Why do we have to go to church every Sunday and worship this supremely insecure being in order to be a good person and not be punished for all eternity?

By the way I don't mean to offend anyone in this thread, I just belive quite passionately in that religion shouldn't have a place in the world anymore.

refined silver · 26 June 2009

To prove the Christian God doesn't exist is very difficult.

To prove God doesn't exist you'd have to simultaneously search every place in the universe and if you could do this and found no God, then you'd only have shown he doesn't exist in the physical universe, which proves nothing.

The God of the Bible, or the Jewish and Christian God claims to have created the universe apart from Himself, hence he exists "outside" of the universe. (He can also enter and act inside this universe thus adding a new element -(the miraculous) to the usual governance of the physical laws of the universe.)

He also claims to consist of physically differently "stuff" to the universe. The universe is material and created, the God of the Bible claims to be immaterial (Spirit) and uncreated.

Hence to prove His non-existence is slightly beyond us at present.

A more useful line of inquiry is the historical Person of one Jesus of Nazereth or Jesus Christ. If you can prove that the physical resurrection did not occur then the whole Christian religion and all it's claims on truth come tumbling down.

Timmy · 27 June 2009

bellenuit said:
'fraid not. Even though I do not believe in God, from my knowledge of science, I understand that it is not possible to prove something doesn't exist. You can prove it is extremely unlikely or improbable, but you cannot prove something doesn't exist. This is something Richard Dawkins also concedes.

Zactly.

refined silver said:
If you can prove that the physical resurrection did not occur then the whole Christian religion and all it's claims on truth come tumbling down.

Zactly.

I mean believing in the religious claptrap because you can't prove its not right is just silly. The burden of proof is the wrong way around.

I can't really prove Teletubbies don't exist, can I? Doesn't mean I am going to spend my life waiting for the thing that can produce endless amounts of custard to manifest itself on Earth.

Mmmmmmmmmmm, custard.

inenigma · 27 June 2009

refined silver said:
Lenin, Stalin, Beria, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, tortured and murdered millions and were militant atheists.

Very poor logic to pretend religion is the root of all wrong.

You forgot Hitler.

darkside · 27 June 2009

inenigma said:
You forgot Hitler.

No he didn't forget Hitler, he chose not to include him, as Hitler justified his fight for the German people and against Jews by using Godly and Biblical reasoning.

One of his most revealing statements makes this quite clear: "Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."

Once again , as in the theme of this thread, what makes people use religion to justify torture and murder. !!!!

trainspotter · 27 June 2009

GOD does exist !!! It is called the USD. Printed on every note is "In GOD we trust" and the US dollar is currently the world's 'reserve' currency until China can get it's way. The Dollar Index fell 0.7 percent to 79.83. The restatement of Governor Zhou Xiaochuan’s proposal in March added to speculation that China will diversify its currency reserves, the world’s largest at more than $1.95 trillion. Chinese investors, the biggest foreign owners of U.S. Treasuries, reduced holdings by $4.4 billion in April to $763.5 billion after Premier Wen Jiabao expressed concern about the value of dollar assets.

beamstas · 27 June 2009

'fraid not. Even though I do not believe in God, from my knowledge of science, I understand that it is not possible to prove something doesn't exist. You can prove it is extremely unlikely or improbable, but you cannot prove something doesn't exist. This is something Richard Dawkins also concedes.

Exactly
It can't be proved gravity exists, but many people believe in it.

trainspotter · 27 June 2009

beamstas said:
Exactly
It can't be proved gravity exists, but many people believe in it.

Hmmmmm ... not sure on this one beamstas .... last time I tried to fly unaided a very peculiar thing happened ... a trip to hospital after jumping off the roof when I was 9 thinking I was Superman ... sure made me a big believer in gravity.

refined silver · 27 June 2009

darkside said:
No he didn't forget Hitler, he chose not to include him, as Hitler justified his fight for the German people and against Jews by using Godly and Biblical reasoning.

I did forget Hitler actually plus a whole host of others.

Hitler was vehemently anti-Christian, and occasionally used Christian terms when necessary to appeal to/appease certain sections of the population, just like Stalin in the middle of WWII reinstuted much of the Russian Orthodox church for a while to help rally people to a cause.

Hitler had some mystical beliefs about the Aryan nation which were actually rooted in Hinduism. The swastica is still a sacred symbol in Hinduism and is still in many temples.

beamstas · 27 June 2009

trainspotter said:
Hmmmmm ... not sure on this one beamstas .... last time I tried to fly unaided a very peculiar thing happened ... a trip to hospital after jumping off the roof when I was 9 thinking I was Superman ... sure made me a big believer in gravity.

Gravity is a theory
A theory cannot be proven until every single possible outcome for every single item in the universe has been tested. Until then we can only presume gravity is true but we cannot prove it is true.

You have proved gravity for that test!

darkside · 27 June 2009

refined silver said:
I did forget Hitler actually plus a whole host of others.

Hitler was vehemently anti-Christian, and occasionally used Christian terms when necessary to appeal to/appease certain sections of the population, just like Stalin in the middle of WWII reinstuted much of the Russian Orthodox church for a while to help rally people to a cause.

Hitler had some mystical beliefs about the Aryan nation which were actually rooted in Hinduism. The swastica is still a sacred symbol in Hinduism and is still in many temples.

WTF ,, Hitler was Anti - Christian ,,, where did you study history, as a young boy, Hitler's main goal was to become a priest not to be a meglamaniac killing all and sundry. Read the Mein Kampf so much of it uses Biblical quotes and sayings to justify his means.

Much of his philosophy came from the Bible, and more influentially, from the Christian Social movement. (The German Christian Social movement, resembles the Christian movement in America today.)

And the swastika was carved into the monestery's coat of arms that he walked past daily , it's well documented that was where he first spied it and then decided on it as a tower of strength.

trainspotter · 27 June 2009

beamstas said:
Gravity is a theory
A theory cannot be proven until every single possible outcome for every single item in the universe has been tested. Until then we can only presume gravity is true but we cannot prove it is true.

You have proved gravity for that test!

OOOOOOOOPS !! I will let Newton know his LAW OF GRAVITY is a theory and just that ... a theory. In the meantime I will give up jumping off roofs. "I reject your sense of reality and replace it with my own" springs to mind about now. HA HA !

beamstas · 27 June 2009

Here you go
http://adamkemp.newsvine.com/_news/...ature-of-science-why-gravity-is-just-a-theory

Anyway, my point still stands, relegion will never be proven or disproven, until we either A) See God, B), Search everywhere possible and still not come to a complete conclusion.

Faith has to account for the gap between.

trainspotter · 27 June 2009

So I am to suddenly believe a man called Adam Kemp that has posted HIS theory which does not agree with a universally accepted law that is fundamental for physicists to base their mathmatics on??

I am thinking that Newton's Law of Gravity has been proven pretty conclusively and adhered to by the scientists and people who inhabit this planet. Try jumping off a roof and you will get my point. This is not a test.

Religion is proven. Faith is proven. God is still yet to come to the party.

spooly74 · 27 June 2009

beamstas said:
Here you go
http://adamkemp.newsvine.com/_news/...ature-of-science-why-gravity-is-just-a-theory

A theory is the highest accolade that can be given to a scientific claim. Gravity is not a theory. It is part of our observable reality. Mant theories attempt to describe it.

The language used in that article from Adam Kemp reminds me of many Creationist arguments. They take the precise, articulate language of Science and try and use it as a weapon against itself. It's intellectually retarded.

Anyway, my point still stands, relegion will never be proven or disproven, until we either A) See God, B), Search everywhere possible and still not come to a complete conclusion.

Faith has to account for the gap between.

I see Religion, simply, as a history of people that have had faith. What's to prove?

Where does one's Faith reside?

Bobby · 27 June 2009

Re: More Religious Nut's

Joe Blow said:
Bobby, I expect ASF members to show a little more sensitivity to the beliefs of others than you have demonstrated in this post.

You may not agree with the religious views of others but that is no reason to denigrate them in this way.

One of the things I like about you Joe is that you had the guts to leave that post up & not to delete it !

Guess the reason could be The verisimilitude reasoning you have always asked of your ASF members .

Regards Bobby .

darkside · 27 June 2009

Last edited by Bobby : Today at 10:21 PM. Reason: Spelling verismilitude - ouch !

I struggled to pronounce it let alone spell it , good work !!!!!

More Religious Nuts

wayneL

VIVA LA LIBERTAD, CARAJO!

Green08

bellenuit

Old Mate

refined silver

Timmy

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inenigma

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darkside

trainspotter

beamstas

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refined silver

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darkside

trainspotter

beamstas

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spooly74

Bobby

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