Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

It's Time To Tell China To Get Nicked

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It isn’t healthy to have your officials lick another country’s shoes. Or be told that you’re chewing gum on the bottom of them.

Funny. I swear those headlines were to do with having to suck up the Liar in Chief of the world Bigleys Rogue State. Donald xxxxxxxxx Trump:):)
 
I agree with the concept that we should be manufacturing more stuff here, as long as people can afford what we produce, and for that it needs people in full time , well paying jobs.

The rise of automation and the gig economy seems to indicate that good jobs will be hard to find in the future unless something is done to reinvigorate our education system, starting with STEM skills in school and moving on to a rebuilding of TAFE trade courses in things like design and maintenance of manufacturing robots and the software that drives them.

This isn't just an anti China thing, it's pretty vital for our economy that we diversify from just digging things out of the ground and "service" jobs.
 
# Japan has committed ¥243.5 billion (A$3.54 billion) to help its manufacturers ship plants out of China.

# So far, 180 Taiwanese companies have brought manufacturing back from Mainland China, investing NT$751 billion (A$39.01 billion) on the island (of which its official name, by the way, is still the Republic of China).
One of the reasons for doing is because manufacturing in Taiwan is not affected by the US tariffs on China.

# US National Economic Council director Larry Kudlowhas said Washington should pay the moving costs of US firms bringing their manufacturing back to the US.

“I would say 100% immediate expensing across the board for plant, equipment, intellectual property, structures, renovations,” he told a television interviewer.

One leading healthcare producer in the US has identified 22 types of protective clothing and 30 drugs that should be produced in America to ensure security of supply.

The move by US companies to China (as well as Mexico and other low-wage jurisdictions) has not only seen millions of jobs disappear, but trade deficits mount.
 
India is trying to poach manufacturing. They have special economic/development zones, as their property and zoning laws are a nightmare.

Mexico is gathering steam for the US. South America could be a powerhouse if they got their sht sorted.

I do not see much manufacturing move out of China at this stage, unless there are huge incentives. China is already well established. Plus it would be at a huge cost to pick up and move. Businesses only care about the bottom line and China's environmental laws allow for greater cost cutting measures.
The only way is if this cold war gets any nastier and harsh tariffs are used.

I do think we have too many eggs in one basket. Medication pretty much all comes from China, and they can stop exporting anytime they like.
Everything around us is made in China. It's a dangerous position.
I am seeing slight shifts to Vietnam, Thailand (which is often very good quality), Indonesia, etc. Chinese goods are extremely cheap though. Alibaba has one price for Chinese and another for westerners. You can get a lot lower then the ticket prices.
 
I'm not against China but I am definitely for Australia. There's a difference there.

Of course we should be manufacturing more here, at least on the basis of an actual "level playing field" not one where some other country cheats with low wages, fails to comply with Australia, EU or similar environmental and safety laws and so on.

Tariffs as a concept to even up the balance, to counteract such cheating, seem entirely reasonable. Sure there's a cost but we're fooling ourselves if we think our current economic model is sustainable. No country has a need for ongoing "education" imports, that's immediately obvious to anyone who actually has an education, and there's a very real risk that the world moves away from fossil fuels in which case Australia's current model is close to stuffed.

So we need to diversify and we need to do so quickly, manufacturing being one thing we should be doing more of. It'll help keep the bright ones here too - there's far more opportunity for those who can and do make things happen in manufacturing than there will ever be in the low value services sector. :2twocents
 
China’s Military Is Tied to Debilitating New Cyberattack Tool
An Israeli security company said the hacking software, called Aria-body, had been deployed against governments and state-owned companies in Australia and Southeast Asia.

“We know that China is probably the single biggest source of cyberespionage coming into Australia by a very long way,” said Peter Jennings, a former Australian defense official who is the executive director of the Australian Strategic Policy Institute.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/07/world/asia/china-hacking-military-aria.html
 
LORD PATTEN: China's nasty, lying, bullying Communist regime must face the judgment of the world over the coronavirus pandemic

But what should co-operation in the future mean? We cannot simply go back to our dealings with Chinese Communists and do business as we did before.

First, there is always the inherent danger presented by Communist hostility to the truth.

Plainly, we should work, at the UN and elsewhere, with other countries in calling for a full and open expert inquiry into the causes and early dissemination of the virus. Failure to do this will hamper the fight against it today and the attempts to prevent a future occurrence.

Naturally, in a better world, the World Heath Organisation (WHO) should be the vehicle for such an inquiry. Yet there are real worries – not just on the part of President Trump – about the extent to which this body has been suborned by Beijing.

If you doubt that, just look at the way the WHO has connived with the Communist regime to freeze Taiwan – with a population of almost 24 million – out of the organisation.

We surely cannot allow China to go on preventing a free society which tells the truth from joining the WHO.

Calling for an inquiry has raised another matter which should bother us all. On January 30, the Chinese foreign minister, Wang Yi, assured his Australian counterpart, Marise Payne, that ‘the epidemic is generally preventable, controllable and curable’.

A fortnight later, China’s embassy in Canberra attacked Australia’s restrictions on travel from China as an extreme overreaction.

Yet, from late January, China had been buying and shipping huge quantities of medical supplies from Australia. What did they know but wouldn’t tell us?

It’s no surprise then that Scott Morrison, Australia’s premier, recently called for an international inquiry. This was met by threats from the Chinese ambassador in Canberra, one of his country’s new-style ‘wolf warrior diplomats’, that unless Australia gave up this idea, perhaps the Chinese would stop buying Australian goods.

This is the sort of bullying tactic we have come to expect from China. The world should denounce it for a change. As many of Australia’s friends as possible should say how much we agree with Canberra’s proposal. On trade and economic issues, we should deal with China together. China’s economic growth depends largely on Australia’s minerals.

China’s President Xi Jinping hates democracies and all that we stand for. Shortly after he became China’s dictator, he issued new instructions to his government and party officials warning of the challenge to Communism posed by the Western values of freedom and the rule of law. He called for attacks on the West’s idea of journalism, free historical inquiry, civil society and democracy.

Meanwhile, China continues to throw its weight around in the seas surrounding its coast, building military bases there and flagrantly disregarding the judgment of the Hague Tribunal on its legal maritime borders.

The world has to work together. Sure. But we cannot allow Chinese Communists to break the rules or to distort them to suit themselves.

One day this nasty and dangerous regime will go. Until then, all the friends of freedom and decency will have to be on our guard.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/...mmunist-regime-face-judgment-coronavirus.html
 
dutchie said:
Hugging China hasn’t done us any favours

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/hugging-china-hasnt-done-us-any-favours?utm_medium=email&utm_source=CampaignMonitor_Editorial&utm_campaign=WEEK 20200509 AL+CID_c6f19a07f0d57c499318c2e1bbf58f70
I agree with Douglas Murray
It isn’t healthy to have your officials lick another country’s shoes. Or be told that you’re chewing gum on the bottom of them.

It's time we did the Aussie thing and tell China to get nicked.
Click to expand...

They are our largest export destination, I think without them we would a third world country, but with them we have basically avoided a recession for a generation.
 


think of the billions of dollars this 1 port and mines bring to Australia.

As an FMG investor, I love our relationship with china.

It's funny hearing my Grandmother in-law complain about china over lunch, which was paid for by my FMG dividends, Hahaha, people often don't realise the flow of cash that feeds them.
 
dutchie said:
LORD PATTEN: China's nasty, lying, bullying Communist regime must face the judgment of the world over the coronavirus pandemic

But what should co-operation in the future mean? We cannot simply go back to our dealings with Chinese Communists and do business as we did before.

First, there is always the inherent danger presented by Communist hostility to the truth.

Plainly, we should work, at the UN and elsewhere, with other countries in calling for a full and open expert inquiry into the causes and early dissemination of the virus. Failure to do this will hamper the fight against it today and the attempts to prevent a future occurrence.

Naturally, in a better world, the World Heath Organisation (WHO) should be the vehicle for such an inquiry. Yet there are real worries – not just on the part of President Trump – about the extent to which this body has been suborned by Beijing.

If you doubt that, just look at the way the WHO has connived with the Communist regime to freeze Taiwan – with a population of almost 24 million – out of the organisation.

We surely cannot allow China to go on preventing a free society which tells the truth from joining the WHO.

Calling for an inquiry has raised another matter which should bother us all. On January 30, the Chinese foreign minister, Wang Yi, assured his Australian counterpart, Marise Payne, that ‘the epidemic is generally preventable, controllable and curable’.

A fortnight later, China’s embassy in Canberra attacked Australia’s restrictions on travel from China as an extreme overreaction.

Yet, from late January, China had been buying and shipping huge quantities of medical supplies from Australia. What did they know but wouldn’t tell us?

It’s no surprise then that Scott Morrison, Australia’s premier, recently called for an international inquiry. This was met by threats from the Chinese ambassador in Canberra, one of his country’s new-style ‘wolf warrior diplomats’, that unless Australia gave up this idea, perhaps the Chinese would stop buying Australian goods.

This is the sort of bullying tactic we have come to expect from China. The world should denounce it for a change. As many of Australia’s friends as possible should say how much we agree with Canberra’s proposal. On trade and economic issues, we should deal with China together. China’s economic growth depends largely on Australia’s minerals.

China’s President Xi Jinping hates democracies and all that we stand for. Shortly after he became China’s dictator, he issued new instructions to his government and party officials warning of the challenge to Communism posed by the Western values of freedom and the rule of law. He called for attacks on the West’s idea of journalism, free historical inquiry, civil society and democracy.

Meanwhile, China continues to throw its weight around in the seas surrounding its coast, building military bases there and flagrantly disregarding the judgment of the Hague Tribunal on its legal maritime borders.

The world has to work together. Sure. But we cannot allow Chinese Communists to break the rules or to distort them to suit themselves.

One day this nasty and dangerous regime will go. Until then, all the friends of freedom and decency will have to be on our guard.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/...mmunist-regime-face-judgment-coronavirus.html
Click to expand...
One thing that was pointed out to me was that the US(helped by the Aust Navy) controls the Persian Gulf.That is maybe where the Chinese got the idea of controlling access in the South China Sea?Is that Lord Patten the last British governor of Hong Kong?
 
Value Collector said:
They are our largest export destination, I think without them we would a third world country, but with them we have basically avoided a recession for a generation.
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I think that is very true and the very reason why we will end up in manure.
When they have finished with us, we will be thrown out with the bath water, that is kicking the can down the road big time IMO.
 
SirRumpole said:
Some pretty good evidence for what you said.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-05...ustralia-trade-tension-barley-tariff/12232426

How about banning Chinese steel in return ?
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We export far more iron than we import steel.

If we make trading with us to difficult or expensive they will simply find other markets to buy from, eg Africa.

don’t bite the hand that feeds you I say.

Africa is fast growing to be a big trading partner with China, and they have the ability to produce most of the stuff we sell.

 
Value Collector said:
don’t bite the hand that feeds you I say.
Click to expand...
Which is a great saying, until you have nothing to trade for the food.
We would be far better served developing other markets, the problem we have is we will end up just working for China, as they will end up owning the resources, e.g the Worlds largest lithium mine in Greenbushes W.A.
 
As is said China is all about the long term,and I am sure that they can remember when the western powers divided China into their own regions-regions for their exclusive exploitation.China has ensured that does not happen again.
On the Miley Cyrus (virus) -I hear Germany and France are having private conversations with China to discover more etc. Trump is playing the bellicose politics.Which has the better chance of success?
 
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