Interactive Brokers and Options trading in Australia

[Grinder]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

I had a look at Westpac from Grinder's suggestion.
Their fees seems to be better than Etrade but don't know what their service or platform is like.

Im told customer service is of high quality & very efficient for quotes, problms etc.. & their platform is web based. Can aparently do multi legs all at once. I took another look at their commish, good if you do alot of size but the % amount could maake it very costly.

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Hi,
Etrade is 0.55% comission and Westpac is 0.35%. So Westpac seems to be the cheapest for large size.
Comsec has the problem of not doing spreads online. You need to call them to do spreads which attract a higher comission.

Menage, I had a quick look at Kinetics but couldn't find their comission rate.

I have to agree with Cutz that IB seems to be the best all round broker.
I'm also looking at stock futures on the www.onechicago market which IB does deal with.
I'm also looking at doing collars using futures and options.
Although this IB security card login is frustrating the crap out of me!

 

[Menage]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Thanks Toothyfish, I found a $90 charge for a full broker but couldnt find any charges for online either. I will give them a call tomorrow but fear the reply may be that you can only trade oprions via a broker. It is beggining to look like I might have to trade Oz via IB in the US. AS a born & bred Aussie bloke this just seems incredible to me. Memory tells me the min account balance at IB is about $10k if you want to trade options, is this correct. Also how does IB handle stop losses, when I am on a run & up around fib 1.62 or above I let the profit run & really tighten up my stop losses, I just keep moving them up following my profit etc, if IB charge per change fees could be astronomical.

 

[Grinder]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Hi,
Etrade is 0.55% comission and Westpac is 0.35%. So Westpac seems to be the cheapest for large size.

It seems Westpac would work out to be one of the cheapest brokers if you were putting on spread trades with at least 20 cons per leg in size WOTM where the value is much cheaper, thus keeping you under their threshold before the 0.35% kicks in. That being said, with a % commision you would get stung much more than most brokers if you played CTM where the higher values are

 

[Menage]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Hey guys, I just spoke to Kinetic Securitirs, the online charge is $20 or 0.2% & if you utilize a full brokers services it is $35 or 0.35%. They use the IB trading platform & if I understood him correctly they are trying to become the Australian distributor for IB, he stated that if I was to have a problem on IB ring them & they will sort it out etc, they are in Sydney, I am in Perth however a 2 hour time difference is a lot better than a 12 hour difference. They didnt hit me up for min account balances ( yet) & dollars etc are held in an Oz bank which makes the entire account management thing a lot easier.
I found kinetic on the internet & have nil knowledge of their reputation so if anybody has heard anything, good or bad, I would appreciate hearing about it.

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Wow!
That sounds almost too good to be true Menage. Will definitely have to have a closer look. Thanks for the tip.

 

[cooper1308]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Wow!
That sounds almost too good to be true Menage. Will definitely have to have a closer look. Thanks for the tip.

If you have any questions in regards to Kinetic feel free to PM

Those rates are cheaper if you are a high volume trader

 

[Menage]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

cooper1308,

Sorry to sound daft, I am new to this forum & it looks like I dont have a handle on the lingo, yes i do have questions about Kinetic however what do you mean by PM you?

 

[cooper1308]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

cooper1308,

Sorry to sound daft, I am new to this forum & it looks like I dont have a handle on the lingo, yes i do have questions about Kinetic however what do you mean by PM you?

Private Message... It's ok i'll shoot you one now, just check your inbox.

Cheers

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

....With the risk of being called lazy.

I haven't been able to put a spread trade thru IB's Trader Workstation.
Do you have to do each leg of the spread manually? Is it possible to do a Bull Put spread and put a limit in the order of 20 cents?
Please just answer by saying that the platform does let you. I'll try to figure out the rest.

Aplogies for taking up your time.

 

[cutz]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Yes it does, you need to enable the Combo button.


BTW, personally i prefer legging into aussie spreads due to the sometimes wide quotes but each to their own.( Obviously depends on what you're doing)

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Found it. Thanks Cutz. Was just being lazy.

 

[cooper1308]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Yes it does, you need to enable the Combo button.


BTW, personally i prefer legging into aussie spreads due to the sometimes wide quotes but each to their own.( Obviously depends on what you're doing)

This is fine if you have an intra-day directional bias

However, MM's will charge you less in the way of spread if you combine all legs and trade as a combo. If the market stays exactly flat all day you will get a better fill as a combo as opposed to legging it.

 

[sails]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

This is fine if you have an intra-day directional bias

However, MM's will charge you less in the way of spread if you combine all legs and trade as a combo. If the market stays exactly flat all day you will get a better fill as a combo as opposed to legging it.

It really depends how greedy they are on the day - or whatever other technical name there is for it!

When entering spreads, I like to have all market depth windows displayed (thank goodness for Iress with full MD!) and watch to see if I can do better by legging it. On many occasions, I have ended up cancelling the combo and get a better price by working the order myself - most likely ended up trading with other retail traders.

That said, I usually try the combo first as I have had some good combo fills. But if the MMs are obviously not interested or I spot a better opportunity to leg it, then I'm outta there.

 

[cooper1308]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Yeah I had a beer with a couple of guys from IMC the other week. I asked the question they said they will always give better fills as a combo. Just the way their systems work..

Spot on sails.....if you are getting better fills it is almost certain that one or two of the legs is a retail punter. You can usually pick it's a retail trader if the stock darts around and the option price & volume stays static.... You'll usually only get this info from the individual legs...... very rare a retail punter is trading the exact opposite of your combo order.

It really depends how greedy they are on the day - or whatever other technical name there is for it!

When entering spreads, I like to have all market depth windows displayed (thank goodness for Iress with full MD!) and watch to see if I can do better by legging it. On many occasions, I have ended up cancelling the combo and get a better price by working the order myself - most likely ended up trading with other retail traders.

That said, I usually try the combo first as I have had some good combo fills. But if the MMs are obviously not interested or I spot a better opportunity to leg it, then I'm outta there.

 

[sails]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Yeah I had a beer with a couple of guys from IMC the other week. I asked the question they said they will always give better fills as a combo. Just the way their systems work..

Spot on sails.....if you are getting better fills it is almost certain that one or two of the legs is a retail punter. You can usually pick it's a retail trader if the stock darts around and the option price & volume stays static.... You'll usually only get this info from the individual legs...... very rare a retail punter is trading the exact opposite of your combo order.

lol, did he need some beers to start talking?...

Very difficult to get much info from MMs. Retired ones are generally more helpful. Nevertheless, actions speak louder than words and much can be gained by persistent observation of what goes on. Probably not possible if only using IB who only give one line of market depth for options.

Yes, I agree with you that it is rare for another retail trader to take the opposite side of a combo. Once a combo order is generated in Iress, I can bring up the market depth for that unique combo using the temporary ASX code that has been assigned to it for the day. Even on BHP, it is usually only me and the MMs Sometimes a MM will pop into my combo MD with a counter offer - other times it's pretty bleak. So, I watch the market depth like a hawk and will only move the combo price as far as I think is fair (plus a little to the MM so he can eat... ). After that, I either walk away from the trade or will have a go at legging in if it's a closing order.

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Once again, learnt the hard way. You should do your homework before switching brokers.
I switched all my accounts over to Westpac broking thinking their options brokerage rates was cheapr 0.35%
Turns out you can only have 10 open put contracts. Covered or Naked!
The staff are really great and say they are trying to get this changed, but it's company policy at the moment.
IB Brokers, Here I come:1luvu:!

 

[Grinder]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Don't be too hard on yourself, same thing happened to a guy I know that was or is with Westpac. He was under the impression that if he did more size he would be better off, but the .35% proved costly. Also said something about having to wait around till orders were approved or something, sounded like a whole lota nonsense to me. The big banks have no idea.

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

I found this link to broker comparisons if anyone is interested.

http://pi.infochoice.com.au/investment/onlinebroking/compare/tables/default.asp

 

[Toothyfish]

Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ

Can anyone let me know the margin requirements for IB Brokers on ASX Options. Is it like most brokers roughly being 2 X ACH requirements or is is more?

I'm new to IB brokers and am playing with their paper trading facility.
I tried doing a Bull put spread on RIO to work out margin requirements.
Sell 10 contracts $44.95 and Buy $10 contacts $44.16.

The trader workstation popped up

SELL 10 RIO Combo -0.385" YOUR ORDER IS NOT ACCEPTED. IN ORDER TO OBTAIN THE DESIRED POSITION YOUR EQUITY WITH LOAN VALUE [486686.40 AUD] MUST EXCEED THE INITIAL MARGIN [618936.16 AUD]


The margin requirement for IB can't possibly that high?