The point of the bears (most of us anyway) is not that property is a bad investment, it's that there are good times to buy and bad times to buy. Of course property can be a sterling investment.
But people who buy at the wrong time, can, and do, lose shedloads of money. The argument is that this is not a good time to buy under many circumstances. Folks in the US are learning this lesson right now. Recent buyers in regional UK and Eire are also discovering that, with further pain ahead.
Oz has had a few problems here and there as well.
The key is availability of credit. With the mortgage apocalypse in full swing, borrowing capacity everywhere will be affected, with all the knock on effects that entails.
As I've said many times, bears are only bears so they can eventually be bulls.
what does it all mean though/ You get access to easy money now or latter. Anyone get in on hedleys float?The point of the bears (most of us anyway) is not that property is a bad investment, it's that there are good times to buy and bad times to buy. Of course property can be a sterling investment.
But people who buy at the wrong time, can, and do, lose shedloads of money. The argument is that this is not a good time to buy under many circumstances. Folks in the US are learning this lesson right now. Recent buyers in regional UK and Eire are also discovering that, with further pain ahead.
Oz has had a few problems here and there as well.
The key is availability of credit. With the mortgage apocalypse in full swing, borrowing capacity everywhere will be affected, with all the knock on effects that entails.
As I've said many times, bears are only bears so they can eventually be bulls.
Bloody hell, there's more straw men here than in a corn field today.Have I missed something????
This happen's with shares as well, and usually a lot faster.
Well seeing you have invoked the comparison to shares argument, the exact same thing can be said about shares. A balanced portfolio always historically comes back up, so the only loser's are those that need or feel that they need to sell.Yes, I do understand that you can get out and in faster, but property historicaly comes back up, so the only loser's are those that need or feel that they need , to sell.
As property is a long term investment, it could be argued that any time is a good time to buy.
Dave
Dave
I'm not sure of your point here.what does it all mean though/ You get access to easy money now or latter. Anyone get in on hedleys float?
Precisely. There will come a time when Smurf is a property bull. Problem is, by that time I'll have trouble convincing anyone and will thus be in the minority once again. This forum will be chock full of property bears by then. Such is the ebb and flow of sentiment.The point of the bears (most of us anyway) is not that property is a bad investment, it's that there are good times to buy and bad times to buy. Of course property can be a sterling investment.
But people who buy at the wrong time, can, and do, lose shedloads of money. The argument is that this is not a good time to buy under many circumstances. Folks in the US are learning this lesson right now. Recent buyers in regional UK and Eire are also discovering that, with further pain ahead.
Oz has had a few problems here and there as well.
The key is availability of credit. With the mortgage apocalypse in full swing, borrowing capacity everywhere will be affected, with all the knock on effects that entails.
As I've said many times, bears are only bears so they can eventually be bulls.
A few years ago I was looking at a flat in Basingstoke UK on which the asking price was £30,000. The achievable rent at the time was £325 per month. That's a gross yield of 13%.TIMING MATTERS!
As I've said many times, bears are only bears so they can eventually be bulls.
Note: Black Star Fund's all time high system presumes the all time high is achieved following a substantial retracement; not just any old all time highThe Black Star Funds study into trend following in stocks showed that it was possible to make money in equities with a system that bought only stocks that were breaking out to new all-time-highs. I'd love to see the same study into propertyImpossible as it might be to carry out.
Today that flat is a crap investment.
As property is a long term investment, it could be argued that any time is a good time to buy.
If treated as a long term investment, it could be argued that any time is a good time to buy.
TIMING MATTERS!
Seriously, do the math on an investment property in Sydney or the middle suburbs of Hobart over the past 3+ years and it doesn't look good.
Note: Black Star Fund's all time high system presumes the all time high is achieved following a substantial retracement; not just any old all time high
It also includes exit conditions.
It also includes exit conditions.
You see why property can't be approached with charts and numbers in quite the same way as shares?
So don't buy there if your take on it suggests it's no good. It's hardly a representative sample. LOCATION MATTERS! Country, city, region, suburb, which side of the highway, which street, which end of the street, which side of the road.
Soooooooo much more to chosing a property than a graph which shows a spike in credit followed by a fall.
ASX
I think it can both on a technical and fundamental level.
Been reading for a while- first post.
Just thought I'd add my own Gen Y financially naive view on why I bought a house (could be useful to see how people who aren't "in the game" financially may think).
Two years ago it was still the same talk as today- housing unaffordability etc. etc. everybody saying how hard it was to buy a house etc. I was able to buy a 300K house on my own with a below average salary (<50K). And it is a comfortable 3 bedroom brick home, decent yard etc. basically what everyone wants as a starter (and has realistic expectations). I figured if I am able to buy this property (i.e. the bank has confidence in me repaying the loan), and most other people buying property in my age group have a much larger spending capacity (i.e. professional couples 100K+) then shouldn't the natural market tendency be for prices to increase?
Basically I couldn't see an affordability problem if a single 25YO on crap money could afford a block of land with a house on it.
As I said, probably a very naive view but I just thought why should I assume that all average earners will be able to afford to OWN a house one day without waiting for the olds to pass.
I cant understand how mortgage repayments of a 300k loan of 470 a week before any other out goings rates/food/power/car etc etc can come even come close to being affordable on a 750 a week take home pay.
I have to assume you have lodgers etc, you surely cant service that loan with no other income , when you got this loan did you tell the bank youd have rent coming in too or that it was an investment property ?
Who are you bankers ?
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