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Has the 100 year Jihad (war) begun ... ???

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It is heartening to hear the free world leaders unite as we the free world people do wish.
 
"The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil,

but by those who watch and do nothing" - Albert Einstein
 
The Western World has never been in a situation as they now face.......With the threat of terrorism and dwindling economics of income, expenditure and the almighty welfare system nobody wants to give up.

Greg Sheridan sums it up very well.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...617545125?sv=78ab13d45b438014720d6cce07338a0c

The Grand Mufti in Australia should not be demonised for his foolish comments in response to the Paris attacks. He is not remotely a supporter of justifier of terrorism. But when he nominates causes of the terror attacks as “racism, Islamophobia, curtailing freedoms through securitisation, duplicitous foreign policies and military intervention”, he validates the paranoid and exaggerated sense of Muslim grievance on which the extremists thrive.

At the same time there is well-documented crisis of governance across the Western world. No Western nation can balance its expenditures with its revenues. All are caught up in an entitlements *crisis. Health and welfare spending are ballooning, so are unsustainable deficits. The prestige of democracy is under severe attack. For most of the Cold War, millions of people in the Third World, and in communist societies, yearned to live in nations governed as well as those of the West. It is a hard argument to make to a young banker or IT worker in Shanghai now that they would be better off if their government had the resolve and technical skill of Greece or Spain.

Put this all together and it’s not quite yet a full-blown crisis of a civilisation. But there’s a great deal of trouble ahead.
 
noco said:
The Western World has never been in a situation as they now face.......With the threat of terrorism and dwindling economics of income, expenditure and the almighty welfare system nobody wants to give up.

Greg Sheridan sums it up very well.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...617545125?sv=78ab13d45b438014720d6cce07338a0c

The Grand Mufti in Australia should not be demonised for his foolish comments in response to the Paris attacks. He is not remotely a supporter of justifier of terrorism. But when he nominates causes of the terror attacks as “racism, Islamophobia, curtailing freedoms through securitisation, duplicitous foreign policies and military intervention”, he validates the paranoid and exaggerated sense of Muslim grievance on which the extremists thrive.

At the same time there is well-documented crisis of governance across the Western world. No Western nation can balance its expenditures with its revenues. All are caught up in an entitlements *crisis. Health and welfare spending are ballooning, so are unsustainable deficits. The prestige of democracy is under severe attack. For most of the Cold War, millions of people in the Third World, and in communist societies, yearned to live in nations governed as well as those of the West. It is a hard argument to make to a young banker or IT worker in Shanghai now that they would be better off if their government had the resolve and technical skill of Greece or Spain.

Put this all together and it’s not quite yet a full-blown crisis of a civilisation. But there’s a great deal of trouble ahead.
Click to expand...

".. the paranoid and exaggerated sense of Muslim grievance" :cautious:

Beside ISIS and Assad, how many foreign armies are in, over, and otherwise shoot at Syria?
How about Libya? Egypt? Yemen? The Gulf states? Iraq; Afganistan; Parkistan... Western boots and drones are all over the region so to say it's paranoia or exaggerated sense of being taken over is a bit of a nonsense.

We in Australia got our flag waving when the Chinese buy, buy, too much of our milk and farm and houses; ports and other infrastructure... Our gov't still decide what to sell or not to sell to them and we, and Uncle Sam, are worried about a takeover.

So when the Muslims kind of not see us as liberators, maybe they have some good reasons... particularly when we prop up dictators and tyrants, sell arms to them so they can keep the peace and sell us the oil... maybe they aren't being paranoid. Especially when they see smashed buildings, bomb craters and constant shootings and other things billions of dollars of hardware does to the place.

Whatever our good intentions are in Afghanistan and Iraq, our involvement there cost some 2 million Iraqi lives, displaced a few more millions, set up the growth of ISIS, putting 100 million Muslim youth in a world where there is no future, no job, no hope... where they either join some gov't military or join the terrorists or if they still have some money buy their way out of their country.

So this talk about them being angry and murderous against us for no reason, you got to be living under a rock to believe that.

----

Regarding welfare ruining economies and countries...

We really should be more critical of our gov't. That's what is expected of a democratic polity, it's not sympathies for the enemies, it's not disloyalty to the country when you question its gov't... that kind of talk beyond to North Korea and other states we don't particularly think have a good record on human rights and freedom and stuff.

If you listen to smarter people who study these stuff, they will tell you that the lessons of Vietnam for politicians and the political and business elite is that people are too powerful when they unite and demand stuff... and you can't shoot them or lock them up for peaceful protests.

So what to do?

Set up "think tanks", spread your message across all campuses and media... telling the people how great business and politicians are.

Then you make policies that weaken the people. Higher cost of education so the little idealistic graduate don't have spare time and no debt to be asking questions and organising protests. They owe a lot of money and if they lose their job, or brought to court and charged with some small violation when they protests - it's fired and move back home to the garrage with the old folks.

The rest of the working people, you make them poorer, less job security... in being poorer people will be less generous; in feeling insecure about their own economic situation they will start to question the "generosity" shown to other poor but lazy bums, and why refugees are getting free rides.

Then you buy off the media and the journalists.

No more investigative journos nosing around the shredded documents; if they want access to info and high profile interviews, play nice, ask the right questions and get that promotion that will pay off that loan and that beach house. No more images of the nasties that we do, only the nasties that our official enemies does...


It's pretty amazing
 
luutzu said:
".. the paranoid and exaggerated sense of Muslim grievance" :cautious:
Click to expand...

On the subject of arms you are absolutely right. Too many small arms flooding the Middle East, Africa and elsewhere.

What are these weapons and who is selling them ? A lot seem to be AK-47's (Kalishnikov) a Russian weapon, so unless the US is a sub agent for Russia I would not totally blame the US for the weaponisation of the world.

As for killing civilians, you have another point, but given that ISIS hide in the civilian population like the Vietcong did it seems there is little alternative apart from trying to target the terrorists as precisely as possible.

It seems that the civilians are going to be killed either way but getting as many terrorists as possible first will cut down civilian casualties in the long run.
 
SirRumpole said:
On the subject of arms you are absolutely right. Too many small arms flooding the Middle East, Africa and elsewhere.

What are these weapons and who is selling them ? A lot seem to be AK-47's (Kalishnikov) a Russian weapon, so unless the US is a sub agent for Russia I would not totally blame the US for the weaponisation of the world.

As for killing civilians, you have another point, but given that ISIS hide in the civilian population like the Vietcong did it seems there is little alternative apart from trying to target the terrorists as precisely as possible.

It seems that the civilians are going to be killed either way but getting as many terrorists as possible first will cut down civilian casualties in the long run.
Click to expand...

US, France, Israeli, Russian, and heard China is also involved. It's a literal live testing of their systems.

Heard in one of the interviews some expert was saying how after Gaddafi fell, the Mail (I think) he was working with or was controlling knew where Libyan arms were kept and as Libya was being bombarded those terrorists rush in and truck the arms back to their bases.

The allied then struck those guys and all those arms they got from Gaddafi were spread all over Africa and into ISIS. Much like how ISIS took crap load of weapons and humvees from the fleeing Iraqi army a couple years back, weapons we and the Russian and the Chinese supply to "our" "moderate" rebels/terrorists change hands. Often not at all to friendly hands.

But yea, in the end all arms dealers make a lot of money and a lot of people pay the price.

---

Heard from a few interviews that ISIS is not just the crazy religious nutjobs we see and hear about. A lot of them, a majority of them, were former Iraqi military generals and commanders who couldn't find work when the US took over and fired all Baath party members. They're not religious and are carving the region into new territories to control. In fact, they've controlled and function as a state in most areas in Iraq and Syria - that is, they tax, they provide jobs and policing and infrastructure etc. So ISIS might not be just some terrorists organisation but an actual state in the process of drawing up its borders.

As with the VC in Vietnam... bombing the population to get the bad guys will not win you hearts and mind. From stories I heard and stuff I read about how the VC operates... they can kill people and win the entire village over, the US and the South can't do it.

So the VC would move into a village, talk to the village elders and if he refuse to cooperate they shoot him dead. They then tell the people that foreigners and its puppets are taking over the Motherland.. and if you stand up to argue or think about it you disappear too. Soon pretty much all people who weren't convinced become convinced.

It didn't help that many in the South were also corrupt and the Americans use chemical and napalm and carpet bomb the dam place to heck.

So unless our aim in the region is to forced Russia and other states to support their proxy and go bankrupt, that and testing new weapons and destroy the entire place... we're not going to win this war. Why? Because we can go home and they're already at home.

As to bankruptcy... Saudi Arabia aren't doing so well with the halving of oil and its wars in Yemen etc., we in the West spend hundreds of millions there and about the same here at home on metadata, anti-terrorism efforts, arming our domestic security forces... and the enemy can just sit and wait while we burn cash every day.

This is how you win battles but lose the war... and on top of it, China and India is rising; South American states are pushing American influence and join powers like China and India.

The only way to stop this madness is the people. But if we buy into this good versus evil, Islam is bad and us Democracy good... things will go on as they are, will get worst, and a lot of innocent Muslims will die and some of us will also be collateral damages. The crazies from both side don't see human lives and suffering, all they see is their grand strategy of remaking the world or owning it.
 
luutzu said:
The only way to stop this madness is the people. But if we buy into this good versus evil, Islam is bad and us Democracy good... things will go on as they are, will get worst, and a lot of innocent Muslims will die and some of us will also be collateral damages. The crazies from both side don't see human lives and suffering, all they see is their grand strategy of remaking the world or owning it.
Click to expand...

Yes a lot of innocent Muslims will die, just like a lot of innocent Britons and others did in WW2.

I have a feeling that now that ISIS made the stupid blunder of attacking a Russian airliner that the Russians won't stop until ISIS is all dead, regardless of whether there will be anything left worth governing.

Just shows how crazy ISIS is, as crazy as Hitler when he attacked Russia. If he didn't do that he may well have won WW2.
 
SirRumpole said:
Yes a lot of innocent Muslims will die, just like a lot of innocent Britons and others did in WW2.

I have a feeling that now that ISIS made the stupid blunder of attacking a Russian airliner that the Russians won't stop until ISIS is all dead, regardless of whether there will be anything left worth governing.

Just shows how crazy ISIS is, as crazy as Hitler when he attacked Russia. If he didn't do that he may well have won WW2.
Click to expand...

Sir Rumpy, take luutzu with a handful of salt.....

Anyways...

The problem is, there is a holy book called the Quran (a man made fantasy tale, much like the Bible).

In that book, there is concise, explicit violent (+ sexual) text to harm others (among other stuff). This fantasy book was transcribed some ~1500 years ago to someone from a man called Mohammed (Mohammed was illiterate and 40 years of age when this happened), who got his revelation from an angel called Gabriel....

Do something like that nowadays and you'd be locked up in the nut house, but because it's religion, it's a'ok....

Question Mohammad - death
Criticize Mohammad - death
Draw Mohammad - death
...you get the picture...

Think l'm kidding...

Saudi court sentences poet to death for renouncing Islam​

A Palestinian poet and leading member of Saudi Arabia’s nascent contemporary art scene has been sentenced to death for renouncing Islam.

A Saudi court on Tuesday ordered the execution of Ashraf Fayadh, who has curated art shows in Jeddah and at the Venice Biennale. The poet, who said he did not have legal representation, was given 30 days to appeal against the ruling.

Fayadh, 35, a key member of the British-Saudi art organisation Edge of Arabia, was originally sentenced to four years in prison and 800 lashes by the general court in Abha, a city in the south-west of the ultraconservative kingdom, in May 2014.

But after his appeal was dismissed he was retried last month and a new panel of judges ruled that his repentance did not prevent his execution.

“I was really shocked but it was expected, though I didn’t do anything that deserves death,” Fayadh told the Guardian.


Click to expand...
 
Just think how happy we would all be now, if Diana and Dodi had wed. A real East meets West romance ;)
 
it is funny, well actually sad, how Luutzu managed to play again his story of:
these poor muslims (or should I say refugees? I am confused) are killing the infidels as they have seen their country bombed out by the US/russia/you name itt;
after an attack in Mali, he managed to put the blame on the west getting rid of kadhafi;
Unique!!!!
sadly, the attackers were most probably Nigerians led who have never been bombed by any western country, but that should not stop a good story, so let's make one.
Just in case the obvious was too easy to see?
 
DB008 said:
+1

That ISIS funny. The English would never let an Arab into their Royal bloodline...
Click to expand...

The Arab wouldn't be in the Royal bloodlines. Diana had done her job by then and if she had married Fayed she would have been completely ignored by the rest of the Royals, and any children she may have had by Fayed would have had no claim on the throne.
 
SirRumpole said:
The Arab wouldn't be in the Royal bloodlines. Diana had done her job by then and if she had married Fayed she would have been completely ignored by the rest of the Royals, and any children she may have had by Fayed would have had no claim on the throne.
Click to expand...

Have you not heard of Bukes peerage? It was a pun. And it was taken as a pun. A witticism if you will. ;)
 
SirRumpole said:
Yes a lot of innocent Muslims will die, just like a lot of innocent Britons and others did in WW2.

I have a feeling that now that ISIS made the stupid blunder of attacking a Russian airliner that the Russians won't stop until ISIS is all dead, regardless of whether there will be anything left worth governing.

Just shows how crazy ISIS is, as crazy as Hitler when he attacked Russia. If he didn't do that he may well have won WW2.
Click to expand...

Let's hope ISIS disappear real quick. But the problem with all these is once ISIS is gone, another group will pop up. Just like how Al Qaeda was mostly gone, then some other groups then came ISIS.

Heard this journalist on Democracy Now saying how the attack on Paris and the Russian plane in Egypt and other Hotel/Tourist destination... these are following some book one of them wrote on strategy to take. So these attacks are of course to cause terror, kill innocent people but they're not random... they aim at causing maximum economic losses as well as terror.

That and as sptrawler said before... it also hope for us to turn against the Muslim refugees, and turn against the Muslim community within our own country. When Muslim youth are being harrassed by the police, face prejudice, see little hope of employment etc... it makes recruiting them easier.
 
luutzu said:
That and as sptrawler said before... it also hope for us to turn against the Muslim refugees, and turn against the Muslim community within our own country. When Muslim youth are being harrassed by the police, face prejudice, see little hope of employment etc... it makes recruiting them easier.
Click to expand...

Spot on there. I suspect most of the refugees will be Christians as they are most likely to be persecuted by ISIS.
 

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