Has the 100 year Jihad (war) begun ... ???

[Calliope]

It's mind-boggling. Why are our protection agencies so incredibly incompetent.?

Man Haron Monis: The 10 fatal failures that led to a horrific day

Had one of the failings been overturned, the terrorist attack which rocked a nation to the core might have been prevented.

FAILED: GRANTED BAIL OVER MURDER

In December last year Man Monis was granted bail in Penrith Local Court despite being charged with being an accessory before and after the fact to killing his ex-wife Noleen Hayson Pal. She was stabbed 18 times and set alight in one of the state’s most brutal murders. Bail was granted under old bail laws that made it easier for criminals to be set free.

FAILED: SAVED FROM EXTRADITION

In 2000 Iran attempted to extradite Monis from Australia back to his homeland to face fraud charges. Monis had defrauded clients who had paid him money as part of the travel agency he owned.

Australia refused the request because there was no extradition treaty between the two nations.

FAILED: DROPPED OFF WATCH LIST

Intelligence agencies had Monis on the terror watch list before he dropped off it in about 2010.

Had he been on the list he more than likely would not have been granted bail.

FAILED: GRANTED CITIZENSHIP

Monis was granted Australian citizenship in 2004 despite a warrant being out in Iran for his arrest.

He should have faced justice in his homeland far earlier. Instead he was granted citizenship in Australia.

The Iranian foreign ministry said Australian authorities knew about Monis’s problems.


FAILED: ALLOWED INTO THE COUNTRY

The terrorist first came to Australia in 1996 and was granted political refugee status. The Iranian government were chasing him for fraud. Despite the allegations he was allowed into Australia.

FAILED: GIVEN LEGAL AID

After he wrote disgraceful letters to widows of Australian war heroes Monis used Legal Aid to go to the High Court in a bid for the trial to be aborted. The taxpayers paid the bill.

FAILED: GUN LICENCE MIX-UP

National databases, which interstate police use to share information, indicated Monis held a gun licence.

Mr Abbott confirmed on Wednesday Monis had a licence, but it was later revealed the database was wrong and the AFP was forced to explain the error in the system.

“The AFP has been working closely with CrimTrac, federal and state partners to establish the source of the entry, and to identify any shortfalls within the current system,’’ a statement said.

FAILED: ALLOWED TO LIVE ON WELFARE

The terrorist lived off the hard work of everyday Australians.

If he was not allowed to claim welfare it would have made it more difficult for him to stay in Australia.

FAILED: MULTIPLE IDENTITIES

Tracking the terrorist throughout his 18 years in Australia proved difficult because he had multiple aliases.

Man Haron Monis came to Australia as Mohammad Hassan Manteghi.

He was later known as Sheik Haron. It is believed he had other names.

FAILED: INFORMATION NOT SHARED

Questions have been raised about whether commonwealth and state agencies share enough information. It is believed agencies made decisions without having access to information that other agencies knew about. It will form part of the urgent review ordered by Prime Minister Abbott.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/na...l&utm_campaign=editorial&net_sub_uid=17300093

 

[SirRumpole]

It's mind-boggling. Why are our protection agencies so incredibly incompetent.?



http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/na...l&utm_campaign=editorial&net_sub_uid=17300093

FAILED

If he didn't have a gun licence, where did he get his gun ?

 

[overhang]

When you consider the actual definition of a terrorist attack then this technically is a terrorist attack regardless if he was a lone wolf or somewhat insane. In truth he seems like the sort of loose cannon that was capable of something similar regardless of doctrine but no doubt Islam added fuel to the fire for this man. I'd prefer the media portrayed this man as a nut job rather than a terrorist, I feel if you give the crazy label then other potential copycat lone wolfs may be deterred that such a crime is simply labeled as a lunatic rather than someone on a Islamic crusade that they can look up to.

I do find it interesting though how quickly and willing the media were to label this as terrorism but yet when we were made aware that the Norwegian attacks weren't by a Muslim but actually by a right wing christian the terrorist label was dropped by the media even though that fitted the perfect definition of a terrorist attack.

 

[Tisme]

FAILED

If he didn't have a gun licence, where did he get his gun ?

I think Bill Shorten smells a rat and why he is asking for open reporting on the inquiry. I too wonder how the AFP could have a manually inputted licence in their database for this bloke. If he was Mossad I could understand it.

 

[Hodgie]

I do find it interesting though how quickly and willing the media were to label this as terrorism but yet when we were made aware that the Norwegian attacks weren't by a Muslim but actually by a right wing christian the terrorist label was dropped by the media even though that fitted the perfect definition of a terrorist attack.

It could be perhaps because Christianity in general does not set out to destroy our way off life, it is more a part of our westernised community whereas these extremists in Islamic State clearly have opposing views and would eradicate us all given the opportunity.

Plus it's the media.... they will spin a story whichever way to get more public interest.

 

[SirRumpole]

I think Bill Shorten smells a rat and why he is asking for open reporting on the inquiry. I too wonder how the AFP could have a manually inputted licence in their database for this bloke. If he was Mossad I could understand it.

Rats in the ranks perhaps ?

 

[overhang]

It could be perhaps because Christianity in general does not set out to destroy our way off life, it is more a part of our westernised community whereas these extremists in Islamic State clearly have opposing views and would eradicate us all given the opportunity.

Plus it's the media.... they will spin a story whichever way to get more public interest.

Well like other religions the bible sets out for world domination but we're just lucky enough that Western society in general has progressed past this through education and now the majority of Christians follow the new testament and not the old testament that would by doctrine have carried out stonings and have people burned at the stake.

 

[Value Collector]

Islam is a religion, and like all religion there's a bunch of nonsense, a bunch of violent and idiotic superstition in there.

Agreed, that's why a lot of us atheists are against the idea of taking these things on faith, because regardless of what people say in favour of moderate religion, a certain percentage will take it literally and become extremists, you can't get rid of extremism without out debunking the whole concept.

And like all religion and religious texts, there are also good moral teachings in there as well

You have to have pre-existing morality to be able to know which parts to avoid and which parts are the good moral teaching.

But, is there any good aspects of religion that can not be achieved in other ways?

If you can't think of any good aspects of religion that can't be mirrored in secular ways, why would you promote the religious method when you know it has a lot of nasty side effects.

 

[Value Collector]

FAILED

If he didn't have a gun licence, where did he get his gun ?

Didn't he have a pump action shot gun?

They are illegal even with a license aren't they?

Correct me if I am wrong.

 

[SirRumpole]

you can't get rid of extremism without out debunking the whole concept.

And how do you propose to do that ?

The essential concept of any religion is that there is a God, that its more powerful than anyone on earth, and has rules that it expects followed.

If you can't disprove the existence of God, then how can you debunk the concept of religion ?

 

[basilio]

Another perspective on Muslim terrorism Well worth a read and in particular for the last few paragraphs on suicide bombers.

Pakistan attack reveals the truth about terrorism: it kills more poor Muslims than rich westerners
Ben Doherty

In 2013, 12 people died in terrorist attacks in the west compared with 22,000 in non-western countries. How can poor Muslims escape the scourge of Islamist extremism?

Those who suffer most from Islamist extremism are not people in rich western nations, but other poor Muslims.

This is the fundamental truth that obliterates the false cloak of righteousness so ostentatiously donned by Islamist jihadists: the very people these misguided men and women claim to be fighting for, are the ones they kill in greatest numbers.

Headlines in the western world seize upon the self-evident fact, borne out by the statistics: terrorism is rising, and more and more people are dying from it. But there is a fundamental deceit to this claim. The devil in the detail lies in who is being killed.

The city of Sydney – however the attack in Martin Place is characterised – has been shaken to its core by brutal, senseless assault this week, as London, New York, Madrid, and others were before.

But the Taliban’s attack on a school in Pakistan a day later, killing at least 141 people, 132 of them schoolchildren, is a stark reminder of the outsized price paid by the Muslim world for vile actions of a misguided few proclaiming the cause of their religion.

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-kills-more-poor-muslims-than-rich-westerners

 

[Hodgie]

And how do you propose to do that ?

The essential concept of any religion is that there is a God, that its more powerful than anyone on earth, and has rules that it expects followed.

If you can't disprove the existence of God, then how can you debunk the concept of religion ?

It's not an easy question to answer and there is no easy solution.

You won't convert the world over as it stands today, all you can do is look to the future. It's something that could only be changed over a long period of time.

I don't have any statistics to back this up but my guess would be that if you compared current society to society hundreds of years ago I would imagine that the population as a percentage continues to decrease in terms of religious vs non religious. Being that the nonreligious become more prevalent.

This would be highly correlated with advances of science and being able to explain the previously inexplicable.

In the end, we made god up so we take him (or her) away.

 

[So_Cynical]

Didn't he have a pump action shot gun?

They are illegal even with a license aren't they?

Correct me if I am wrong.

Legal with a magazine capacity of 5 rounds.

 

[tech/a]

It's not an easy question to answer and there is no easy solution.

You won't convert the world over as it stands today, all you can do is look to the future. It's something that could only be changed over a long period of time.

I don't have any statistics to back this up but my guess would be that if you compared current society to society hundreds of years ago I would imagine that the population as a percentage continues to decrease in terms of religious vs non religious. Being that the nonreligious become more prevalent.

This would be highly correlated with advances of science and being able to explain the previously inexplicable.

In the end, we made god up so we take him (or her) away.

Even in the face of blinding evidence there is no god --- there will always be religion.
They will always be right and any other solution to where we come from---including a billions to 1 fluke----will be incorrect---they will oppose this in some cases with their own death.

And we are the most intelligent of species on the planet!

 

[pavilion103]

I wouldn't put my trust in a one in a billion fluke any more than I would a one in a billion trade.

I'm not aware of any evidence that there is no god.

I'm not aware of any evidence that it is possible for there to be an eternal self sustaining universe.

 

[Calliope]

Even in the face of blinding evidence there is no god --- there will always be religion.
They will always be right and any other solution to where we come from---including a billions to 1 fluke----will be incorrect---they will oppose this in some cases with their own death.

And we are the most intelligent of species on the planet!

Religion is a crutch. Those above a certain intellectual capacity don't need this crutch. Which bring us back to poor stupid Monis. Without Islamism as a crutch he would have been just another dole bludger. Islamism buoyed him up with a magnificent crutch. He was given a one-way ticket to Paradise and its 72 dark-eyed virgins. All he had to do to earn it, was to martyr himself by killing infidels. Some say he only killed one, but one will suffice.

 

[Value Collector]

I'm not aware of any evidence that there is no god.

Ideas asserted without with out evidence can be dismissed without evidence, the burden of proof is on you to prove your god exists, not us to disprove it.

 

[trainspotter]

Ideas asserted without with out evidence can be dismissed without evidence, the burden of proof is on you to prove your god exists, not us to disprove it.

Yes there is a God.

 

[So_Cynical]

I wouldn't put my trust in a one in a billion fluke any more than I would a one in a billion trade.

You put your money in a trade, trust is something else...costs me nothing to be an Atheist, costs you nothing not to be.

I'm not aware of any evidence that there is no god.

WOW - i would of thought that 300 years of scientific endeavours and discoverys would count for something.

I'm not aware of any evidence that it is possible for there to be an eternal self sustaining universe.

Watched a TV show the other night on a newish theory, there is evidence that the laws governing our known universe are not as absolute as once thought, opening up the universe to new possibility's about endless expansion and dimensions...a self sustaining universe that never ends.

All science based, no gods required.

 

[Value Collector]

Yes there is a God.

Wouldn't a god have got them to add that to their currency from the start, instead of waiting till the cold war as propaganda against the "godless" Russians.

Scotlands national animal is a unicorn, so I wouldn't trust government slogans, motto's or emblems, lol