Day traders ONLY - a continuing study

[skint]

Post Times on this site are running 1 hour behind !

Cheers

Probably wasn't adjusted for daylight saving

 

[Joe Blow]

Re: Day traders ONLY--- a continuing study.

Whoa, whoa, whoa ... just because this guy promotes
himself as a trading expert ..... it isn't necessarily so !~!

I have not seen tech/a promote himself as an expert in anything. It seems to me that is something you are reading into his posting style.

Just because somebody takes this egotist to task, is no
reason to delete the posts ..... somebody has to pose the
hard questions ..... yes???

Otherwise, this just becomes the "mouthy duck show" !~!

...it just will not happen, because he is a fraud.

Enough with the personal insults. Yogi, most of us are all well aware of your personal vendetta against tech/a. You don't like him. Fair enough. That is your right but the personal attacks stop here. They serve no purpose other than to provoke and to divert threads from their original topic. If you wish to have it out with tech/a, take it to PM's and spare us.

If you wish to play the ball rather than the man, go right ahead. That's what ASF is here for. Everybody's views, approaches and methodologies are open for criticism and questioning. But I do not want to see threads that many see as valuable hijacked by personal vendettas. It's selfish, rude and unwelcome, not to mention unnecessary. It's schoolyard stuff and that's where it belongs, a schoolyard, not in a forum for adults.

Now, can we get this thread back on topic? I'm sure I'm not the only one who would like to see it continued.

If anyone wishes to respond to me with regards to this post, please send me a PM. There have been enough diversions in this thread already, lets get back to talking about day trading.

 

[constable]

Thank god for that, now what was this thread about i've forgotten?

 

[Joe Blow]

Post Times on this site are running 1 hour behind !

Everyone has their own 'ASF Clock' that they can set to their own timezone.

See this thread for more details: https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5075

 

[constable]

Thank god for that, now what was this thread about i've forgotten?

Ahh timezones that right!

 

[stoxclimber]

Would be interesting provided there was no BS...i.e. posting of the trades ASAP and no selective posting of trades.

 

[constable]

Ok here's a trade ive taken today based on auz previous support at 8 cents.
Bought 200000 units at the close of 8.1 cents . Was prepared to pay 8.2.
Why did i buy ?
Because auz has started to stray outside its upwards trend.
So i figure it has to either pull back into line or continue going down.
8 cents has been a solid support so im of the belief it wont get thru it.

Also there are drill results due giving the stock some expectation.
Also i would think there should be some retracement as it was trading well into 9 cents just over a week ago.
My objective is to make 3 to 5 ticks on this stock and if it hits 8 cents with any speed im out. Time frame is 2 - 3 days.

 

[bingk6]

Re: Day traders ONLY--- a continuing study.

But I do not want to see threads that many see as valuable hijacked by personal vendettas.

Well said Joe, surely the interests of a vast number of forum members cannot be hijacked by one individual. I cannot believe that a promising thread such as this could end up like this.

Yogi, whether Tech is a guru or otherwise is something that we can make up our own minds on....

Tech, please continue with the discussion and I am sure that there are many others who share my view.

Bingk6

 

[finnsk]

I was very happy when this thread was started I have been trying my look with a little day trading to see if this is for me so I am very disappointed with the start of this thread. So please get on with it, so people like me hopefully can get some value that we can use to learn and that way would be able to contribute in the future with some value in return.
regards finnsk

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Post Times on this site are running 1 hour behind !

Cheers

Coyotte,

I think the ASX time zone would suffice. The ASF time "zones" wouldn't for obvious reasons.
If one is trading the US, NZ, etc markets then those time zones would suffice.

 

[coyotte]

Hope no one takes this the wrong way -- because it is meant as part of the journey and not a reflection on anyone:

I have found that the EGO (for lack of a better word ) is the most dangerous thing you face as a Short Term Trader --- once you say either to yourself or publicly that a stock WILL do this ---- you sort of lock yourself in and come all the hell fires, you will blindly defend that opinion ---- better off to just take the view that it MAY do this but probably won't and just defend the position.


Cheers

 

[barney]

Hope no one takes this the wrong way -- because it is meant as part of the journey and not a reflection on anyone:

I have found that the EGO (for lack of a better word ) is the most dangerous thing you face as a Short Term Trader --- once you say either to yourself or publicly that a stock WILL do this ---- you sort of lock yourself in and come all the hell fires, you will blindly defend that opinion ---- better off to just take the view that it MAY do this but probably won't and just defend the position.


Cheers

Howdy Coyotte, I agree. A little ego makes a big man ..... A big ego makes a little man ............ Ego is a luxury of living in an affluent society imo .......... how many of those poor @#$%% living in third world countries can "afford" ego's??? I personally put any ego I may have had to bed a long time ago, and am much better off because of it..... (Its a bit like I tell my Kidz when they say they're bored ......... "Boredom is a luxury, Enjoy it")

Now ........... re the RMD trade C, I am curious as to your ideas behind this "short" cause I looked at it and could not see what you are obviously seeing ...... What is your st/loss ... Entry point etc. etc. Thanks, Barney.

 

[coyotte]

Barney :
Reason for initially selecting RGB as a watch :
RMD is suppose to be in a E/W Wave 4 correction that may have been trunctated which would be a bullish sign (not my analysis).

RMD NY to me looks likes it's in W4 -- different topping pattern to ASX (as U know my E/W knowledge is kinddie stuff -- but after looking at Wavepicker's posts I've been trying to learn the basics)


I'm going off the current trend line $6.27

RMD NYSX closed around $au 6.25 Friday --- RMD usually gravitates to it's US SP.

Went Short around 10.30 today @ 6.38 with a STOP @ 6.48 (close on this one) --- The Target the trend line 6.27 -- if broken re-enter SHORT


Was looking for a sell down during 12.00-1.00
This did not occur -- instead SP moved UP in the last 5 min of trade with fair vol.

The NY SP tonite will probably determine my Closing time of day for this position tomorrow.

Reason being -- Mondays are usually a good day to open a Short & Tues a good day to close.



Cheers

 

[nizar]

Ok iv just read through this thread.
90% rubbish (personal insults) and 10% REAL quality.

Duc i find mysef agreeing with most of what you say regarding trading psychology. Short-term trading is the HARDEST form of stock trading there is, without a doubt.

Coyotte, i can tell from your style you are one of the select few who do make REAL money from the markets:

Some of my approaches include:

1: Opening a Position around 3.50 Friday for a Monday Closing near the Open
Most "Day Traded" Stocks are sold off on the Friday Close:

2: Limiting the Holding period to 1-5 days max
If the SP does not move within this period, it probably won't.

3: Opening a Position between 10.30- 11.30 and Closing 12.00 to 1.00.
The Opening Frenzy is over and if the SP is going to move you'll generally
end up with over keen Buys/Sellers during the Lunch Break.

Thanks for sharing your approaches.

Re: #1: i agree, but i think it a stock has a strong run, "arvo run" as i like to call them, you could make a good entry with a tight stop giving you a high probability of a multiple R win. For example MLS, it had a good run towards the end on thursday, at 3:50pm or 3:55pm you could pick some up for 9.1 or 9.2. Two tick stop the next day 9.9c you sell and lock in a good trade. If a stock closes at or near the high, good chance of a gap up the next day. Low chance of your stop getting hit in the last 5 or 10mins.

Re: #2: probably you are right, though i havent quantified this for myself (yet).

Re: #3: sometimes 12:00-1pm is the dead low-volume period of the day. I found that its very hard to know when is the perfect time for buying. For example, i remember PEN opened one day dead 4.6c the last 4.5/4.6 the spread at 280k volume. No life in it. At around 1ish it took off reaching 5.2c high and then closing at 5.0c. Some stocks fire up on the open, but they gap up too much, or maybe another reason but after what becomes the eventual daily high is reached a few moments after the open, the sell-off begins. MLS a couple of weeks ago RAN ALL DAY. It opened at 5.2 (small gap up after the 5.0c close). At 10:30pm it had reached 6.5c. High was 7.0c. Eventual close 6.7c.

I gotta get my hands on some of those books mentioned.

Keep the great discussion coming guys.

Yogi you seem an experienced trader, id like to hear some of your genuine thoughts about short-term trading, perhaps you can share some wisdom like coyotte, duc, and tech and others have done.

 

[coyotte]

Nizar :

No. 2 : I'm talking about Short Term here -- Scares the pants off me holding a position overnite --(gaps ) --- the relative position size compared to Position or Target Trading has to be quite large , one of the reasons I try and stay in the top 200

A few basic rules i've learned (short term )
1: trade CFDs --- long/short -- instant trade-- IG $1 per $1000--- Live feed

2: A separate bank to the main trading account and position sizes that U can cover in cash

3: Be very wary of SHORTS -- They can turn in flash during bull markets -- Always pull out just prior to a support level -- re-enter if breached


4: Take Profits quickly -- you can always re-enter -- take losses even quicker
but give the SP a bit of leeway



Cheers

 

[nizar]

Something i read in a review of Douglas' book (on amazon) that i thought would be worthy of a mention here.

The 5 principles of thinking in probabilities

1. Anything can happen
2. You don't have to know what is going to happen next in order to make money.
3. Ther is a random distribution between wins and losses for any given set of variables that define an edge.
4. An edge is nothing more than an indication of a higher probability of one thing happening over another.
5. Every moment in the market is unique.

 

[MichaelD]

Re: Day traders ONLY--- a continuing study.

..... and proud of it because, if we put it to the test
in any time frame, even daytrading, it surfaces as
a very useful market timing tool.

Really?

At the risk of being accused of playing the man instead of the facts...

Picked at random, herewith your analysis of CAZ, posted on 4-Jan-2006
https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2502

CAZ ..... as requested on another forum, here's some
astroanalysis for this stock, which shows some extreme
negativity in the months ahead:

16012006 ..... significant and negative news

No news, but price $1.50 to $1.30 over 4 days

23-24012006 ..... significant and negative move ???

Nope. Price $1.33 to $1.57 over 6 days

02022006 ..... significant news (positive ???)

Nope. Day 2 of a 10 day decline.

07022006 ..... spotlight on CAZ

Midway through a 10 day decline.

14-16022006 ..... minor and finance-related???

Results of AGM 17-2-2006. Commencement of a strong bull run from $1.24 to $2.04. Hardly minor.

From 18022006-to-29032006 there may be VERY STRONG
underlying negative sentiment for this company. During
that period, we may see some key dates, on:

Nope. Strong bull run from $1.24 to $2.04 during this time.

20022006 ..... minor news???

Nope

09032006 ..... minor

Nope

15032006 ..... minor

1603 Half Year Accounts. Price continues BULL run.

24-27032006 ..... 2 positive cycles here ..... finance-related???

Nope. Start of bear run down from $1.82 to $1.50.

That STRONG negative cycle should re-appear from
29092006-to-03102006, as well.

Nope. Big gap UP on 29-9.


By far the most significant move of CAZ during this time was on 24-4 with a massive gap down. No prediction of that in the above.

So, we have;

11 predictions
1 correct
9 incorrect
1 unclear

Could you explain again how this can be used as a "very useful market timing tool"?

 

[barney]

Ok iv just read through this thread.
90% rubbish (personal insults) and 10% REAL quality.

Duc i find mysef agreeing with most of what you say regarding trading psychology. Short-term trading is the HARDEST form of stock trading there is, without a doubt.

Coyotte, i can tell from your style you are one of the select few who do make REAL money from the markets:

Thanks for sharing your approaches.

:iagree:

Well said on all counts above Nizar,

Coyotte, Thanks for the run down on the trade. As Nizar elluded to .... You are one of the few who "puts your money where your mouth is" .... that certainly gets my respect as well .......

Interesting points above Michael ............. You have the ability to give any and all "a healthy dose" of humility when required (No disrespect intended to Yogi)

Now, as others have said perhaps it would be good if the thread could be re-ignited with the original content ................ Enter stage left Tech ......

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Re: Day traders ONLY--- a continuing study.

Yogi,

I have read Techs post several times and I don't see anywhere where he professes to be an expert. The post is about going on a journey of discovery, learning and sharing techniques, viz:



As far as the comment about a months salary in a few minutes, this is the reality of daytrading, it can and does happen. With all the money management, risk and trade management that applies to any good trader, losses are kept smaller than these big wins... same as any trading.

The thing with day trading is that one can put on a much larger position size than normal and sans overnight risk, still be within normal risk parameters. Hence the occasional kicking of a huge goal.

So please, enough with the vendetta, and I won't hesitate to delete further posts unless on topic.

Thanks

Just moderating the francophone.
"without"

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

HARDEST form of trading that there is. Most WILL fail, that is the sad truth.

Maybe most make it harder than it could be.

I personally would not recommend daytrading to anyone. Too hard!

I guess it depends on how MUCH one is happy with earning. If it is $100 per day then it will be a lot easier than if one is trying to get $10,000 per day - just to throw some perspective in.