Cashless society

[wayneL]

I think we all understand by now that there is one particular member here who is enamoured with the digital system... Dammit there has been probably 150,000 posts at least, stating such.

One might question the zeal with which he promotes that digital system and in particular his enthusiasm for paying tax. Just saying.

It's getting boring tbh.

All of us here do use the digital system and it does have benefits in certain situations, not the least of which in our trading and investing of the markets. But long live cash and it's *proxies, apart from anything else it does keep us connected on a level which is just absolutely depersonalized by the digital system.

Mrs and I have two babies due soon in our extended family. Both will be receiving a 1oz gold Kangaroo (easy to keep and a bit harder to spend on BS)¹, and a commitment to helping them to invest early in their lives, hopefully to keep them connected to real money and real humans and building capital as they grow up.

...and just maybe the wrinkly, curmudgeonly great aunt and uncle might get a doff of the cap as they get older.

¹ Context, I was given a gold coin for my 21st birthday, 42 years ago. My folks gave it to me and said "if you ever get into trouble, with this you will always be able to buy a bus fare home"

I still have it and perhaps even a couple more acquired along the way.

 

[moXJO]

I think we all understand by now that there is one particular member here who is enamoured with the digital system... Dammit there has been probably 150,000 posts at least, stating such.

One might question the zeal with which he promotes that digital system and in particular his enthusiasm for paying tax. Just saying.

It's getting boring tbh.

All of us here do use the digital system and it does have benefits in certain situations, not the least of which in our trading and investing of the markets. But long live cash and it's *proxies, apart from anything else it does keep us connected on a level which is just absolutely depersonalized by the digital system.

Mrs and I have two babies due soon in our extended family. Both will be receiving a 1oz gold Kangaroo (easy to keep and a bit harder to spend on BS)¹, and a commitment to helping them to invest early in their lives, hopefully to keep them connected to real money and real humans and building capital as they grow up.

...and just maybe the wrinkly, curmudgeonly great aunt and uncle might get a doff of the cap as they get older.

¹ Context, I was given a gold coin for my 21st birthday, 42 years ago. My folks gave it to me and said "if you ever get into trouble, with this you will always be able to buy a bus fare home"

I still have it and perhaps even a couple more acquired along the way.

Yeah the conversation is just going around in circles now. We all know the risks and who is really benefiting from digital being pushed so hard.

I honestly think shares will be the next thing getting attacked.

 

[Value Collector]

The banks are only worried by the bottom line on their balance sheets. People and jobs don't come into the equation. Perhaps if the top of the tree were being trimmed then there maybe there would be a different scenario. Certainly be a bigger saving than the current cost cutting.
Fortunately for us the local Community Bank is thriving and growing.

At the end of the day, no one likes paying bank fees, so if they need to keep costs low, the branches a huge cost base, and if they aren’t adding to the business in some way they need to go, if the people that used the cash handling facilities and other services inside the branches paid their way, the branches wouldn’t be shut.

The people that scream about the cost of running eftpos machines only do so because they are used to the bank subsidy on their cash handling.

 

[moXJO]

At the end of the day, no one likes paying bank fees, so if they need to keep costs low, the branches a huge cost base, and if they aren’t adding to the business in some way they need to go, if the people that used the cash handling facilities and other services inside the branches paid their way, the branches wouldn’t be shut.

The people that scream about the cost of running eftpos machines only do so because they are used to the bank subsidy on their cash handling.

Multi billion $ profits renders all this as rubbish. Cash is an integral part of the country's security. Banks can go back to being nationalised for all I care. They were always making a profit.

 

[JohnDe]

Multi billion $ profits renders all this as rubbish. Cash is an integral part of the country's security. Banks can go back to being nationalised for all I care. They were always making a profit.

Cash will be around for quite a while, even with the attacks from greedy banks and socialist fools.

Governor of the RBA Michele Bullock "Maintaining access to cash. We also remain focused on access to cash for Australians. ​

cash remains an important means of payment for some people and is widely held for precautionary or store-of-wealth purposes. Cash is also an important backup method of payment during system outages or natural disasters, when electronic payments might be unavailable.​

For these reasons, the RBA places a high priority on the community continuing to have reasonable access to cash withdrawal and deposit services."​

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[farmerge]

Cash will be around for quite a while, even with the attacks from greedy banks and socialist fools.

Governor of the RBA Michele Bullock "Maintaining access to cash. We also remain focused on access to cash for Australians. ​

cash remains an important means of payment for some people and is widely held for precautionary or store-of-wealth purposes. Cash is also an important backup method of payment during system outages or natural disasters, when electronic payments might be unavailable.​

For these reasons, the RBA places a high priority on the community continuing to have reasonable access to cash withdrawal and deposit services."​

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Well well that is a piece of common sense.
And I was of the opinion that old mate Common Sense was on a sabbatical for a prolonged period of time.

 

[farmerge]

...as per the recent BOQ layoffs. Blaming job cuts on the "digital channel" forcing a "corporatisation" of branches but to be fair, customers are preferring to use digital platforms for the convenience. Doing so has placed the local bank branches, the use of hard currency and jobs firmly at risk of being lost.

The BOQ job cuts total 650 over the last 12 months thus saving $22.75M (based on 650 x $35k p.a.)
Unfortunately and without doubt, those layoffs are affecting more than 650 individuals.

So for convenience and cost savings to the banks, digital may be better but when it comes at the expense jobs, is it really?

NO

 

[Craton]

If you want to protect jobs just ban the use of all machine tools, plant and equipment. And we would have full employment and our productivity would drop.

That's a stretch and not answering the question.

Surely BOQ could retrain, redeploy and retain their staff and, like another poster said, trim the top end fat?
It's not as if BOQ is just a plain old vanilla bricks'n'mortar bank.
From Canstar

Bank of Queensland (BOQ) owns Virgin Money Australia and ME. It also owns BOQ Specialist which provides specialist banking services to niche market segments including medical, dental, veterinary and accounting professionals.

Other factors come into play when talking banks and top of that list would be the four big banks mentality.

Another factor of course, the big bug bear called profits and as ABC reported on banks in the Pacific where, swathes of banks are pulling out of and citing in part: -

So, why are the big banks getting out?​

It's complicated. But banks point the finger at two main problems.
The first one is that the Pacific markets are small (and therefore not very profitable) but can still be quite difficult to operate in because they've each got their own set of specific rules and regulations.

 

[farmerge]

Multi billion $ profits renders all this as rubbish. Cash is an integral part of the country's security. Banks can go back to being nationalised for all I care. They were always making a profit.

When did a bank last go belly up. cost cutting only improves the bottom line. that line and not employees/people only matter to them

 

[mullokintyre]

When did a bank last go belly up. cost cutting only improves the bottom line. that line and not employees/people only matter to them

State Bank of Victoria was one that ent belly up in 1991.
State Bank of South Australia is another one in 1990 (courtesy of Tricntinental).
Mick.

 

[farmerge]

I think we all understand by now that there is one particular member here who is enamoured with the digital system... Dammit there has been probably 150,000 posts at least, stating such.

One might question the zeal with which he promotes that digital system and in particular his enthusiasm for paying tax. Just saying.

It's getting boring tbh.

All of us here do use the digital system and it does have benefits in certain situations, not the least of which in our trading and investing of the markets. But long live cash and it's *proxies, apart from anything else it does keep us connected on a level which is just absolutely depersonalized by the digital system.

Mrs and I have two babies due soon in our extended family. Both will be receiving a 1oz gold Kangaroo (easy to keep and a bit harder to spend on BS)¹, and a commitment to helping them to invest early in their lives, hopefully to keep them connected to real money and real humans and building capital as they grow up.

...and just maybe the wrinkly, curmudgeonly great aunt and uncle might get a doff of the cap as they get older.

¹ Context, I was given a gold coin for my 21st birthday, 42 years ago. My folks gave it to me and said "if you ever get into trouble, with this you will always be able to buy a bus fare home"

I still have it and perhaps even a couple more acquired along the wa

State Bank of Victoria was one that ent belly up in 1991.
State Bank of South Australia is another one in 1990 (courtesy of Tricntinental).
Mick.

I am now pondering just how many banks are not owned or owned in part by the big 4.

 

[Value Collector]

That's a stretch and not answering the question.

Surely BOQ could retrain, redeploy and retain their staff and, like another poster said, trim the top end fat?
It's not as if BOQ is just a plain old vanilla bricks'n'mortar bank.
From Canstar



Other factors come into play when talking banks and top of that list would be the four big banks mentality.

Another factor of course, the big bug bear called profits and as ABC reported on banks in the Pacific where, swathes of banks are pulling out of and citing in part: -

Let me guess you are also one of those people that thinks they are creating jobs by avoiding the self check out?

Jobs are always being lost and created, trying to stop progress because some one might lose a job is silly, because over time the has been the normal thing, but new jobs are always being created.

90% of people used to work in farms, now 1% do and we provide the world with more food person than ever before, if we tried to keep people employed on farms we wouldn’t have all the other specialist trades that have developed.

 

[Craton]

Let me guess you are also one of those people that thinks they are creating jobs by avoiding the self check out?

No my friend, you have guessed entirely wrong.
As we service SSCO's, the more these are used the more work is created for us.

Gotta love the tinlids feeding the SSCO lettuce or stuffing some such into any and all orifices, lol.

Jobs are always being lost and created, trying to stop progress because some one might lose a job is silly, because over time the has been the normal thing, but new jobs are always being created.
90% of people used to work in farms, now 1% do and we provide the world with more food person than ever before, if we tried to keep people employed on farms we wouldn’t have all the other specialist trades that have developed.

I'm not advocating stopping progress (as if that'll happen), we all know change/progess is a fact of life however, my point is that not all change is good or benevolent.

 

[Value Collector]

No my friend, you have guessed entirely wrong.
As we service SSCO's, the more these are used the more work is created for us.

Gotta love the tinlids feeding the SSCO lettuce or stuffing some such into any and all orifices, lol.


I'm not advocating stopping progress (as if that'll happen), we all know change/progess is a fact of life however, my point is that not all change is good or benevolent.

So how is self service checkouts different from digital moves away from branches?

Just as the self service checkout reduces the need for workers at check outs, but increases workers needed in other roles, bank branch staff reductions increase the need for people I. Call centres, app developers, IT people etc etc etc.

It won’t reduce over all amount of workers needed it just shifts the labour other places where they are more productive.

The move to digital is progress and is good, some people just want a faster horse, but cars came anyway, you can’t complain about the loss of jobs in black smithing.

That’s how I see you guys, a bunch of people complaining that horses are disappearing off the road, and freeways are increasing and they don’t allow horses.

 

[divs4ever]

Surely BOQ could retrain, redeploy and retain their staff and, like another poster said, trim the top end fat?
It's not as if BOQ is just a plain old vanilla bricks'n'mortar bank.

it may as well be , watch it accelerate 'simplicity ' as the corporate management no longer have to tangle with 'on the ground ' management ( the franchisees )

you don't have to look hard to see BOQ will become a me2 bank ( trying to emulate the big 4 )

 

[frugal.rock]

I recently got a chq sent to me from the ATO via the Accountant... (she always manages to stuff something simple up, supposed to be direct deposit)
Anyway, it was quite nostalgic.
I thought of framing it and keeping it forever as I'll probably never see another one, but then common sense got the better of me and I deposited that bad boy into a ATM.
$110 big ones. Woohoo.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

I recently got a chq sent to me from the ATO via the Accountant... common sense got the better of me and I deposited that bad boy into a ATM.

of interest,, how long did it take to clear?

 

[frugal.rock]

Around 3 days.
Can't say definitely though.

 

[qldfrog]

Around 3 days.
Can't say definitely though.

I still receive cheques from time to time, dividends from trading shares i am not registered with yet, etc
Last one was a house insurance reimbursement after change of premium $20 or so
Put it in a cba atm, was scanned and automatically read, appeared immediately but amount not available, credited fully the following day
D+1 if i remember well
We can still use cheque efficiently if required.
But yes, i have not written one for years

 

[Value Collector]

I still receive cheques from time to time, dividends from trading shares i am not registered with yet, etc
Last one was a house insurance reimbursement after change of premium $20 or so
Put it in a cba atm, was scanned and automatically read, appeared immediately but amount not available, credited fully the following day
D+1 if i remember well
We can still use cheque efficiently if required.
But yes, i have not written one for years

Aren’t cheques technically still part of the “cashless society”, I am sure direct deposit and credit card transactions have basically made them obsolete, but checks were one of the earliest forms of cashless transactions.

So if anything the fact that cheques used to be so universally used shows that for a long time people have sort out ways to avoid carrying cash around.