Cashless society

[moXJO]

Yep I have received dodgy calls and emails, you just hang up or delete.

I have also been approached by many scammers in person, and had several near misses (especially in LA) where I believe I was very close to being robbed.

Criminals will always follow the money, as we go digital more so will crime, but crime has always been there.

LA is a different beast. They will take you to an atm and withdraw cash. So just having a card doesn't help.
I'm sure robbery is on the increase there. But they are also fraud city.

I use to carry 2 wallets around. One to throw to the robbers. The other with all the important stuff.
That being said, I walked from down town LA up to the Hollywood hills with no trouble.

US crime is largely a political issue though. Democrats seem to have lost their minds on policing. Gun culture also makes it difficult.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

A further move. ... likely to be cheaper than debit and credit cards. And woolies gets the money straight away.

Woolworths will start moving payments on to Australia’s real-time payments system as a cheaper alternative to the card networks controlled by Visa and Mastercard, a move it says will reduce fraud while driving customers to its digital wallet and rewards program.

The supermarket has become the first major company to offer customers an option to link their bank account directly to its app, using PayTo functionality introduced by Australia’s new payments platform. The real-time infrastructure has been built by the banks and is operated by Australian Payments Plus.

Woolworths is working on enabling the option for in-store payments later this year...

 

[moXJO]

A further move. ... likely to be cheaper than debit and credit cards. And woolies gets the money straight away.

Woolworths will start moving payments on to Australia’s real-time payments system as a cheaper alternative to the card networks controlled by Visa and Mastercard, a move it says will reduce fraud while driving customers to its digital wallet and rewards program.

The supermarket has become the first major company to offer customers an option to link their bank account directly to its app, using PayTo functionality introduced by Australia’s new payments platform. The real-time infrastructure has been built by the banks and is operated by Australian Payments Plus.

Woolworths is working on enabling the option for in-store payments later this year...

This is the type of stuff that's unnerving. Obviously a way to shut down competition by locking in consumers into one lane.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

This is the type of stuff that's unnerving. Obviously a way to shut down competition by locking in consumers into one lane.

Yep, and they'll push it. Get the app, tie to Rewards card, sounds like a winner

 

[moXJO]

Yep, and they'll push it. Get the app, tie to Rewards card, sounds like a winner

They have gone a similar route before. They had a credit card partnership that eventually fizzled out. That was near on 20 years ago.

These "subscription based", "company apps" and "lock ins" seem to be all the rage now.

 

[farmerge]

Yep I have received dodgy calls and emails, you just hang up or delete.

I have also been approached by many scammers in person, and had several near misses (especially in LA) where I believe I was very close to being robbed.

Criminals will always follow the money, as we go digital more so will crime, but crime has always been there.

I can tell you I much rather receiving a dodgy email than being approached by two guys that have been waiting at my car for me to come out of the bottle shop at night.

Scammers and low lifes are abundant. We have the gypsies from Mother England and Ireland here. They are not afraid of jumping in front of the car/ute trying to flog what they have stolen. Got to the point now that mostkeep their gates locked day and night.

 

[farmerge]

Yep, and they'll push it. Get the app, tie to Rewards card, sounds like a winner

Every business that i deal with via credit card is now offering something as a sweetener to keep you coming back. The one I do like is a major tool and goods supplier not B....ings with a pretty healthy in store cash back for the next purchase. Discounted prices plus the bonus.

 

[Rabbithop]

Interesting to come across this topic. Will do the reading fr page1 later. Seriously, asking for ideas, heading for Grand Silk Rd tour in Sept. Hearing a lot of ple saying, China is going into cashless country n the places I am going to is cashless so my problem is how to I go about it. Some said to buy yuan into a travel card but each time u tap on to pay, u r up for conversion charges others said to buy yuan n use ali pay card. So wise travellers please post your idea of travelling into a cashless place.
If I do a big withdrawal at one time to minimize conversion fee, the cash is still useless, if the place or shop won't take the cash, isn't it.

 

[qldfrog]

Interesting to come across this topic. Will do the reading fr page1 later. Seriously, asking for ideas, heading for Grand Silk Rd tour in Sept. Hearing a lot of ple saying, China is going into cashless country n the places I am going to is cashless so my problem is how to I go about it. Some said to buy yuan into a travel card but each time u tap on to pay, u r up for conversion charges others said to buy yuan n use ali pay card. So wise travellers please post your idea of travelling into a cashless place.
If I do a big withdrawal at one time to minimize conversion fee, the cash is still useless, if the place or shop won't take the cash, isn't it.

Cash still used if you need to but best is get some WeChat or Ali money on your phone.
Open a WeChat account maybe from HK if you can or from mainland .
It can be tricky aka near impossible to link an Aussie credit card to any of these account.when I left China at Covid time, it was even getting harder.
The way I was getting past was withdrawing serious amount of cash from an ATM then giving it to a friend/PA who was then gifting me the equivalent to my WeChat account.
wechat pay has no fee..
Once you have money there, you can buy anything swiping your phone or scanning a QR code.
From 1$ street vendor to train ferry ticket or credit on transport card to bars and taxis.
It was amazing honestly but fully dependant on this.
So mobile plan and a WeChat account.
You can load WeChat app in english from Australia
Enjoy your trip

 

[Dona Ferentes]

Armchair traveler .... sounds exciting

 

[Rabbithop]

Cash still used if you need to but best is get some WeChat or Ali money on your phone.
Open a WeChat account maybe from HK if you can or from mainland .
It can be tricky aka near impossible to link an Aussie credit card to any of these account.when I left China at Covid time, it was even getting harder.
The way I was getting past was withdrawing serious amount of cash from an ATM then giving it to a friend/PA who was then gifting me the equivalent to my WeChat account.
wechat pay has no fee..
Once you have money there, you can buy anything swiping your phone or scanning a QR code.
From 1$ street vendor to train ferry ticket or credit on transport card to bars and taxis.
It was amazing honestly but fully dependant on this.
So mobile plan and a WeChat account.
You can load WeChat app in english from Australia
Enjoy your trip

Thanks qldfrog. I do have WeChat app so maybe I will investigate this method.

 

[sptrawler]

Interesting to come across this topic. Will do the reading fr page1 later. Seriously, asking for ideas, heading for Grand Silk Rd tour in Sept. Hearing a lot of ple saying, China is going into cashless country n the places I am going to is cashless so my problem is how to I go about it. Some said to buy yuan into a travel card but each time u tap on to pay, u r up for conversion charges others said to buy yuan n use ali pay card. So wise travellers please post your idea of travelling into a cashless place.
If I do a big withdrawal at one time to minimize conversion fee, the cash is still useless, if the place or shop won't take the cash, isn't it.

We were in China just before covid, just used atm and withdrew big enough amounts to minimise withdrawls. It may have changed post covid, but we had no trouble with cash.

 

[sptrawler]

If there was a bigger market, the overseas banks would be growing their customer base here, there is nothing to stop a conglomerate from buying AMP's banking license and growing the business.
There is nothing to stop Macquarie from becoming the 5th pillar, only the fact there is more money and less hassle, in investment banking.

If there was money in it someone would do it, their debt to equity ratios aren't for the faint hearted and as can be seen when covid hit NAB $15 in an instant, so it kind of shows a lot of their perceived strength and profitability is an illusion.
One of the main reasons the Governments are worried about hitting property, it is a much safer bet digging up iron ore, than running a bank.

Just a snap shot of our massively profitable Banks, IMO if they weren't paying a decent dividend, no one would buy their shares.
Check out Macquarie share price history compared to some of our local retail banks, it kind of shows what the shareholder think of who has the most upside IMO.













I can't understand why Macquarie doesn't want to get into the retail banking sector, they must be getting vertigo doing what they are doing. ? ? ?

 

[Value Collector]

Just a snap shot of our massively profitable Banks, IMO if they weren't paying a decent dividend, no one would buy their shares.
Check out Macquarie share price history compared to some of our local retail banks, it kind of shows what the shareholder think of who has the most upside IMO.


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I can't understand why Macquarie doesn't want to get into the retail banking sector, they must be getting vertigo doing what they are doing. ? ? ?

You left out CBA.

You could say it’s because of the high dividend payout ratio that most of the banks have not grown their share price overly much.

But if you adjusted the charts to allow for having those dividends reinvested, you would see a lot more vertical action.

 

[sptrawler]

You left out CBA.

You could say it’s because of the high dividend payout ratio that most of the banks have grown. It grown their share price overly much.

But if you adjusted the charts to allow for having those dividends reinvested, you would see a lot more vertical action.

Macquarie pays a good dividend also.
They have well and truly outperformed the big four, without having the political interference that the others have to deal with.

 

[Value Collector]

Macquarie pays a good dividend also.
They have well and truly outperformed the big four, without having the political interference that the others have to deal with.

Yeah, they have pushed the envelope pretty hard though over the years, taking a lot more risks along the way, they nearly blew up in 2008 remember.

 

[sptrawler]

Yeah, they have pushed the envelope pretty hard though over the years, taking a lot more risks along the way, they nearly blew up in 2008 remember.

True but they were also underwritten by the Govt guarantee, they were a great pick up at $15 post GFC.
Plus they don't have to real with the stigma, "oh they are terrible for lending money to people who lied about what they could afford to borrow a couple of years later", then "oh they are terrible for not lending money to people who can't afford it". Now "oh it's terrible interest rates have gone up and people are struggling to pay their loans".?

 

[JohnDe]

I wasn't going to share my story, but I just had a conversation with a good customer that had a similar experience.

Under pressure from the ministry of finance, Qantas is offering large incentives to join up to one of their credit card partners. After researching all the business cards, it came down to two, our existing bank but with smaller benefits for the amount we spend, or Amex with much larger points bonus and other benefits. Signed up for Amex with an approved $30,000 p/m spend, got the card and was told that there is no limit on it. the following day went to pay a $22,000 bill but was declined.

Now we get to the point of where I started to get angry because of the waste of time and the pointless circles I had to go through. First, I logged in online, no luck there, then I called them only to be caught in an endless circle because none of the recorded options met my issue (much later I found out how to get a real person, it is not easy and requires listening to all the options in three categories). Onto the app and chat section, and after several back-and-forth conversations by text I'm told they can't help and I need to speak to someone, to which I explain the issue I have of trying to talk to a real person, so they give me a different number to call.

Another phone call and I finally get someone and find out that my limit is $10,000 and I need to prove my spending over the next 1 to 3 months before they adjust the spending limit. I ask, "what happened to the unlimited spend amount I was told about before, during and after the sign-up process?" Anyway, to cut a long story short, I want to transfer the funds across so that I can pay the bill and get the points. I am told it can be done online. Yeah sure, after more time wasted checking and re-checking, I find that it is not possible. Another call, and I'm told because I'm new it must be done over the phone.

Money transferred, now I have to wait "up to 72 hours". Happily, I found it in my account the next day, I pay the bill and get confirmation that it has gone through. 30 minutes later I get a phone call from Amex informing me that as a new client I have to do a once off and prove my BSB details match what they have on record, go online fill out a form and send a screen shot of my bank statement. I am flabbergasted, I need to give more proof to allow the funds that i put in the day before to be able to spend it, once only.

Off I go, online do all that is necessary. it is done but i have no confirmation that it is successful and no response telling me when and if I will receive confirmation of success or failure. I have 6 days to pay the bill, which should be enough, but if I'm late they hit me with a fee. I call Amex again, can't get through because of the recorded messages are not correct for me (I still haven't found the way to get to a real person). I try the app chat, only to be told that they can't help. I get back on the phone and finally work out that I need to listen to all the directory messages and wait after the last one, which takes me to another directory of messages that I must listen to all of and wait again, and then I get to wait for a person.

I am told that because I've just completed the form, they are unable to see it, I first explain how dumb their system is for a business where time is money, and then about the chanced of me having to pay interest/fee on a late payment if I've incorrectly filled out the form, and I need to know. the representative says hold and I'll go further, after a considerable time on hold he comes back and says that it is all good.

This experience has been beyond stupid. I hope that it is smooth sailing from here on out.

And why did I decide to post this? A customer of mine is traveling to the US in a week or two, he and his partner went to transfer money from their account for US currency in a specific travel account. They couldn't do it; the service would not accept their Bendigo bank or another which I can't remember. They had to travel to their bank, which is 1 and half hours away, to get the money and then back to finish the transaction.

Yes, there are benefits to a cashless system, but there is also time wasting and frustration, especially when it comes to trying to access your own money held in financial institutions. Yet hackers and fraudsters find it a fairly easy system to hack.

 

[farmerge]

I wasn't going to share my story, but I just had a conversation with a good customer that had a similar experience.

Under pressure from the ministry of finance, Qantas is offering large incentives to join up to one of their credit card partners. After researching all the business cards, it came down to two, our existing bank but with smaller benefits for the amount we spend, or Amex with much larger points bonus and other benefits. Signed up for Amex with an approved $30,000 p/m spend, got the card and was told that there is no limit on it. the following day went to pay a $22,000 bill but was declined.

Now we get to the point of where I started to get angry because of the waste of time and the pointless circles I had to go through. First, I logged in online, no luck there, then I called them only to be caught in an endless circle because none of the recorded options met my issue (much later I found out how to get a real person, it is not easy and requires listening to all the options in three categories). Onto the app and chat section, and after several back-and-forth conversations by text I'm told they can't help and I need to speak to someone, to which I explain the issue I have of trying to talk to a real person, so they give me a different number to call.

Another phone call and I finally get someone and find out that my limit is $10,000 and I need to prove my spending over the next 1 to 3 months before they adjust the spending limit. I ask, "what happened to the unlimited spend amount I was told about before, during and after the sign-up process?" Anyway, to cut a long story short, I want to transfer the funds across so that I can pay the bill and get the points. I am told it can be done online. Yeah sure, after more time wasted checking and re-checking, I find that it is not possible. Another call, and I'm told because I'm new it must be done over the phone.

Money transferred, now I have to wait "up to 72 hours". Happily, I found it in my account the next day, I pay the bill and get confirmation that it has gone through. 30 minutes later I get a phone call from Amex informing me that as a new client I have to do a once off and prove my BSB details match what they have on record, go online fill out a form and send a screen shot of my bank statement. I am flabbergasted, I need to give more proof to allow the funds that i put in the day before to be able to spend it, once only.

Off I go, online do all that is necessary. it is done but i have no confirmation that it is successful and no response telling me when and if I will receive confirmation of success or failure. I have 6 days to pay the bill, which should be enough, but if I'm late they hit me with a fee. I call Amex again, can't get through because of the recorded messages are not correct for me (I still haven't found the way to get to a real person). I try the app chat, only to be told that they can't help. I get back on the phone and finally work out that I need to listen to all the directory messages and wait after the last one, which takes me to another directory of messages that I must listen to all of and wait again, and then I get to wait for a person.

I am told that because I've just completed the form, they are unable to see it, I first explain how dumb their system is for a business where time is money, and then about the chanced of me having to pay interest/fee on a late payment if I've incorrectly filled out the form, and I need to know. the representative says hold and I'll go further, after a considerable time on hold he comes back and says that it is all good.

This experience has been beyond stupid. I hope that it is smooth sailing from here on out.

And why did I decide to post this? A customer of mine is traveling to the US in a week or two, he and his partner went to transfer money from their account for US currency in a specific travel account. They couldn't do it; the service would not accept their Bendigo bank or another which I can't remember. They had to travel to their bank, which is 1 and half hours away, to get the money and then back to finish the transaction.

Yes, there are benefits to a cashless system, but there is also time wasting and frustration, especially when it comes to trying to access your own money held in financial institutions. Yet hackers and fraudsters find it a fairly easy system to hack.

Well JohnDe if it was me in your shoes the explosion of frrustration would have been heard over at your side of the country. Fools, idiots and incompetence I do not tolerate in any shape or form.
Though I am glad to see that you prevailed and finally got an answer, but wow what a saga.

 

[qldfrog]

Well JohnDe if it was me in your shoes the explosion of frrustration would have been heard over at your side of the country. Fools, idiots and incompetence I do not tolerate in any shape or form.
Though I am glad to see that you prevailed and finally got an answer, but wow what a saga.

You will find that all banks here..and in the US are doing their upmost to ensure no bank run can even happen, they have the loops and process to ensure you can not withdraw any substantial amount of your own money be it to cash or to spend it.
Ready to lock your money.but is it still yours