Are you a winner or a loser - attitudes

[Glen48]

I am a winner I have one thing money can't buy.................poverty
Next question are some luckier than others???... I say yes.

 

[kincella]

look guys.....I started the thread to get some of you to start thinking, maybe even looking on the bright side of whatever it is you that is before you, or requires a response from you........
the media is full of bad news.....and then we have all these blog sites....so many people seem to be taking the opportunity to just argue about anything and everything.....
some people are pessimists by nature...or habit , others are optimists.....
just take a look from the other side sometimes....look outside the square you live in....
seems to be so many more negative views out there, than there are positive views

 

[CoffeeKing]

Monday.........- I'm a Winner
Tuesday....... - I'm a Grinner
Wednesday. - I'm a Sinner
Thursday..... - I'm a Loser
Friday.......... - I'm a Boozer

Weekends either win or lose, (depends on the races) LOL

 

[Trembling Hand]

....look outside the square you live in....
seems to be so many more negative views out there, than there are positive views

That saying completely ignores human psychology and even physiology. Every person is made of previous environment and current opportunity. Different peoples skills to handle the same event are hugely varied because of their training. Someone who grows up in a entrepreneurial environment, no matter how small, will see opportunity where others can only see adversity.

Simply saying look outside the box is as helpful as saying if you trade with disciple you will be a winner. Its not true you need skills to see a way to even start and you certainly need skills to succeed.

"Think outside the square" will trigger the same thoughts as inside because its the same person. The same person who has had a life time of hard wiring their thought process. If it was that easy everyone with a problem of mind/psychological would walk into a Psych office and get the reply to there problems "think outside the square" or think like someone you are not .

 

[James Austin]

look guys.....I started the thread to get some of you to start thinking, maybe even looking on the bright side of whatever it is you that is before you, or requires a response from you........
the media is full of bad news.....and then we have all these blog sites....so many people seem to be taking the opportunity to just argue about anything and everything.....
some people are pessimists by nature...or habit , others are optimists.....
just take a look from the other side sometimes....look outside the square you live in....
seems to be so many more negative views out there, than there are positive views

kincella
if you have to choose b/w the 2, your are right, it is better to be optimistic than pessimistic.

having said that, optimism really is just the flip side of pessimism, so you are still hemmed in, still warding off the shadow.

far better, kincella, to be free of both, to go about your business with a contented mind, neither swayed by this nor that, yet still responding appropriately to lifes many challenges.

. . . . is that out of the square enough for you??

 

[Julia]

Nuh, one may have personally registered `only` a failure but the impact on others may be far beyond a simple failure on your behalf.

OK. An example of which would be the Storm Financial advisers having failed which won't have an overtly adverse effect on their lives, but their failure has ruined lives of others. Good point.

I agree that we shouldn't let our fears trump our ability to move forward in life - but failures can definitely set you back further than where you started from. For example - committing to marrying somebody and having children is a big and risky step in life. If ten or fifteen years down the track you fail at it and divorce and move on you are definitely not back where you started.

Similarly if someone has ammassed say $500k at age 35 and then invests it into a business venture which over a 5 year period eventually fails and they lose it all they are also not back where they started.

But any failure, as the cliche goes, is a learning experience, and that which doesn't break you makes you stronger (as the other saying goes).

Also take this point, Cuttlefish.

I was thinking more of people who are afraid to try anything new.
For example the person who will never invest in the sharemarket, even in a bullmarket when blind freddy could have done well, but will always seek the perceived safety of a bank account.

Or the person who sticks with a job he/she hates because they're too afraid to make a move.

Or the couple who stick with a lousy relationship because it's become a habit.

But you're right. Certainly there can be adverse consequences. But in your example above, wouldn't you quit the business before you'd lost all your $500K? Isn't it a bit like having a stoploss on shares?

Risking anything needs to have an exit plan. If a few more people had exerted some risk control a year ago there wouldn't be so many devastated super funds now.

 

[kincella]

james, that sounds better , but outside the square...is outside of ones usual thought pattern...or limits....some people restrict themselves.....they need to go the extra mile..further away from the limits they place on selves....
like the sports stars....the successful ones go the ..extra mile, try harder...than the average ones...
I liken it to empathising....putting yourself in anothers shoes....try to think like they do....but choose carefully....who's shoes you try to walk in.....try to

seen a signature somewhere...poster says along the lines....walk in another mans shoes...after a mile you still have his shoes ., hahahaha ???

or the one about ' careful wrestling with a pig in mud....the pig will enjoy it more than you'

 

[cuttlefish]

Or the person who sticks with a job he/she hates because they're too afraid to make a move.

Or the couple who stick with a lousy relationship because it's become a habit.

cheers - this is a good illustration of your point. I guess life will always take us somewhere - whether we make active decisions or not. So if fear is preventing taking the risk of moving to a better place from a place we are unhappy with then by not acting we'll remain unhappy/unsatisfied - which ties in with your original idea that there isn't much to lose in making change.

However, something I've been investingating/experimenting with of late is how state of mind and attitude can affect our enjoyment of the situation we are presently in.

i.e. sometimes the change doesn't have to be an external change to achieve happiness and success - it might be an insight or awareness from within ourselves. Sometimes these insights into ourselves can have far more lasting consequences for our own inner happiness than active external changes.

This may be similar to the sort of thing that James Austin is talking about a few posts above.

i.e. To take the example of someone unhappy in their job. Instead of changing jobs, one might find that find that changing ones perception of and attitude to their existing job might enable them to find happiness (and success) within that job without needing to change - and that happiness is likely to be more lasting because it can be taken along to any other job or situation.

In a similar vein - someone may leave a job they dislike only to find themselves in another they dislike - and continue this pattern - always blaming the job rather than finding the opportunity within themselves.

This is just by way of example - I'm not advocating that people don't change jobs if they're in a lousy one! - but some things that are seen as impediments to success and happiness can be hard to change - for example health problems, or family ties. The ultimate success in some ways may be to be able to find happiness/success within any activity and situation via ones own mental attitude. (Again I guess this may be similar to the sort of idea James Austin is talking about above, and also to a fair extent is in line with a lot of the sentiments expressed in kincella's original post).

 

[aarbee]

Simply saying look outside the box is as helpful as saying if you trade with disciple you will be a winner. Its not true you need skills to see a way to even start and you certainly need skills to succeed..

In this context, I am thinking of the original Turtles. They did not have trading experience. However, the ones that succeeded apparently primarily did so because they followed the trading system with “discipline”. Atleast that’s what I got from that story. From personal experience, I think disciplined trading does help but to get anywhere to the level you are would of course require those “10,000 hours” to get experience and hone the skills.

Furthermore, the entire edifice of NLP seems to be built on the premise that “modeling” another person’s behaviour/habits etc could get you going in the direction that person’s achievements. However, to me that could only happen if the person has that quality of being “coachable”. None of the personal-development techniques would work if this quality is missing. OTOH, if that quality is present, one has the capability to look outside the square or step out of the comfort zone. It’s no wonder that different people attending the big ticket seminars get different results. One person’s life completely changes (shed’s the past baggage), while another goes away with a feeling that he/she wasted time and money attending it.

Cheers,

 

[Lancelot]

I feel like and am a

WINNER

I've seen no compelling evidence to prove otherwise

 

[Wysiwyg]

I feel like and am a

WINNER

I've seen no compelling evidence to prove otherwise

Nice suit and tie!

 

[Trembling Hand]

In this context, I am thinking of the original Turtles. They did not have trading experience. However, the ones that succeeded apparently primarily did so because they followed the trading system with “discipline”.

BS. They got trained and they developed skills. FULL STOP

 

[Lancelot]

Nice suit and tie!

And gun, dont forget the gun

 

[Glen48]

People do look on the bright side look at Made-off the warnings were there but they choice to ignore.
Is that being positive or negative?

If one goes with as much info as possible and then forms an opinion it has to be + or -.
Tell me where any good positive news to be found ?
the only good news in the past 6 mths the house prices in St Kilda.

I am sure we are in for bad time but am looking at other ways of making money such as CFD's even though my worst 3 years at school were trying to past grade 1 maths.

 

[2BAD4U]

Tell me where any good positive news to be found ?

Good positive news is everywhere, open your eyes. Or are you just focusing on the economy and finance? If so, then that's the entire point of this thread.

 

[Bill M]

james, that sounds better , but outside the square...is outside of ones usual thought pattern...or limits....some people restrict themselves.....they need to go the extra mile..further away from the limits they place on selves....
like the sports stars....the successful ones go the ..extra mile, try harder...than the average ones...
I liken it to empathising....putting yourself in anothers shoes....try to think like they do....but choose carefully....who's shoes you try to walk in.....try to

Hey kincella, there are always people who are positive regardless of the bad experiences that they have gone through. I love to talk to these people because they always see optimism and opportunity. Have you ever noticed most negative people are always negative?

I was overseas last year and ran into a retired guy, the share markets were imploding at the time, I asked him how he would deal with the situation. He said I'm seriously thinking of ploughing some decent money into the market (oz). He was a wealthy man who had a positive outlook and saw opportunity in a hopeless situation.

I myself look at 2009 as the bargain year of my lifetime. I am slowly building up my portfolio and I would like to buy an investment property too. Unfortunately property in my area is not cheap and not getting any cheaper so I will have to go where the opportunity is. If property isn't cheap I will follow through with other investments.

Life is what you make it, lots of doom and gloom reporting around right now and if one spends countless hours on the net reading it they just might start believing it. You can either mope around all day or cry in your beer and blame everybody for your woes or do something about it. I prefer to get on with my life and look for opportunities and there are plenty around.

Thinking outside the box? Nothing is ruled in or out for me, everything is worth looking at.

 

[Smurf1976]

Something I said about 3 years ago to a group of people at work. It's not an exact quote but something like this:

I'm more than happy to hear anything that anyone has to say on any subject work or otherwise. Indeed I'd rather you told me I'm wrong or you think I'm full of **** than kept it to yourself. And no, I won't take negative comments and use them against you, actually it's massively valuable information to hear. But be warned, if someone's complaining about it then I'll do something about it.

Interesting results to say the least. Some make it happen, some are productive but not leaders (nothing really wrong with that as long as they're happy not being a boss etc) and some are constant whingers.

Best way to put it would be to say that I've made life hell for the whingers and they've done their best to do the same for me. They sure like to complain, but have fought incredibly hard against literally every significant thing done to fix the problems they complain about.

 

[Julia]

Hey kincella, there are always people who are positive regardless of the bad experiences that they have gone through. I love to talk to these people because they always see optimism and opportunity. Have you ever noticed most negative people are always negative?

True. Sometimes described as having a "pessimistic explanatory style".

I was overseas last year and ran into a retired guy, the share markets were imploding at the time, I asked him how he would deal with the situation. He said I'm seriously thinking of ploughing some decent money into the market (oz). He was a wealthy man who had a positive outlook and saw opportunity in a hopeless situation.

Not everyone would agree with this. How does he know that the market won't react as following the last Great Depression where it took about 25 years to make a new high? If he's already retired, has he considered the possibility that he might not be around to enjoy the recovery?
Another option would be to wait on the sidelines until you see some confirmation of confidence having returned and then buy in. Sure you might miss the bottom, but you stand less chance of watching your capital diminish further.
How many people were calling a bottom six or more months ago?

I myself look at 2009 as the bargain year of my lifetime. I am slowly building up my portfolio and I would like to buy an investment property too. Unfortunately property in my area is not cheap and not getting any cheaper so I will have to go where the opportunity is. If property isn't cheap I will follow through with other investments.

Life is what you make it, lots of doom and gloom reporting around right now and if one spends countless hours on the net reading it they just might start believing it.

Alternatively, the doom and gloom might in fact be pure reality and all your positive take might be pure fantasy.
Much better to be realistic imo.

There was an article by, I think, Michael West in the SMH a few days ago along the lines of "Those people who panicked a year ago were right after all".
Many commentators expounded the view you've expressed above and said OK folks, just hang in there, it will all be just okey dokey. So that's what a lot of folks did. Are they regretting it now? You bet.

It is sometimes said that a depressed person is the one who actually has the realistic take on life. Whilst I wouldn't go that far, I can't see much advantage in deluding ourselves that all is going to be AOK within the near future, or even the medium term.

However, that's just my view, and good luck to anyone who regards buying now as the opportunity of a lifetime.

 

[GumbyLearner]

I am a winner I have one thing money can't buy.................poverty
Next question are some luckier than others???... I say yes.

Great post Glen.

"Wealth keeps out only one of life's evils, and that is poverty"
Dr. Samuel Johnson

 

[Bill M]

Alternatively, the doom and gloom might in fact be pure reality and all your positive take might be pure fantasy.
Much better to be realistic imo.

When I venture out my front door every day to take my 2 hour walks I still see the queues to get into cafes, the same happy people on their walks, people going to work and same old same old. At night I go out to my local and it's the same guys drinking away having a good laugh, from factory workers to Government workers all having a good time. All is well on the home front. Still vacancies can not be filled due to lack of workers, the local rag had 5 pages of employment in it. I will start worrying when all that disappears and when we stop hiring foreign workers to fill the extreme shortages we have here. In my wife's job they are constantly short of staff. I think there is far far too much doom and gloom around right now and until I note with my own eyes otherwise I just don't believe it, not yet anyway. Gosh in my area going to an "open for inspection" means I have to fight with marauding hordes of others to buy that piece of real estate, now that is being realistic.