Essendon - Supporter Support

[Sean K]

Watched a replay of the second half and it was pretty even. Pretty ordinary footy too. Too many errors.

Did Hurley get a kick?

Gumby looks like he could come good if he stays on the field.

 

[gav]

Why have West Coast produced such good mobile ruckman in recent years? Even Freo have that monster 211. Their third choice Seaby has ended up at Sydney and is having a solid season. Gardiner ended up at St.Kilda.

Unfortunately the same can't be said about West Coast's forward line. Our best full forward in the last 20 years has been Peter Sumich Even when you look back 4-5 years ago when West Coast were at their best, they had no real forward line. They relied on midfielders to kick a couple of goals each (which they did consistantly).

LeCras is the best small forward in the league IMO, but we need a decent big target up forward with him. Some say Kennedy will play this role, but I'm not convinced yet. Now with Kerr injurred, the number 1 opposition tagger will go straight to Priddis. It seems Cox and NicNat better get used to roving their own hit outs...

This I agree with, Essendon had chances to kick 5 or 6 goals in the 3rd quarter and get themselves back in the game but couldn't find the big sticks.

West Coast weren't much chop last night imo, plenty of turnovers etc but to be able to blow the Bombers out of the water like that in the second quarter highlights just where the bombers are at atm. Most of Essendon goals in that first quarter were from very poor West Coast turnovers and besides them the bombers never looked like scoring.

I agree. West Coast fought hard for the footy in the first quarter, but missed opportunities and turn overs kept the Bombers in the game. They were good in the second quarter, but were terrible in the second half. Any half-decent team would have beaten West Coast comfortably last night.

I've been a big critic of Watson in the past, but he was one of the few that put in 100% for the Dons last night.

 

[Duckman#72]

Unfortunately I've been a big critic of Watson in the past, but he was one of the few that put in 100% for the Dons last night.

Yes his work in and around traffic is one of the best in the current game. He tried hard and was one of a very few Bombers that could hold his head high from last night.

Duckman

 

[Lachlan6]

Gumby looks like he could come good if he stays on the field.

Yes Kennas we actually were only blown away in the second qtr when Natanui ran rings around us. Why Knights took soo long to react to this I will never know. Hille was clearly mismatched in the ruck and Ryder was clearly the better option against Natanui.

But Gumby. I have been holding out hope for him and continue to do so I suppose, but there was a replay of one of his set shots. It was appaling. He actually threw the ball up before kicking it. It was a horrible technique and I must say has given me some serious doubts about his football ability.

Was Welsh on Priddis? Probably should have been. Not a great deal to take from that game. Theoretically we can only drop 7 more games from here on. Going to be tough.

 

[Duckman#72]

Which of the following summaries do you agree with?


Firstly - The Glass is Half Full

2010 was always going to be a difficult one. We overachieved last year and spluttered into the finals on the back of Hawthorn and Port Adelaide performing worse than us. So while there were elements of 2009 that were exciting and encouraging - we were a long way from "Arriving" as a credible football club.

After 4 rounds last year we were 2-2, this year we are 1-3. In a nutshell, the big difference was losing to Freo this year, whereas last year we won at Telstra Dome. The loss to Freo, while painful, revolves around some very strong form lines around them. Last year there was the obligatory woeful loss interstate to Port, there was a win over Carlton and there was a mediocre, tired loss against North.

While we have gone backwards, I'm not convinced that it is either huge nor big. People sometimes remember Essendon in 2009 as the "up and coming" competitive speed machine after their upset wins over Carlton, St Kilda, Collingwood and Hawthorn. What they forget are the losses to North, West Coast, Richmond and Freo. We played some very disappointing football in 2009 - we couldn't even sure up 8th spot until the last week of the home and away rounds (despite the other contenders doing everything they could to get us over the line).

We have had one disappointing loss this year - Eagles. We were competitive and agressive against Geelong up until midway through the 3rd quarter. We were competitive against Freo until the second half. We beat Carlton. While we haven't "clicked" this year, it hasn't been all bad.

Don't forget that it was only after we lost Hille in the ANZAC Day game that Ryder hit his straps and we started to gain momentum. Until then we were performing exactly like this year - some very good, some very bad, most of it not very memorable.

While the start of the season has been disappointing, there are some storng signs in Melksham, Colyer, Howlett and Gumbleton. Hurley is now back in the side and should provide a strong forward option. Essendon Version 2010 is slightly below Essendon Version 2009 at this stage of the season - ANZAC Day and the next 6 weeks will determine how this football club is really travelling.

Secondly - The Glass is Half Empty

When I first started this thread it was in 2007 and Essendon had experience another loss from a game that they "should have won". The disappointing aspect and worrying thing is that 3 years later and we are still writing about the same thing. Have we developed, matured and now closer to success then back in 2007? Probably not. And don't forget 2007 was still 6 years after their last Grand Final appearance (and ultimate breakup of the 2001 powerhouse team). So what have the Bombers achieved in almost a decade of football?

You could argue that they are a team full of potential, with some exciting players, some servicebale old warriors, some players who will never make it and some players that you love to watch. The sad thing is that you could make that assessment of most of the current AFL sides. Essendon potential is no more or less than most others - and in fact it is arguable that teams like Melbourne, North Melbourne and certainly Fremantle have now jumped above them on the rung as teams they will be fighting for for the last couple spots son the ladder.

How did it get to this? Essendon's draft picks have been in the main - forgettable. I know injuries play a part, but while other teams have been picking franchise players the Bombers have been going nowhere. Essendon is the only club that has never had a No 1 draft pick......but they way we seem to pick players, it wouldn't matter if we did, we'd pick the wrong one.

If you look at our list - it is full of players that are what I call "serviceable clubmen". The fill the position but on their own you need to question if they have the class, skills and ability to take the club to the next level. I'll give you some examples. Dyson, Winderlich, Welsh, McVeigh(now), Slattery to name a few. Don't get me wrong - these guys can play a blinder. It is just that in between them there are 6 ordinary performances.

Essendon is no closer to finding consistency in skill and decision making than they were 5 years ago. We keep talking about the potential of players like Dempsey, Hooker, Daniher, Reimers, Monfires and how good they'll be "soon". There comes a time when you look down your list and these players have played 5 seasons and 100 games....and you are still saying "they'll develop soon". Arguably our last 8 years has been about supporters waiting for these players to match their potential!!! What is to say that the 2010 are any closer to meeting theirs?? Nothing.

Duckman

 

[DAZT49]

The club has made some poor decisions over a long period of time.
First and biggest was not to sack Sheedy at half time in the 1990 Grand Final .
For such a rich club I dont know why we went "on the cheap" to get a coach like Knights.
Gary O'Donnel was an obvious choice after a successful apprentiship under Mathews (spit!!) at Brisbane.
The railroading of Loydy,(Whos going to kick 5-6 goals a game??)
the demise of Lucas and Murray left the forward half looking weak.
Maybe Hille could slot at full forward but he is too slow.
Rider?
And while I was no big fan of McFee (most uncontested marks in AFL history?)on occassions he could be a presence,especially when he had his hair tipped a la Roo.
McVeigh is good but just looks angry all the time.
The rest are plodders or little blokes running around.
Jobe Watson...Essondons most overated player ever.
My local footy club, The Mooroolbark Falcons (where I believe
Hocking comes from) could give my team of 50 years a go atm.
Sorry if I seem bitter.
This can all be put right if we flog the Maggies on Anzac Day

 

[Duckman#72]

This can all be put right if we flog the Maggies on Anzac Day

That is so true. Right out of the "glass half full" handbook.

A week can be a long time in football. It is dangerous to make an assessment of teams based on week to week performances. Look how well Hawthorn had been playing and how competitive they've been this year and look at the display they threw up last night. If it weren't for Luke Hodge and the terrible kicking display by the Pies it would have been well in excess of a 100 point loss.

As a side issue - Nomores, you asked how slow Hocking was. Based on last nights game I'd say about as fast as Sam Mitchell(lol).

We beat the Pies next week - and the glass is looking half full. We lose and it is back to half empty.

Duckman

 

[IFocus]

How/why Melb took Jack Watts over him will forever be one of the worlds great mysteries

There was a big question over the big lamp shade as to whether he had a football head. I watched him play a fair bit at Swan Districts and to be honest I wasn't convinced

I am now

 

[Sean K]

I'm neither half full or empty in regard to judging Essendon.

I think our past few years are just part of the natural cycle of things as opposed to any really bad decisions.

I think the club made some very poor recruiting decisions over the past few years, but some others were good. The balance probably tips to the poor side perhaps.

I don't understand why O'Donnel wasn't given the job ahead of Knights. He must have cocked up the interviews. Or, he's just not main coach material, he should have stepped up by now if he was going to.

 

[Putty7]

No Duckman thankfully I didn't go to the game, West Coast were ordinary and Essendon were worse, another game where the Auskick at half time would have been the highlight of the night for Dons supporters.

This week we have Collingwood who smashed the Hawks and if they had of kicked straight it would have been worse, admittedly they didn't have Buddy but still, they are travelling better than we are as nomore4s has pointed out.

You can't pin all the blame on the coach, but at the moment we are playing a pre Mark Harvey Dockers style of play that lost them so many games and never looked like delivering the goods, where is the dash and run and move forward at all costs brand of football that was so impressive early last year aka Geelong style, gone because teams worked out how to counter it by blocking the run through the centre of the ground and Knights doesn't seem to have a plan B.

It has been said in reference to James Hird becoming a future Essendon coach that a great player doesn't necessarily transfer into being a great coach, I think we may be seeing that now with what we have. You can say a lot about how bad the players are etc etc but they are playing to a game plan which isn't working.

At the end of the first quarter we were still in with half a chance, the second quarter most of the team was in the Eagles forward half trying to thwart big Nicks influence, if Ryder had gone to the ruck it would have been a better match up with Hille taking Cox, still not ideal but a better match up, the few turn overs we got in the second quarter had no where to go but back into the Eagles forward half because there was nothing there, why play like that when your opposition just isn't playing that well, you may as well concede the game before you go to the trouble of getting on a plane. We got a few goals in the last quarter but it was all over by then and the Eagles had gone home.

When Ryder actually went for the ball and jumped early he looked ok against Nick Nat, when he and Hille focused on the man and not the ball they looked second rate. With a young ruckman jump into it early and make him earn it and maybe counter some of the dominance but go the ball that's what you are there for to win the bloody ruck contest.

Yes I am still a bit angry and it's now Tuesday, a few days having passed, supporter support is a good title for this thread and we are going to need it. If they manage to pull a rabbit out of the hat and beat the Collywobblers I would be very surprised, still it would go with my theory that they are following the Dockers style of old, they only showed up twice a year to do the Eagles.

 

[Duckman#72]

It has been said in reference to James Hird becoming a future Essendon coach that a great player doesn't necessarily transfer into being a great coach, I think we may be seeing that now with what we have. You can say a lot about how bad the players are etc etc but they are playing to a game plan which isn't working.

I watch James Hird "On the Couch" and relish the thought of him one day pulling the reins at Bomberland. The man is all class at whatever I've seen him attempt. There's a fair chance coaching would be no different.

Duckman

 

[Sean K]

Going to the game this weekend. First time I will have seen one live in 3 years. Whoohoo!!

 

[Putty7]

I watch James Hird "On the Couch" and relish the thought of him one day pulling the reins at Bomberland. The man is all class at whatever I've seen him attempt. There's a fair chance coaching would be no different.

Duckman

I agree, I think a lot will come down to how Essendon go through the season and if they need a positive change at the end of it, there are a lot of supporters already calling for blood but Knights might still have a few tricks left up his sleeve, the second is weather or not Hirdy is keen, he doesn't do things by half and generally excells at something when he has a go, he has to want it. I don't think supporters would have a problem with it and I certainly wouldn't.

Good onya Kennas, hope its a better game than the last few.

 

[bloomy88]

I watch James Hird "On the Couch" and relish the thought of him one day pulling the reins at Bomberland. The man is all class at whatever I've seen him attempt. There's a fair chance coaching would be no different.

Duckman

At this stage we really need Hirdy back on the field. Would still be the best player at the club if he pulled on the boots now.

We'll knock off the Pies this week though. Go the Dons

 

[Duckman#72]

Well done Collingwood - too fast, too committed, too talented.

Absolutely gutted.

I'll comment when I am again in full control of my actions.

Duckman

 

[Putty7]

Not angry today, not even surprised really, the Pies were to good from the first bounce and never looked like taking the backseat through the entire game, after watching last weeks poor effort against a weaker side I wasn't expecting much against an inform side.

Feel a bit sorry for Kennas for having to sit through that rot after not seeing a live game for a few years but it pretty much sums up where we are at compared to one of the better sides this year.

Hope the Auskick was worth watching Kennas

 

[Putty7]

Well done Collingwood - too fast, too committed, too talented.

Absolutely gutted.

I'll comment when I am again in full control of my actions.

Duckman

We had a power blackout and missed the first quarter, so Western Power got some of my wrath lol, it came on for the start of the second quarter and I had to look 2 or 3 times to make sure I was seeing the score right so it was all over before I saw it get going.

I wonder if Hirdy is hurting enough yet to consider a career in coaching ?

 

[Duckman#72]

We had a power blackout and missed the first quarter, so Western Power got some of my wrath lol, it came on for the start of the second quarter and I had to look 2 or 3 times to make sure I was seeing the score right so it was all over before I saw it get going.

Bombers supporters thought 2006 was bad!!! Look out 2010!!!

With the slim chance of finals now fully evaporated, the Bombers can start making some serious changes.

With reckless abandon I'd make the following moves:

1. For the rest of the year play Houli and give him a decent chance to find his feet.

2. Start preparing Ricky Dyson for life after football. He has minimal ability and impact on a game after being around the AFL for over 6 years. Needs to go. While we are at it, may as well pack up Winderlich's locker as well. Same story. These two guys are just stopping the development of players like Howlett, Jetta etc. They are never going to be the players that make the club successful.

3. Play Neagle - Knights sure as hell didn't do much to encourage Lloyd to continue, so he better start developing a full forward quickly. If Neagle doesn't do anything get rid of him at the end of the season - but you have to play him.

4. Our midfield is one dimensional. We are obviously missing Lovatt more than I thought we would. We cannot continue to play Welsh and McVeigh in the centre (some would say the same side). McVeigh has become just another back pocket player - his 2008 form has gone, possibly never to be seen again. As for Welsh - I never agreed with the decision to make him VC. We need some freshness and spark in the midfield. I'd play Zaharakis and Reimers in midfield roles. Watson, Prismall, Stanton, and Hocking all have a similar "feel" about them.

5. I'd give Dempsey a licence to follow the footy and play more on the ball.

6. Drop Ryder. The only reason Hille isn't being dropped is benefit of the doubt after his injury last year. Can someone explain how Hille can get outmarked by Luke Ball? Ryder has also been woeful to date. Bring Laycock in and play him in the forward line. Let Ryder find some form in the two's and make him realise he isn't an automatic starter.

7. Do something about the game plan. PLEASE!! Is anyone else sick of watching 2 foot handpasses going backwards to a person in a worse position?

8. Keep playing Melksham, Colyer etc and bring in Long and others ASAP. Give them game time NOW.

9. Play Myers until the end of the season. For a high choice draft pick he's been a disappointment to date. Lets see what happens if he's a regular in the side.

10. Change tackling coaches. Some of the half-assed efforts today were straight out embarrassing. Our desire to put the body on the line was sadly missing.

11. Don't get too attached to Hurley. With performances like that he's a certain starter for the Gold Coast.

More concerning is our attitude. We are playing like a team that doesn't believe in themselves or each other. Morale seems very low. They are not putting in the 1%er's. At least against Geelong and Freo in R1 & 2 they showed some spirit.

Once again I can't help but think that we are no closer to finals success than we were 5 years ago. Where are our Sidebottom's , Pendlebury's, Beams' and Wellingham's?

Duckman

 

[nomore4s]

Don't worry Duckman, even your lot should be able to beat the decimated Hawks next Sat night

No ruckman at all last night and with no height in our backline even Neagle & Gumby should be able to kick a bag on us. And we might even play your 2 ruckman into form for you.

I'm really starting to question Knights coaching ability, the lack of improvement in quite a few players this year is a worry, also the strength & conditioning staff need to look at putting some weight on a few of your players.

Was amusing when even the crowd are cheering everytime Essendon decided to kick out of defence instead of handballing to a team mate under more pressure then the ball carrier, certainly tells you there is something wrong with the game plan.

 

[Lachlan6]

I watch James Hird "On the Couch" and relish the thought of him one day pulling the reins at Bomberland. The man is all class at whatever I've seen him attempt. There's a fair chance coaching would be no different.

Could not agree more. I just hope he wants to coach this team. Yesterday was like a time warp watching the game from the G. It felt like the 'long gone' days of Peverill and the like running around. What is going on with the handball a few metres to a bloke with someone right on his hammer! It really doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that will be be a turnover? Is Mathew Knights just not that intelligent. I really am starting to wonder. His previous record at Bendigo was woeful and although he was only assistant coach the record at Port Adelaide (SANFL) does'nt stack up either.

The problem is we cannot start messing with our new playing groups collective psyche by continually losing. Who has a direct line to Hirdy?