Rugby League Louts

[Prospector]

Once they heard what her workmates had to say, balanced with the other circs of the case, that would have lessened their enthusiasm to prosecute this matter...surely?

having said that, it does sound like they did a thorough investigation, and I get the sense the local cops are pretty disgusted by the behaviour of said "louts"

Yes, it would certainly provide a context for it awg. I am sure they did do a thorough job, you just have to work with what you have. And the Officer they interviewed certainly seemed to have given her considerable support, years later, and yes, I suspect in 'the old days' some different kind of punishment may have been handed out.

 

[bunyip]

I do actually feel sorry for Johns; quite obviously he did something which after an hour or so he deeply regretted (having sex with the girl, not saying her raped her!), and has paid silently all these years, confessed to his wife at the time, and now publically outed.

Geez Prospector....you're feeling sorry for Johns?? You're a woman.....he treated your gender with absolute disrespect by what he did with that slutty little girl, and by his total lack of respect and consideration for his wife. And you're feeling sorry for him?!

That sort of behaviour by a married man is just about as low as a man can stoop. Any trauma or embarrassment he's gone through since then is far less than he deserves. The bloke is a scumbag, and I don't care how sorry he claims to be or what he's done since then to redeem himself.
His wife should have treated him like the creep he is by booting him out and getting herself a real man who respects women.

And I'll refute any argument from anyone who says 'we all make mistakes'.
Johns didn't make a mistake - he made a conscious decision to have sex with a bimbo, well aware that he was committing a vile insult against his wife.
That's not a mistake - it's a calculated act of the lowest order by a person of the lowest order.

Johns is not worthy of sympathy from you or me or anyone else - he's worthy only of contempt.

 

[awg]

there is a clause in their contracts about " bringing the game into disrepute"
(although its a bit like the person Alan Bond sued for slander, their defence was it not possible to slander his reputation").

This means anyone who gets their name in the paper for impropriety can be censured.

It is the same for corporate or Govt employees too.

If i was on $300k, at Freehills, ATO, CBA etc..and it was MY name in the media, I would be stood down.

they will have to maintain standards of decency..haha

I still find the media treatment hypocritical, and I reckon there will be some fallout in TV land...they play it hard...but doing a hatchet job on Matt Johns will cause bitter emnities

 

[Calliope]

This is the big issue that needs to be dealt with imo. These guys have learnt to cover there bases. The NRL players can be put in as many education programs as you like and this situation will still arise. Women also need to learn that clearly stating 'no' in a situation she is initially unsure of is vital. Being taught that assertiveness is needed in these situations is clearly a must. Alcohol consumption is also a massive factor.

I think, moXJO, that assertiveness is what gets a lot of young (and not so young) women into these predicaments in the first place. Their search for equality has encouraged them to adopt the worst traits normally found in young men.

The list is long; bad language, coarse language, binge drinking, falling down drunk and vomiting in the steets, belching and farting, and promiscuity which includes aggressively accosting men for a "good root"

Strangely enough they haven't taken up spitting, but only I think, because they are no good at it.

 

[Calliope]

Johns is not worthy of sympathy from you or me or anyone else - he's worthy only of contempt.

Putting on a contrite expression, shedding a few crocodile tears and saying sorry is a proven recipe for winning sympathy practised by some of our biggest scumbags.

 

[moXJO]

I think, moXJO, that assertiveness is what gets a lot of young (and not so young) women into these predicaments in the first place. Their search for equality has encouraged them to adopt the worst traits normally found in young men.

The list is long; bad language, coarse language, binge drinking, falling down drunk and vomiting in the steets, belching and farting, and promiscuity which includes aggressively accosting men for a "good root"

Strangely enough they haven't taken up spitting, but only I think, because they are no good at it.

Yes, but when placed in these situations obviously the false(drunken) bravado falls away. And also alcohol, I know I keep harping on about it. But I have seen some horrible examples of women being trashed out of their minds as of late. And everyone seems to think that it’s normal, or not much of a problem.

 

[scanspeak]

The hypocrisy of Channel 9 in all of this is staggering given that earlier in the year they were peddling Ladettes to ladies.

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/story/0,28383,25000987-5016681,00.html

"The first episode, to screen on Channel 9 on February 16, features:

CONTESTANTS taking down their pants and pressing buttocks against a bus window.

A DRUNK Zoe Irons vomiting violently into a bucket.

DRUNKEN contestants with their pants down, squatting behind a bus, to heed calls of nature.

FITTING of a sex toy with batteries.

NICOLE Mitchell pushing her breasts in a strip club patron's face and asking for a "10-drink minimum" before she can strip.

CONTESTANT Mitchell pretending to be a DJ by spinning a CD on a nipple.

A CONTESTANT showing contempt for school instructors by hitching up her skirt and giving them a close-up of her backside.

Melbourne psychologist Dr Janet Hall is disgusted such behaviour is televised when society is struggling to curb anti-social behaviour prompted by alcohol abuse.

"The impact on viewers could be a double-edged sword. Some may judge these women as representing all women and therefore fair game for low-level encounters. Some may see them as role models to follow," she said. "

 

[Calliope]

Only in Queensland can you be a grub and a hero at the same time. Premier Bligh said today that " our heroes should act like heroes"

By that she meant that Hunt, Thaiday and Boyd should apologise to the woman involved in their sleazy acts in the nightclub toilet.

 

[scanspeak]

I've always found it perplexing that guys kicking a ball around an oval should be considered "heroes".

 

[bunyip]

I've always found it perplexing that guys kicking a ball around an oval should be considered "heroes".

Me too. Why would anyone hero-worship a bunch of cowards and thugs who couldn't act like real men if they tried.
Similarly, why would anyone feel sorry for these clowns when their grubby escapades land them in hot water.

One of the problems with Rugby League is that many of the officials are former players themselves, with principles and values that apparently are little different to those displayed by the current players.
Hence, they take a pathetically lenient stance on the issue of poor behaviour, rather than bring down severe penalties to stamp it out.
And so, the bad eggs are allowed to stay in the game rather than being booted out to make way for younger players with talent and enough brains to behave themselves.

 

[kitehigh]

I've always found it perplexing that guys kicking a ball around an oval should be considered "heroes".

Me too!!
I detest this whole worship celebratory culture. I don't give a toss who someone is or isn't, they could be the crown prince. I judge people on their actions and how they treat people.

Unfortunately we have people treated as heroes and celebrities in our society and than said people feel that they can get away with just about anything. To make the matter worse you get these pathetic groupies chasing after these so called heroes.

I don't watch sport as I'd much rather spend my time doing rather than watching.

 

[Julia]

I think, moXJO, that assertiveness is what gets a lot of young (and not so young) women into these predicaments in the first place. Their search for equality has encouraged them to adopt the worst traits normally found in young men.

.

Your comment here shows a complete misunderstanding of assertiveness.
It has nothing to do with 'equality' or aggression.

Assertiveness is the skill of behaving with self respect, and respect towards others, whilst not accepting being taken advantage of or treated badly.

An assertive person - whether male or female - will know how to communicate their feelings to others whilst at the same time being prepared to listen genuinely to the response of that other person, and understand that other person's point of view.

It means having the capacity to objectively understand a situation and not be a victim, whether of your own emotions or those of other people.

It means being prepared to apologise when you are wrong, and sometimes to admit that you just don't know something.

It means standing up for yourself but not in that process trampling on the rights of others.

I've always found it perplexing that guys kicking a ball around an oval should be considered "heroes".

Me too. Why would anyone hero-worship a bunch of cowards and thugs who couldn't act like real men if they tried.
Similarly, why would anyone feel sorry for these clowns when their grubby escapades land them in hot water.

.

Me too!!
I detest this whole worship celebratory culture. I don't give a toss who someone is or isn't, they could be the crown prince. I judge people on their actions and how they treat people.

Unfortunately we have people treated as heroes and celebrities in our society and than said people feel that they can get away with just about anything. To make the matter worse you get these pathetic groupies chasing after these so called heroes.

Add me to this list too. What's to like, let alone worship!

 

[Julia]

Amongst this thread, the concept of infidelity has been given little consideration.

A couple of us expressed some sympathy for Trish Johns, whereupon Calliope asserted that "she would have known what she was letting herself in for" and clearly had no compassion for her situation. I'm not so sure that when she married Johns she would necessarily have been able to predict his future behaviour. But I don't know. He could be right.

Then later, when someone else indicated a similar sympathy, and even included Johns himself as a subject of some sympathy, Bunyip was outraged that Mrs Johns could bring herself to stay with this unfaithful creep.

Marriages hold together and split up for all sorts of reasons. I expect in the case of the Johns' there could be some financial attractions attached to staying with him, plus I understand they have children. Outrage and self respect are very fine, but sometimes other considerations outweigh this righteousness.

Thinking about this led me to wonder how ASF members feel about infidelity in their own relationships?

I heard a comment on the radio this evening that "if it was just sex as it was in the Johns incident", it wouldn't really mean much. But if were a long term emotionally involved relationship, then it's a whole other story.

So how do you see this? What standards apply in your relationships?
Would you forgive infidelity? How would you re-establish trust once it has been lost? Do you see other aspects of a marriage or long term relationship as equally important, e.g. children or finances, even friends and social life?

 

[scanspeak]

Julia, I think what Calliope may have meant was "bravado", rather than assertiveness. Lots of women have bravado in spades. "More front than Myer" is the phrase that comes to mind.

As for infidelity, I have a zero tolerance policy. If my girl was unfaithful (and it has happened in previous relationships) I would lose any respect or trust in her. The relationship would be over.

 

[bunyip]

Then later, when someone else indicated a similar sympathy, and even included Johns himself as a subject of some sympathy, Bunyip was outraged that Mrs Johns could bring herself to stay with this unfaithful creep.

Julia

I'm incredulous, but not outraged, that Trish Johns stuck with her pathetic husband.
Any outrage I feel is directed towards Johns for treating his wife in such a shabby and disrespectful manner.
Also I'm disgusted that he insulted the integrity of my gender by his actions.

Thanks to him and his kind, men are more than ever getting a reputation as sex-crazed fools who will take it wherever they can get it, with no consideration for the consequences.
But not all of us are like that.....I'm 27 years married and although I've looked at plenty of women other than my wife, and had plenty of thoughties, I've never been even remotely tempted to go any further than that.
There are plenty of blokes just like me who place a high value on being loyal to their partners. We have contempt for the Mathew Johns types and their low moral standards and their disrespect for women.

 

[Prospector]

I certainly couldnt dismiss the images I would retain of this experience, so I dont know how she has stayed with her husband. Rather like the way Shane Warne's wife (Simone?) seems to keep bouncing back to him; guess its lonely on your own after the celebrity world - no-one wants to know you. And there is that feeling that they were just 'silly boys doing silly boys things' - hence the names - Matty, Warney - like they never grew up. Peter Pan boys.

Infidelity is a real deal breaker for me; once the trust is gone, what do you have left? But maybe for them, they go into the relationship never having the trust in the first place? As someone said, maybe they knew exactly what they were going to get when they married and decided to accept whatever comes? Turned a blind eye to it (except not this time!) rather like the women in 'Underbelly' did.

 

[Calliope]

Your comment here shows a complete misunderstanding of assertiveness.
It has nothing to do with 'equality' or aggression.

Assertiveness is the skill of behaving with self respect, and respect towards others, whilst not accepting being taken advantage of or treated badly.

An assertive person - whether male or female - will know how to communicate their feelings to others whilst at the same time being prepared to listen genuinely to the response of that other person, and understand that other person's point of view.

It means having the capacity to objectively understand a situation and not be a victim, whether of your own emotions or those of other people.

It means being prepared to apologise when you are wrong, and sometimes to admit that you just don't know something.

It means standing up for yourself but not in that process trampling on the rights of others.

Thanks for the lecture. Your definition is the feminist new age definition. I of course, used the word in the in the sense, as my dictionary defines it as;

"Expressing oneself forcefully or boldly", or as scanspeak suggests with bravado.

It probably also means sticking up for your rights, which I suppose includes the right to behave badly.

 

[Mr J]

Some opinions here are a little too black and white for my taste. Not much point getting into it, as I can already tell it won't be a productive conversation.

 

[Farencue]

Agree with you Mr J

 

[investorpaul]

Infidelity is a real deal breaker for me; once the trust is gone, what do you have left? But maybe for them, they go into the relationship never having the trust in the first place? As someone said, maybe they knew exactly what they were going to get when they married and decided to accept whatever comes? Turned a blind eye to it (except not this time!) rather like the women in 'Underbelly' did.

IMO they love the lifestyle so they turn a blind eye or try and forget about what there husbands/partners get up to.

Basically they dont want to miss out on the parties, the fast cars, nice houses and overseas holidays.