The power of the mind

[Sean K]

Dear all,

There has been quite a few threads over the past year or so about God, and religion, and prayer, and belief, and Ben Cousins, and brain capacity, etc, and I though a new discussion on what the human brain might be capable of might be appropriate.

This is a pretty broard subject of course, so it might sway in any direction.

I'm only going to open it up right now, and not add anything until I have a more specific topic of discussion to add.

I hope the rationalist/humanists will be all over it, and we come to some fantastic ideas about the how and why we are.

 

[doctorj]

Woah, you didn't just buy a copy of 'The Secret' or something did you?

 

[surfingman]

Woah, you didn't just buy a copy of 'The Secret' or something did you?

A different movie from Star Wars series has been on TV Saturday nights for the last few weeks..

 

[2020hindsight]

this from "videos with message"...
this one proves that the brain is bludy powerful - hauntingly powerful in fact (in this case anyway)
(this is bound to be a youtube by now)

I think this story is one of the ones that I have a problem with - very difficult to explain - sits outside my understanding / philosophy etc

you have wysiwyg to thank for this post
as just "posted" on channel 9's "60 minutes"
http://video.stumbleupon.com/#p=i85su1w6uz The Boy With The Incredible Brain

autistic savants (Daniel Tammet)
this man's a genius in his own way.
recites "pi" to heaps of decimal places ( goes on for hours - way beyond the computer lol)

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/savant
sa·vant (sā-vänt') Pronunciation Key n.
1. A learned person; a scholar.
2. An idiot savant.

au·tism Pronunciation Key - noun
1. Psychiatry. a pervasive developmental disorder of children, characterized by impaired communication, excessive rigidity, and emotional detachment.
2. a tendency to view life in terms of one's own needs and desires.

 

[Sean K]

Woah, you didn't just buy a copy of 'The Secret' or something did you?

Yep, something equivalent about 20 years ago, and it hasn't got me anywhere.

I believe more in the mind than anything celestial or extraterrestrial.

Very happy for some Space Being to leap into my head right now, but I think there's more to be gained from enhancing the brain.

Also, I look forward to understanding the total CRAP that the brain sends us, which is totally duff.

 

[doctorj]

On the other hand, I look forward to understanding the total CRAP that the brain send us, which is totally duff.

That's just the drugs

 

[Sean K]

That's just the drugs

LOL.

The Shaman I went to last weekend would absolutlely totally agree....

 

[Sean K]

LOL.

The Shaman I went to last weekend would absolutlely totally agree....

I should add, that I've concluded the 'Shaman' was more Zen Psychoanalysts than Nature Spirit Man....

That's another story though.

 

[Julia]

Great topic, Kennas.

Many people have claimed that they have recovered from cancer e.g. (substitute many other diseases) by visualising their bodies as healthy and 'thinking the disease' away.
A couple of weeks ago on a Radio National programme there was a discussion about the results of a longitudinal study with a validly large number of people where half of them employed the above positive thinking method and the other half didn't. There was no difference between the two groups in the outcome.

Perhaps it depends on the disease?
With some psychological disorders, e.g. cognitive behaviour therapy etc can be very effective.

 

[jtb]

Also, I look forward to understanding the total CRAP that the brain sends us, which is totally duff.

Great call K,

As I touched on in 2020's Evolution thread, starting to look into and experimenting a little with the powers/facilities of the mind was an epiphany for me.
After reading a wide range of stuff from Steiner to Jung and trying to slow my brain down with a lot of eastern type ZEN stuff. I came to the belief that the animal side of our brain which dominates our waking state (keeps us alive etc) is the source of the CRAP that you so eloquently describe (some philosophies call this the Ego).
Have you noticed how the brain demands stimulation/detests peace and quiet/bombards you with noise all the time?

Having suffered from tremendous nightmares (every night) from first memory (Mum reckons they started straight after my Dad died- so I was 18 months old) until about 9 or 10 yo (I still don't sleep very well), as a young adult I found it interesting the way the mind can reduce you to state of paralysis purely through focussing on negatives?
Particularly in the early hours
I learnt numerous tricks to wake myself up from these paralysing nightmares and came to use the same methods to take back control of my mind (when the ego would try to prevent me) while meditating on a problem or just trying to clear my mind.

I came to picture this animal side of the brain as the the little red devil that used to sit on Donald Ducks shoulder (if you were a disney cartoon fan) with the spiritual side of the mind (the magical side that allows three year old children to play Beethhoven from ear, having never learnt music etc) being the little white angel sitting on his other shoulder

I think people get caught up with the image/name GOD etc (a result of the animal side of the brain imo).
Personally I think the evidence is overwhelming regarding a higher consciousness/ability, for want of a better descriptor, that humans around the globe regularly tap into to.

Why do we have to call it something and then go to war over it?
We should revel in it.
If we don't want to revel in it then we should ignore it- either way it should be a personal - private thing.

Unfortunately as everything has an opposite equal and day can't arrive without night.If as people we aren't strong enough (or fail to see, for what it is) to dominate the animal side of our brain- then we descend into the incomprehensible states of debauchery, cruelty, irrationality etc that unfortunately accompany/eclipse the wondrous miracles that we also achieve.

As you say, you believe in the mind as opposed to celestials / extra-terrestrials.
Mind is your god.
Me too (although beer put up a very strong case)
We can choose to venture to higher ground or lower.

Will we be guided by God or the Devil to end up in Heaven or Hell.
Its all just different names for the same thing imo

Through meditation I ventured far enough to realise I wasn't prepared to go any further just yet (too freaky), but if your that way inclined there is a mountain of empirical studies on ESP/Hypnosis topics which I found absolutely mindblowing.

Unfortunately the news media seem more focussed on whether Britney Spears has any undies on
More evidence of the Ego keeping us where it wants us

Onwards and upwards

 

[Sean K]

Great call K,

As I touched on in 2020's Evolution thread, starting to look into and experimenting a little with the powers/facilities of the mind was an epiphany for me.......


.......................


Through meditation I ventured far enough to realise I wasn't prepared to go any further just yet (too freaky), but if your that way inclined there is a mountain of empirical studies on ESP/Hypnosis topics which I found absolutely mindblowing.

Unfortunately the news media seem more focussed on whether Britney Spears has any undies on
More evidence of the Ego keeping us where it wants us

Onwards and upwards

Look forward to a beer with you next time in Australia...

 

[Sean K]

Great topic, Kennas.

Many people have claimed that they have recovered from cancer e.g. (substitute many other diseases) by visualising their bodies as healthy and 'thinking the disease' away.
A couple of weeks ago on a Radio National programme there was a discussion about the results of a longitudinal study with a validly large number of people where half of them employed the above positive thinking method and the other half didn't. There was no difference between the two groups in the outcome.

Perhaps it depends on the disease?
With some psychological disorders, e.g. cognitive behaviour therapy etc can be very effective.

Not sure where you're headed with this Julia?

Does believing that you have control over your body work, or not, IYO?

Or, is it belief in something outerworldly that you will be cured most important?

Or, are their certain diseases that have no direct connection to 'religion' or 'belief', and therefore non religious people can be cured from with logic?

??

 

[2020hindsight]

is it belief in something outerworldly that you will be cured most important?

well my answer is that I believe that Britney Spiers doesn't wear nickers, and that she's outwardly worldy.

did I get it right ?


PS great post jt - will have to read it twice and reply 'later'.
Hypnosis ! - spot on - straight away you hit the nail on the head.
(even if its more about "the relinquishing of power by one mind to another" etc)

A friend went to a hypnotist re his smoking - now , every time he looks at the end of a cigarette, he sees maggots crawling out of it - that's completely cured him !

 

[2020hindsight]

Not sure where you're headed with this Julia?

Does believing that you have control over your body work, or not, IYO?

Or, is it belief in something outerworldly that you will be cured most important?

Or, are their certain diseases that have no direct connection to 'religion' or 'belief', and therefore non religious people can be cured from with logic?

??

kennas - here's a website on Dr Ian Gawler - who meditated himself out of bone cancer..

Ian holds a degree in Veterinary Science and a Masters in Counselling. In 1987 he was awarded the Order of Australia Medal for his services to the community. He is on the Advisory Board for the Australasian Integrative Medical Assocn

http://www.thehouseofoojah.com/audi...ion-beginners-guide-ian-gawler-audiobook.html

Dr Ian Gawler OAM is one of Australia’s most experienced and respected authorities on mind/body medicine and meditation. Also, Ian is well known as an advocate of self-help techniques and a healthy lifestyle.

A long-term cancer survivor, he was diagnosed with bone cancer and his right leg was amputated in 1975. However, the disease recurred later that year. Drawing upon a truly integrated approach, Ian was fortunate to experience a remarkable recovery.

Now his story offers hope and inspiration to people across the country and around the world. The self help techniques that he developed have helped many to convert hope into sustained health and peace of mind.

A pioneer in mind/body medicine, Dr Gawler is known for his clarity and good humour. With a gift for translating ancient wisdom into a modern context, and having appeared widely in the media, Ian has played a major part in popularising meditation and other mind/body medicine techniques in the western world

What Dr Gawler has to offer is the benefit of his own experience and research, as well as the accumulated experience and wisdom of the many thousands of people he has worked with. Since 1981 when he began to conduct active, solution-based support groups for other people affected by cancer, his work has expanded into a dual role. One aspect is the focus on healing, the other on disease prevention, health and wellbeing. Also, Ian has helped many people in their quest for peace of mind and spiritual fulfilment..

Dr Gawler is the author of four bestselling books on self-help techniques and has edited another seven books on mind/body medicine. He has produced a series of tapes and CDs to support his writings. He is the Founder and Therapeutic Director of The Gawler Foundation and conducts groups in Melbourne and residential programs amidst the peace and tranquillity of the Yarra Valley. He also lectures around the world.

Ian holds a degree in Veterinary Science and a Masters in Counselling. In 1987 he was awarded the Order of Australia Medal for his services to the community. He is on the Advisory Board for the Australasian Integrative Medical Association and really loves his wife and gardening!

 

[noirua]

Great topic, Kennas.

Many people have claimed that they have recovered from cancer e.g. (substitute many other diseases) by visualising their bodies as healthy and 'thinking the disease' away.
A couple of weeks ago on a Radio National programme there was a discussion about the results of a longitudinal study with a validly large number of people where half of them employed the above positive thinking method and the other half didn't. There was no difference between the two groups in the outcome.

Perhaps it depends on the disease?
With some psychological disorders, e.g. cognitive behaviour therapy etc can be very effective.

Interesting. I remember reading an obituary about a Minister in the Indian Government at the time of Independance, about 1947, who had stomach cancer and was only given a short time to live.
It said that he drank his own urine, two cups per day, every day from then onwards. He died at the age of 99.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urine_therapy

What has this got to do with "power of the mind". In my view it takes power of the mind to drink your own urine for over 50 years.

 

[IFocus]

Went to a "use your brain to fix every thing" seminar about 5 years ago the purpose was about working on my trading psychology.

Taught how to develop brain tools to fix stuff from head aches to what ever while in the alpha state.

Went in a cynic came out converted, it actually worked at least for me, the whole thing made sense if you accepted the brain controlled at some level all the functions within your body.

If this is so then surely it’s the solution to fixing every thing, you just need to know how to direct it.

Did other stuff that was way out there that also appeared to work but it was a bit too voodoo for me.

Focus

 

[Timmy]

Can a wall be knocked down with the power of the mind ... this guy keeps trying

 

[tech/a]

and Ben Cousins, and brain capacity,

In the one sentence---thought that was funny!

 

[Julia]

Not sure where you're headed with this Julia?

Does believing that you have control over your body work, or not, IYO?

Or, is it belief in something outerworldly that you will be cured most important?

Or, are their certain diseases that have no direct connection to 'religion' or 'belief', and therefore non religious people can be cured from with logic?

??

No, I'm not sure either, Kennas. I wasn't really putting forward a personal point of view, just reporting (a) result of a study into cancer cures,and (b) saying that I know of many instances where cbt has been effective.

I don't think I'd find it possible to believe that any thinking process would successfully eradicate a physiological disease like cancer, but I'm not sure so am interested to hear what others think about this.

Personally I absolutely believe I can and do alter my own mental state by changing my thinking. Nothing new or radical about that. But I don't believe I can write the next Booker winning novel just by telling myself I can.
See? So many difficult levels of believing in something.

Do we have to involve religion in curing disease/disorders? Of course not.
Logic: yes, isn't this what's involved in changing our thinking?
Some of us focus on what's wrong with our lives and others on what's right.
Just changing that focus can make a huge difference in how we perceive our level of happiness.

But don't take any notice of me. When I was checking some books out of the library a few days ago, the librarian said "Have you lost your library card?"
I thought "how silly is she - she has it in her hand". Said "no, I've just given it to you". She smiled kindly and showed me that I'd given her my Driver's Licence". Ah, the ageing brain.

 

[Timmy]

and Ben Cousins, and brain capacity,

In the one sentence---thought that was funny!

You're terrible Muriel