Where is/can Donald Trump take US (sic)?

[sptrawler]

The rednecks may like Trump, but people who can see reason know he's a loose cannon.

Maybe it isn't a case of liking, he isn't there to be liked, he is there to do a job.
To a certain degree, Winston Churchill, was a loose cannon, Bob Hawke was a loose cannon, Paul Keating was loose cannon and they weren't liked by a lot of the population.
Why is everyone hung up on this touchy, touchy, lovy, dovy crap, Trump is there to run the Country, he will be judged by the voters at the next election.
Same with Boris Johnson, next election the public of the U.K will judge him, he isn't there to be everyone's friend he probably knows that is impossible.

 

[SirRumpole]

Maybe it isn't a case of liking, he isn't there to be liked, he is there to do a job.
To a certain degree, Winston Churchill, was a loose cannon, Bob Hawke was a loose cannon, Paul Keating was loose cannon and they weren't liked by a lot of the population.
Why is everyone hung up on this touchy, touchy, lovy, dovy crap, Trump is there to run the Country, he will be judged by the voters at the next election.
Same with Boris Johnson, next election the public of the U.K will judge him, he isn't there to be everyone's friend he probably knows that is impossible.

Yep, well the voters were only too keen to get rid of Churchill once the war was over.

 

[sptrawler]

Yep, well the voters were only too keen to get rid of Churchill once the war was over.

And so it should be, but the constant personal attacks really seem a bit pointless, well to me it does maybe to others it gives them a sense of relief.
But the constant chant does become a bit like a religious door knock, once in a while is o.k, but everyday it would tend to get on your nerves a bit.
You know what I mean, he is going to be impeached yehh, no he isn't.
He is going to be impeached, yehhh, no he isn't.
Boris hasn't even sat in the chair, and the chanting has started, Boris is as bad as Trump and here it starts again.

 

[SirRumpole]

And so it should be, but the constant personal attacks really seem a bit pointless, well to me it does maybe to others it gives them a sense of relief.
But the constant chant does become a bit like a religious door knock, once in a while is o.k, but everyday it would tend to get on your nerves a bit.
You know what I mean, he is going to be impeached yehh, no he isn't.
He is going to be impeached, yehhh, no he isn't.
Boris hasn't even sat in the chair, and the chanting has started, Boris is as bad as Trump and here it starts again.

You are right, the voters will judge him at the next election, but it's also a matter of how much damage he will do to domestic and global institutions before he goes.

Of course, this can be put right by the next person, but if he is making decisions on his own instincts rather than on evidence (a la G.W. Bush and weapons of mass destruction) then the possibility of some sort of disaster can't be ruled out.

Constant personal attacks are annoying , true, but his decision making capability needs to be seriously questioned.

 

[wayneL]

Yep, well the voters were only too keen to get rid of Churchill once the war was over.

Labour successfully smeared Churchill as a warmonger because of his (correct) distrust of the Soviets, plus, they promised a bunch of free shxt.

In 1951, Churchill was again elected PM.

 

[sptrawler]

You are right, the voters will judge him at the next election, but it's also a matter of how much damage he will do to domestic and global institutions before he goes.

Of course, this can be put right by the next person, but if he is making decisions on his own instincts rather than on evidence (a la G.W. Bush and weapons of mass destruction) then the possibility of some sort of disaster can't be ruled out.

Constant personal attacks are annoying , true, but his decision making capability needs to be seriously questioned.

Yes I agree, but I was more referring to the forum, if he is impeached or charged it is news, just to have every article about him posted up seems pointless.
I'm just wondering if the same is now going to happen with Johnson.

 

[basilio]

The issue of impeachment is not simply that Donald Trump is nasty or racist or a liar.

The practical reasons for impeachment are dereliction of duty and misuse of office. Is this administration doing or allowing actions that undermine the democratic process ?

Robert Mueller made it clear that the Russians were actively interfering with all USS states in the electoral process. This was proven. Yet the administration is completely ignoring these findings.

So what does one do ? This Democratic rep who had not previously supported impeachment explains her change of mind

How Mitch McConnell Persuaded a Senior House Democrat to Back Impeachment
It wasn’t Robert Mueller’s testimony that pushed Representative Katherine Clark over the edge.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...ine-clark-house-democrats-impeachment/595051/

 

[Knobby22]

Stock market crashing.
US economy debt massively increasing.
No sign tariffs are working.
Trump is definitely taking us all somewhere.

This is what happens when you let an unsuccessful businessman / reality show host run the worlds largest economy.

 

[moXJO]

Stock market crashing.
US economy debt massively increasing.
No sign tariffs are working.
Trump is definitely taking us all somewhere.

This is what happens when you let an unsuccessful businessman / reality show host run the worlds largest economy.

China is just playing currency games prior 2020.

 

[Knobby22]

China is just playing currency games prior 2020.

Yes, they won't deal on the possibility Trump may lose the next election. They can play the long game.
How do you see this panning out moXJO?

 

[moXJO]

Yes, they won't deal on the possibility Trump may lose the next election. They can play the long game.
How do you see this panning out moXJO?

Its bad for Australia if trump wins.
US wants to pivot into Aus. Not good from our point of view. But China is a huge threat. Its using its weight to bully and intimidate. And unfortunately Xi jinping ain't moving from top spot.

Trump is the only one of the candidates (for 2020) being able to weather the mass negative propaganda that will be thrown at them from China and Russia.
The other candidates will wither and backflip. You can already see the others get bogged down in PC bulldust and then sitting on their hands. Russia,NK, Iran and China won't stop untill they stop the countries forward momentum.

The other candidates are about a decade behind in the power play that is going on globally. China knows this and will tighten the screws on Trumps base. It's already stopped US farm goods. Then it will peddle doom and gloom to the US market.
US will probably devalue as well.
Trump is in no way guaranteed a 2020 win. I'm not sure how things will go if he does lose.



All that aside, we had some chinese protesters in Brisbane that were for democracy. China organised about 300 pro government supporters to go and stand over them. The news was very quiet about it. This was in Australia. I was a little bit stunned that we are at this stage already.

Our relationship with both countries will be tested over the coming years.

 

[Knobby22]

I wonder if Trump may declare war on Iran in an attempt to win the election.

 

[IFocus]

Trump is the only one of the candidates (for 2020) being able to weather the mass negative propaganda that will be thrown at them from China and Russia.

Trump will win the election but note the Democrats pretty much always follow the same foreign policy as the previous admin Obama carried on Bushes FP almost to every detail its a Yank thing not a political issue.

Dems would also declare war on Russia's interference to there domestic systems which needs to happen Repubs need to be hanged for treason.

 

[kahuna1]

With regret ...

At this stage the Democrats a total mess. Warren is nuts. Sorry but I am with them about universal medicare, paying 3 times as much as any nation does generates massive political donations.

Bernie, well, again has NO idea. Idiotic to actually think with a single payer, like our Medicare they will pay or agree to pay 3,4,5, and even 100 times the price for drugs, Or pay 4 times as much for a MRI .\

What will occur over time, the cover will rise from there awful 65% USA now has, awful for the lower 60% ... to near 100% ... and despite the rise in cover, the COST ... which is 20% of GDP ... despite a 150% better cover will go DOWN overall ... to where 65 other nations pay for healthcare at 10% or less ... for it. Bernie seems to MISS this ... totally. He sadly also has a few crosses to bear and media is so against him, little hope.

Biden, well .... he is already bought and paid for by corporate America and sadly, will be worse than Obama was. Worse than George W Bush which is saying something. Not as bad as Trump but ... the corruption will continue on with a mere better smokescreen.

Of the other contenders, Harris and Buttplug have little hope it seems.

I would prefer Bernie, but ... he has too many crosses from his past, his religion and his communist views. HE IS NOT communist ... or even socialist and sadly he lacks understanding of basic Economics.

This it seems leaves us with Trump .... or a Biden and whilst I would hope for Bernie and a fresh change to USA tax theft and foreign policy, unless Iowa primary is a surprise, its going to be a long long next 5 years.

I do have a sneaking suspicion that Bernie is actually doing way way better than the 12% behind Biden than he is, but there is little evidence I can hang my hat upon for a change. This sneaking suspicion is a disbelief of some of the polls taken and ones like FOX have Biden leading by 18% to Sanders, when others have it at 6%.

It could be of course a total surprise and take THAT .... much like AOC who on polling day was 16% behind the Democrat incumbent she kicked out as a Democrat running against a well funded corrupt politician. She won by 12% I think so the poll was totally wrong.

This however is the most followed election I suspect in decades and for the polls to be off by 20% and Bernie Sanders actually leading is for me a pipe dream. Some of the treatment he gets out of Fox is astounding. Fox news is a disgrace usually but on the Trump for 2020, it never wavers and any lie goes.

Should be an interesting next 14 months, but at this stage its not looking good.

Get used to the Bald, lying, racist state of affairs.

Ivanka 2024
Don Jr Trump 2028 and 2032 and then .... Barron Trump will he be old enough in 2036 ?

 

[moXJO]

With regret ...

At this stage the Democrats a total mess. Warren is nuts. Sorry but I am with them about universal medicare, paying 3 times as much as any nation does generates massive political donations.

Bernie, well, again has NO idea. Idiotic to actually think with a single payer, like our Medicare they will pay or agree to pay 3,4,5, and even 100 times the price for drugs, Or pay 4 times as much for a MRI .\

What will occur over time, the cover will rise from there awful 65% USA now has, awful for the lower 60% ... to near 100% ... and despite the rise in cover, the COST ... which is 20% of GDP ... despite a 150% better cover will go DOWN overall ... to where 65 other nations pay for healthcare at 10% or less ... for it. Bernie seems to MISS this ... totally. He sadly also has a few crosses to bear and media is so against him, little hope.

Biden, well .... he is already bought and paid for by corporate America and sadly, will be worse than Obama was. Worse than George W Bush which is saying something. Not as bad as Trump but ... the corruption will continue on with a mere better smokescreen.

Of the other contenders, Harris and Buttplug have little hope it seems.

I would prefer Bernie, but ... he has too many crosses from his past, his religion and his communist views. HE IS NOT communist ... or even socialist and sadly he lacks understanding of basic Economics.

This it seems leaves us with Trump .... or a Biden and whilst I would hope for Bernie and a fresh change to USA tax theft and foreign policy, unless Iowa primary is a surprise, its going to be a long long next 5 years.

I do have a sneaking suspicion that Bernie is actually doing way way better than the 12% behind Biden than he is, but there is little evidence I can hang my hat upon for a change. This sneaking suspicion is a disbelief of some of the polls taken and ones like FOX have Biden leading by 18% to Sanders, when others have it at 6%.

It could be of course a total surprise and take THAT .... much like AOC who on polling day was 16% behind the Democrat incumbent she kicked out as a Democrat running against a well funded corrupt politician. She won by 12% I think so the poll was totally wrong.

This however is the most followed election I suspect in decades and for the polls to be off by 20% and Bernie Sanders actually leading is for me a pipe dream. Some of the treatment he gets out of Fox is astounding. Fox news is a disgrace usually but on the Trump for 2020, it never wavers and any lie goes.

Should be an interesting next 14 months, but at this stage its not looking good.

Get used to the Bald, lying, racist state of affairs.

Ivanka 2024
Don Jr Trump 2028 and 2032 and then .... Barron Trump will he be old enough in 2036 ?

What was your take on Dems tearing down Obama?
I was a little surprised.

 

[moXJO]

I wonder if Trump may declare war on Iran in an attempt to win the election.

He is anti war and was actually anti guns. He was originally going to run for Democrats until Obama roasted him. He was very good friends with hillary. I bet they are all kicking themselves now. All that for bad jokes....

I doubt he will start a war, bad for business. More likely back door deals.

 

[kahuna1]

What was your take on Dems tearing down Obama?
I was a little surprised.

Obama was bribed and paid for. HE sounded better than Bush .... he actually was worse. WORSE. Healthcare went massively backwards, pensions ... not a single person went to jail for GFC ... his whole treasury was ex Goldman Sachs people ... basically scum ... much like Cohen and Munckin Trump had and still has.

At the core of this, democrats and republicans are the same ... bribed political suits. Some exceptions who DONT take corporate donations, but they are less than 10 out of 380 .... AOC and her crew ... Bernie and a few scant others.

Obama was better at PR ... claiming he wanted a $15- an hour wage ... the next day ... he was speaking at Walmart asking the owners, the Walton family ... for political donations.

USA is what it is ...now ... a broken democracy back in the 1920's with no rules for the rich, open racial discrimination and ... well he difference is the Military Industrial complex is one of the few things the USA makes ... weapons ... so it means the USA is at war ... forever. Big business ... 600 billion annual sales.

USA back then ... was not interested in anyone else ... WW1 they almost missed ... WW2 the same ...

Now, well they encourage fighting between Arab states so as they don't attack Israel ... steal hundreds of billions in unpaid tax each year globally ... and free trade is what its called ... and if we complain now, like France just did your threatened with sanctions and tariffs for actually trying to collect taxes in your own nation.

Obama on the war issue ... well he green lighted the Libya stuff ... 1 million dead ... he sold weapons to Saudis and they tried exterminating the Houthis .... Obama green lighted drone strikes with no oversight in 8 nations and ... well managed to keep the wars going.

No Obama was NOT good and in fact worse than Bush ... Deficit exploded, tax collection shrank, people in the nation go worse and worse health cover and wages when the Correct inflation rate is used saw their wages in the USA shrink.

NO ... he was the worst ever .... till Trump and made Old George Senior and his war war war look like a saint ... Clinton was NOT good, he tried but was busy giving dicktation .... George Junior was horrible and Obama for all his hype.. ... was pathetic and did NOTHING for African Americans. NOT A THING.

 

[Knobby22]

He is anti war and was actually anti guns. He was originally going to run for Democrats until Obama roasted him. He was very good friends with hillary. I bet they are all kicking themselves now. All that for bad jokes....

I doubt he will start a war, bad for business. More likely back door deals.

Yes, true. It's Pompeo's influence that has me worried.

 

[Knobby22]

From Mish blog

In Trump’s Trade Quagmire (Wonkish), Krugman notes the obvious "He just keeps escalating as his strategy fails."

Remember the Vietnam quagmire? Well, here’s my thought: Trump’s trade war is looking more and more like a classic policy quagmire. It’s not working — that is, it isn’t at all delivering the results Trump wants. But he’s even less willing than the average politician to admit to a mistake, so he keeps doing even more of what’s not working. And if you extrapolate based on that insight, the implications for the U.S. and world economies are starting to get pretty scary.

Krugman's Five Points

1. The trade war is getting big. Tariffs on Chinese goods are back to levels we associate with pre-1930s protectionism. And the trade war is reaching the point where it becomes a significant drag on the U.S. economy.
2. The trade war is failing in its goals, at least as Trump sees them: the Chinese aren’t crying uncle, and the trade deficit is rising, not falling.
3. The Fed probably can’t offset the harm the trade war is doing, and is probably getting less willing even to try.
4. Trump is likely to respond to his disappointments by escalating, with tariffs on more stuff and more countries, and — despite denials — in the end, with currency intervention.
5. Other countries will retaliate, and this will get very ugly, very fast.

1. 
   https://moneymaven.io/mishtalk/econ...-kudlow-won-t-comment-DygrAVx42kiOYeDw-vIZIw/

 

[wayneL]

I wouldn't be quoting Krugman if I wanted my credibility intact. In fact, just WTF has happened to Mish.

This Mish is a different Mish than the Mish I once read.