Where can I buy gold and silver?

Ageo · 23 March 2009

Re: Were Can I Buy Gold & Silver?

Jikx said:
Let's be sensible here, you haven't discounted the fact that Gold does liquidity risk. For example, if I had one thousand ounces of Gold, can it still be sold at the same rate as if I had a million dollars worth of blue chip shares? Perhaps it can, but which is easier? Which has turnover?

Jikx just to answer this question i had 1 order that was worth $2million which was done in 3 days. Now it might not be as fast as selling shares but you cannot say gold has liquidity problems.

P.S we are talking about scrap here also not pure gold.

Hope this helps

moXJO · 23 March 2009

Re: Were Can I Buy Gold & Silver?

Jikx said:
Wow talk about not addressing any of the points I'm raising. I'll reliterate: I'm talking about the liquidity, how easy it is to buy and sell, the level of transactions occur at a economy wide level. Surely you cannot argue that the turnover of Gold is greater than that of Cash or Shares? That is what liquidity is, and that's why I stated it is of greater liquidity risk.

.

I would agree. Gold EFT's are the lazy mans way of trading gold. And all without having to source a good price. I think people are more concerned with protecting assets atm though.

Jikx · 23 March 2009

Re: Were Can I Buy Gold & Silver?

Ageo said:
Now it might not be as fast as selling shares but you cannot say gold has liquidity problems.

P.S we are talking about scrap here also not pure gold.

Hope this helps

Ah, yes I see what we're arguing about now. We talking about different things. I talk of liquidity risks, not to say that it has liquidity problems, only that it is more illiquid. Let's just call it a padentic relic from studying finance

Ageo · 23 March 2009

Re: Were Can I Buy Gold & Silver?

Jikx said:
Ah, yes I see what we're arguing about now. We talking about different things. I talk of liquidity risks, not to say that it has liquidity problems, only that it is more illiquid. Let's just call it a padentic relic from studying finance

Yep i think i know where your coming from too, i was coming from an individual point of view and i think you were talking from an overall aspect.

Apples and Oranges my friend

Its good to see both points of view thow

coulldc · 30 March 2009

Try the Perth mint where you can buy gold bullion bars

bongcso · 30 March 2009

rhyslivs said:
I had a search through some other threads but nothing was really clear cut.

I am interested in buying gold and silver, but predominately silver. Not necessarily physical gold and silver but more an ownership of some gold or silver somewhere that I can trade. The other thread mentioned futures contracts. Maybe this is what I am after.

Basically I want to buy and sell gold or silver but I dont want the stuff to rock up on my doorstep.

Lend me your knowledge kind gentlemen and women.

Thanks,

Rhys

Rhys,
Like you I also want to own gold and silver without the hassle of having to deal with the physical commodity. I buy the ETF which is GLD for gold and SLV for silver. These are traded on the US exchanges. I buy them using my account with a US broker but I believe you should be able to buy them via your local broker who do international shares. GLD is similar to GOLD which is traded on the ASX but what I prefer GLD because it has options so you can protect your downside by buying put options if you need.

Christina

Bron Suchecki · 2 April 2009

Liquidity

When talking about liqudity, the form of gold is important. To start with, the MINIMUM acceptable trading unit in the professional gold market is 1000oz, ie USD 1m. What is the depth of the market? The clearing turnover in the London bullion market averages $22.4 billion a day. Now that is clearing (ie net), not actual trade volume and is only for the London market. My view is that wholesale gold is actually more liquid than blue chip shares.

Since ASX products like GOLD or ZAUWBA or the Perth Mint's Depository accounts have connections into the professional market, effectively liqudity is the same. You have a couple of million in your Depository account and want to sell it, no problem, it will not "move the market" and as the bullion market works on 2 day settlement, you will get your cash quicker than shares on ASX which are 3 days.

On to physical gold which you hold personally. Yes this will have more "settlement" delays because you have to get the gold to the dealer before they will pay you. That is all a function of how close you are to a dealer. There is also the question of whether it is in a recognised form (coins or bars) or not, if the former then there will be no delay. But it is fair to say that physical gold is less liquid than shares.

Ageo · 2 April 2009

Re: Liquidity

Bron Suchecki said:
On to physical gold which you hold personally. Yes this will have more "settlement" delays because you have to get the gold to the dealer before they will pay you. That is all a function of how close you are to a dealer. There is also the question of whether it is in a recognised form (coins or bars) or not, if the former then there will be no delay. But it is fair to say that physical gold is less liquid than shares.

Bron just out of curiosity how long do you think it takes to say sell $1million worth of 2ndhand jewellery? (or any other forms of scrap gold)?

Im talking about getting cash or money into your hand?

Bron Suchecki · 2 April 2009

Ultimately scrap gold must be refined into a tradable form that can be sold in the professional market. For that sort of quantity you would have to sell it to a sizable refiner I would think. We are then talking about refining times, again quite variable and also affected by whether you are a one-off client or regular - do you think AGR Matthey would hold back refining Newmont's dore so you can get your 1000oz done as fast as possible? Consider that AGR refines average of USD 180m per week (6tonne).

I'd say generally 2 weeks, but I'm not close to that side of the business. You might be able to get a better deal from refiners on the eastern states, say Focus Metals, but I don't know their capacity and turnaround to do 1000oz of scap.

oremo · 2 April 2009

I believe that silver is a good investment right now.

I need some advice on how to invest say $10k

Am I better off investing in a silver miner or CFD's?

Going long...say 12 - 24 months.

I'd appreciate some good feedback

Thanks in advance

poguemahone · 2 April 2009

Perth Mint do certificates Unallocated.. Great for the punter with no closet space.

Now if u want it allocated you can have it stored onsite for 1% per yr ? + fabrication cost - $35 per ounce I believe.

Anyway it is good to know that the gold you bought you can physically touch,hold,chip a bit off for bread etc.

I am mad for silver at the moment..they do that to!

Do your own research blah on the gold/silver...maybe try typing "who owns the federal reserve" onto Google thats researching...

Ageo · 2 April 2009

Bron Suchecki said:
Ultimately scrap gold must be refined into a tradable form that can be sold in the professional market. For that sort of quantity you would have to sell it to a sizable refiner I would think. We are then talking about refining times, again quite variable and also affected by whether you are a one-off client or regular - do you think AGR Matthey would hold back refining Newmont's dore so you can get your 1000oz done as fast as possible? Consider that AGR refines average of USD 180m per week (6tonne).

I'd say generally 2 weeks, but I'm not close to that side of the business. You might be able to get a better deal from refiners on the eastern states, say Focus Metals, but I don't know their capacity and turnaround to do 1000oz of scap.

2 weeks to refine yes but how long to sell $1million worth of scrap gold and get the cash in your hand (be it personal or business stock). The answer is 3 days from start to finish.

How do i know? its part of my line of work

I dont know why people insist on physical gold being illiquid but it is far from it.

Bron Suchecki · 3 April 2009

Ageo,

3 day turnaround on scrap, very good. When I said physical less liquid than shares, I was talking about large quantities as you may have to ship them to a dealer. If you have a few ounces all you have to do is get to your coin/bullion dealer and you'll get cash over the counter, so in that case, more liquid than shares.

To me, liquidity is also not so much about time to settle, but the ability to execute without affecting the price, ie depth of market as well. In this respect gold is very liquid. There would be plenty of examples of shares where if you tried to sell $1m you would move the price down significantly.

Jikx, is $22.4 billion a day in net clearing in just one (but major) market liquid enough? Unfortunately, gold is primarily traded OTC, so actual turnover numbers are not available.

projack · 8 April 2009

bongcso said:
Rhys,
Like you I also want to own gold and silver without the hassle of having to deal with the physical commodity.

Christina

Probably until 3-4 years ago it was cheaper to buy physical PM, than paper-gold and paper-silver. I bought thousands of kookaburra and kangaroo silver bullion coins on spot prices in the past. For the round silver 50 cents pieces I used to get about 30%, on pre decimal silver coins 50% discount vs. spot price.
Today on eBay kookaburra, and kangaroo 1-ounce bullion coins sell around 2-4 times spot price, round silver 50 cents with 30% premium and junk pre decimal silver coins with 20% premium.
Just wonder how is this showing up on Sinners charts.
Anyway good luck with all your paper-gold and paper-silver.

http://www.professorfekete.com/articles/AEFMonetaryVersusNonmonetaryCommodites.pdf

Ageo · 9 April 2009

Bron Suchecki said:
Ageo,

3 day turnaround on scrap, very good. When I said physical less liquid than shares, I was talking about large quantities as you may have to ship them to a dealer. If you have a few ounces all you have to do is get to your coin/bullion dealer and you'll get cash over the counter, so in that case, more liquid than shares.

To me, liquidity is also not so much about time to settle, but the ability to execute without affecting the price, ie depth of market as well. In this respect gold is very liquid. There would be plenty of examples of shares where if you tried to sell $1m you would move the price down significantly.

Jikx, is $22.4 billion a day in net clearing in just one (but major) market liquid enough? Unfortunately, gold is primarily traded OTC, so actual turnover numbers are not available.

Bron, with all my customers i settle in cash on the spot, so people with scrap dont have to wait for refining etc.... i also lock in prices to hedge myself against price swings which means if you had 100kg of gold scrap (which is alot in value) and you were happy with the price i quoted you, then you could lock that in and thats the amount you would receive (even if the market tanked). Alot of people dont understand physical as such and try to relate it with paper etc....

P.S when i talk about physical i actually talk about scrap as the average person has some form of gold jewellery laying around but only a minority have pure bullion/coins.

lsj84 · 21 May 2009

After listening to Dr Marc Faber and Jim Rogers I'm quite scared by what might be coming.

I'd like to buy some plaine tradable physical silver to protect myself.

But I'm aware that 1oz of 09 koala silver coin by perthmint is sold for 38 AUD, about 20 dollars higher than the Kitco quote. I understand physical metals are priced higher than paper metals. but is it really by this big margin?

Does this mean that at the moment I can only purhcase silver at such high price in Aussie term?

who are your preferred dealers where you guys purhcase precious metals?

Trembling Hand · 21 May 2009

lsj84 said:
who are your preferred dealers where you guys purhcase precious metals?

NYMEX :

moXJO · 21 May 2009

lsj84 said:
After listening to Dr Marc Faber and Jim Rogers I'm quite scared by what might be coming.

I'd like to buy some plaine tradable physical silver to protect myself.

But I'm aware that 1oz of 09 koala silver coin by perthmint is sold for 38 AUD, about 20 dollars higher than the Kitco quote. I understand physical metals are priced higher than paper metals. but is it really by this big margin?

Does this mean that at the moment I can only purhcase silver at such high price in Aussie term?

who are your preferred dealers where you guys purhcase precious metals?

Do a search it will bring up the others if I missed any. Watch out they don't try and quote too high above the spot.

http://www.ainsliebullion.com.au/easyweb3/IDf0874666310bd7/?MIval=ew_view&WEBID=78594&ep_code=e004p01_stdEshop

http://www.goldbullionaustralia.com.au/index.html

http://www.ausbullion.com.au/bullion.html

Really need all the metal dealers in a sticky

Ageo · 21 May 2009

I bought 10kgs of silver bullion last week for 35c per gram ($350 per kilo).

Unfortunately i sold it already but if you ask around (especially pawn brokers) you will come across some at very good prices (below market anyway).

alphaman · 21 May 2009

I've never dealed with pawn brokers before. Why do they sell silver below market prices?

Where can I buy gold and silver?

Ageo

moXJO

menace to society

Jikx

Ageo

coulldc

bongcso

Bron Suchecki

Ageo

Bron Suchecki

oremo

poguemahone

Poguemahone

Ageo

Bron Suchecki

projack

Ageo

lsj84

Trembling Hand

Can be found on the bid

moXJO

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Ageo

alphaman

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