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The Voice

I see you're still dribbling nonsense, you must be Victorian. ?
What does this mean?
from your post:
not that it should matter, my interation with Brewarrina goses back 40 years, those I know there? well over a century. 'Get out'a Dodge' might just take on a bit of new mean'n....

I certainly hope someone gives you a how to vote card with the referendum.

And you think I'm laughable, that's rich coming from you. ?

By the way just to drag your dumb butt up to speed on the Aussie dollar Vs the British pound, as I said originally Brexit was done in 2020, it will take some time for adjustment.
Obviously you have trouble understanding technical issues, maybe try some remedial english courses.

 
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What a shame he knows SFA about Australian history and the Voice, yet gets to spew rubbish in The Australian.
 
'Interaction' .... and 'goes'

you've read nothing of Australian History have you. You're cluless to the historical construct that's served the 'communities' you have such 'deep understanding'. no use anything remedial on something you have no interest.

keep on keep'n with that Brexit narritive; it 'polishes' your work here, it gives it that 'depth of understanding' ... A special sort of sheen.
 
Are you ever going to say anything about the voice, or the treaty? Or are you just going to keep dribbling on endlessly about me and Brexit, with an occasional reference to Australian history, interspersed amongst an illiterate garbling. ?

By the way another article of the state of play in the U.K, just to get you into the now, after all you were the one who brought up brexit, not me.

Maybe you can focus on the thread, rather than me now, but then again looking at the standard of your content, it maybe best just to focus on me.


The UK economy will grow faster than Germany this year and avoid a recession, the International Monetary Fund said, after sharply upgrading its forecast on the back of strong household spending and better relations with the European Union.

Falling energy prices will also help Britain expand 0.4% this year, the IMF said on Tuesday in its regular health check on the UK economy. That’s up from the 0.3% contraction the fund projected just last month, and which will lift the UK off the bottom of the Group of Seven league table.
 
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What a shame he knows SFA about Australian history and the Voice, yet gets to spew rubbish in The Australian.
For example, he says "It should therefore have been obvious that the voice would raise serious concerns."
This is only true if you are not too bright!
The referendum proposes we regcognise first inhabitants and that their concerns can be addressed by a Voice.
How exactly that raises "serious concerns" is a mystery, unless you believe your own distorted view of reality.

Ergan then says "the proposal seeks to constitutionally entrench the separate representation that has failed whenever it has been tried." But this is not true. The Voice merely consolidates the capacity of indigenous peoples to be heard, and they do not get "separate representation" as he claims. Moreover, no early attempt at consolidation has ever been so rigorously worked through, and detailed. He then opines, "... if the voice opens a door, it is not to equal political rights but to institutionalised racial division." How people swallow such rubbish is beyond me. Just in case he missed it, the "racial division" is best seen in a myriad of Closing the Gap reports. Given the Voice seeks to do better, his logic fails miserably.

Although Ergas says "By placing that ideal back on the table, the referendum invites a mature discussion of where this country is heading' his commentary is not just immature, it's poorly informed and seriously flawed. Compounding his undaunted bias he believes "the Yes camp is resorting to cheap moralising whose purpose is not to convince but to silence." How stupid is he to not know that he is writing in a newspaper that, with its media siblings, has more influence on opinion than anything else in Australia. In other words, if he does not know who paid him for the article then he's not just stupid, but innocently peddling lies.

Now let's look at where racism hides in Ergas's blood. This sentence of his is riddled with it: "Hiding behind a steam bath of emotions, it seems to believe moral blackmail can induce Australians into repeating the error of pursuing political equality by entrenching political inequality." Mr Ergas, it is never an error to pursue political equality unless you prefer to keep those with lesser rights where you think they belong.
 
Funny thing is B-orr, change a few of the names and dates, it could be the history of anywhere, any continent, any group.

Yet we are the only ones called upon for restitution, whether our particular ancestry was involved or not.

An agenda there?

The ladies doth protest too much, methinks. (with apologies)

BTW I demand restitution from the teutonic hordes that invaded the green and pleasant isles of my ancestors.

About 5 million sounds fair.... in Euros please.
 
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What a shame he knows SFA about Australian history and the Voice, yet gets to spew rubbish in The Australian.

Haha was thinking the same The Australian must be struggling to find anyone to slag off the Voice
 
It doesn't matter. We live now not in the past.
So if indigenous people had a Constitution that did not favour non-indigenous that would be ok.

More on point, your racist excuses refuse to acknowledge the people who had their land stolen, were decimated by introduced diseases, were subjected to slavery, were regularly hunted down and massacred, had their children stolen, and have suffered systemic disadvantage.

And to top it off you are not in favour of a proposal that stands a better chance than in in the past of putting in place better policies, programs and projects than have been previously tried. I'm sorry @SirRumpole but it is you who are locked into the past so strongly that you won't open the door to a better future.
 

Sorry I don't agree.

I have nothing against ATSI people having a representative body that makes submissions to Parliament. There are lots of those around, but they survive because they achieve something for their members not because they are guaranteed a place in the Constitution.

And don't call me a racist. Everyone wants the ATSI people to have living standards equivalent to the rest of the population and they will if they take the opportunities provided that everyone else has and not be perpetual victims.
 
We live in strange times. A race-based constitutional body will ensure racial equality. Those calling for a race-blind constitution and public policy are racists. Those spewing hatred and bile at sceptics raising legitimate questions to complex policy challenges accuse the latter of hate speech described as literal violence. Those who betray traces of deeply buried subconscious racism in the belief that Aboriginals can never exercise agency and be educated to take responsibility for their destiny, but must always be treated as victims, glow with virtuous satisfaction at their progressivism in spurning equal citizenship......the case for a constitutionally enshrined Voice is vague, emotionally manipulative, rooted in guilt for historical wrongs and race-based.

 
It's the exact opposite.
Most of the bodies you talk about are legislated, but you are so poorly informed on this matter I am not surprised.
And they have not achieved any significant outcomes in those areas of disadvantage that have been covered here ad nauseum. But again you either refuse to recognise that or make yet one of the myriad of excuses you are prone to.
And don't call me a racist.
Your posts smack of racism. As I will show below.
Everyone wants the ATSI people to have living standards equivalent to the rest of the population
But you clearly do not want to support a mechanism that ATSI peoples themselves have spent years developing in the hope of betterment.
And you think that's ok... because you have the baseless belief that
... they will if they take the opportunities provided that everyone else has and not be perpetual victims.
So you think that blaming the victims of centuries of disadvantage is the solution because, despite the fact they clearly do NOT have the same opportunities as everyone else, they magically have the ability to rise above it!

You believe your rationale for not recognising first inhabitants has nothing to do with racism, but if that's not the case then where is the problem?
And despite zero evidence that ATSI people have the same opportunities as everyone else, you are happy to further deny them the chance of achieving that outcome because you somehow think the Voice is divisive.
 
So you think that blaming the victims of centuries of disadvantage is the solution because, despite the fact they clearly do NOT have the same opportunities as everyone else, they magically have the ability to rise above it!
How many migrants have come here from war ravaged countries with hardly a penny to their names but have used the opportunities provided to make successes out of themselves ?

That's what I call not playing the victim but taking opportunities.
 
How many migrants have come here from war ravaged countries with hardly a penny to their names but have used the opportunities provided to make successes out of themselves ?
Bait and switch does not wash.

Your excuses get more lame by the day.
 
Why don't you stump up with your own ideas?

I read the piece and it only makes sense if you you do not understand what racism is.

So let me go through it's preamble:
First, it's not at all "strange" that bipartisan support disappeared when Dutton took the helm from Morrison. Anyone seriously thinking that a man that refused to attend Rudd's Apology would support the Voice has rocks in their head.
The second sentence has nothing to do with the Voice. The concept of equality is already built into our system of laws. The Voice is about rectifying disadvantage.
The third sentence fails to grasp the simple concept that the first inhabitants were a different race. To suggest that's "racist" defies common sense.
The fourth sentence descends into muck raking. What are these "legitimate questions"? The unanswered questions will be determined by Parliament, as has been clarified many times.
The fourth sentence is blatant misinformation. What the Voice seeks to achieve and how it can operate has been thoroughly detailed, so its a lie to say it's "vague". The other claims have nothing to do with the Voice, but read well to those who are keen to suppress indigenous advancement.

Much of the rest of the article has little to do with the Voice.
What you always see is avoidance of the actual questions being asked and, in the media, the creation of a new narrative.
 
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What the Voice seeks to achieve and how it can operate has been thoroughly detailed,

Now that statement is BS because the Parliament decides how the Voice will operate after (and if) the referendum is passed.

Your lack of knowledge of this issue is disturbing.
 
That's not what proponents of the Voice believe. Better targeted policies, properly funded and managed projects, and local ownership of solutions has to be an improvement on past failures.
Those observations always make sense. The challenge is as usual in the implementation.

That doesn't mean we don't have a go.
 
Now that statement is BS because the Parliament decides how the Voice will operate after (and if) the referendum is passed.
You really have had a miserable time posting.
What I wrote was correct. There are clear design principles for how the Voice can work. Parliament may choose to set it up differently.
 
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