SPI 200 and Futures Options

[wayneL]

This whole line is a joke. In the scheme of things the odd disconnect is neither here nor there.

Can we move on?

Exactly.

In the last eight years (the period in question) I've had one disconnect. Stop was in place so no drama.

GS fat finger trades are a bigger impact than disconnects. LOL

Subtle spam methinks.

 

[Art_Cashin]

You can enter the stop concurrently with the initiating trade. If you like mental stops, great, have an emergency stop further out just in case.

(just remember to cancel it)

It's far easier for to pick up the phone ring my Broker and he sorts it out while I'm on the phone.These guys know how to work and order they don't just sweep the market and get bad fills.You get what you pay for.I'm not pimping any Broker as I said IB is great for small traders...I used them and would recommend them to anyone who trade 5 lots or less.But bigger lots to me it's
better to use a local broker...any local broker.

 

[wayneL]

It's far easier for to pick up the phone ring my Broker and he sorts it out while I'm on the phone.These guys know how to work and order they don't just sweep the market and get bad fills.You get what you pay for.I'm not pimping any Broker as I said IB is great for small traders...I used them and would recommend them to anyone who trade 5 lots or less.But bigger lots to me it's
better to use a local broker...any local broker.

Just about everybody on this forum recognized that as nonsense.

Working an order = discretion/human imput = additional contest risk.

Horses for courses, but when I'm trading futures options it's significantly in excess of a 5 lot. There are others apart from IB that are fine, but the local clowns just can't compete on any level for what I want in terms of transparency, platform and price.

Pimping MF is one thing, but lets talk reality rather than fantasy eh?

 

[Art_Cashin]

Just about everybody on this forum recognized that as nonsense.

Working an order = discretion/human imput = additional contest risk.

Horses for courses, but when I'm trading futures options it's significantly in excess of a 5 lot. There are others apart from IB that are fine, but the local clowns just can't compete on any level for what I want in terms of transparency, platform and price.

Pimping MF is one thing, but lets talk reality rather than fantasy eh?

Options are different,on IB the margin is an absolute joke.
So if you are serious about trading options in the futures market you really
are an amature.Go through the process of executing a futures options order
next time you are trading on IB and see what the margin is.They want 10K margin for 1 position.Even a 1 Spi is not 10k.

Why would you trade with IB when your intra day margin is 3.75k and other brokers locally charge 1.5k during daytime hours.Why put up with 7.5k to trade the night session when everywhere else is 6k.

That comment about trading spi options on IB really shows you are not a real options trader.The margins on options are outrageous...Don't take my word for it check it yourself.

 

[Art_Cashin]

Just about everybody on this forum recognized that as nonsense.

Working an order = discretion/human imput = additional contest risk.

Horses for courses, but when I'm trading futures options it's significantly in excess of a 5 lot. There are others apart from IB that are fine, but the local clowns just can't compete on any level for what I want in terms of transparency, platform and price.

Pimping MF is one thing, but lets talk reality rather than fantasy eh?

For a small trader you are correct.For a large trader that is not the case.

 

[wayneL]

:sleeping:

You have failed to illustrate why this is so.

Sans substantiation, you could equally assert that black is white.

 

[wayneL]

Options are different,on IB the margin is an absolute joke.
So if you are serious about trading options in the futures market you really
are an amature.Go through the process of executing a futures options order
next time you are trading on IB and see what the margin is.They want 10K margin for 1 position.Even a 1 Spi is not 10k.

Why would you trade with IB when your intra day margin is 3.75k and other brokers locally charge 1.5k during daytime hours.Why put up with 7.5k to trade the night session when everywhere else is 6k.

That comment about trading spi options on IB really shows you are not a real options trader.The margins on options are outrageous...Don't take my word for it check it yourself.

EH?

Overnight margin is set by the exchange.

Intraday margin is irrelevant unless day trading.

Are you day trading SPI options?

 

[Art_Cashin]

:sleeping:

You have failed to illustrate why this is so.

Sans substantiation, you could equally assert that black is white.

For one reason the intra day margins can be as low as 1K for big volume regular customers.
Do IB offer that ??

Why would Hand trade on IB when his intra day margins could be 1K instead of nearly 4K ??

The local guys use Iress which has won many awards for their platform and are industry recognised.So the argument of platform does not enter the discussion.The charts on IB are not that good.Anyone who has used different
packages knows this.The iress platform is free if you do the volume.
Again it's for larger traders...IB is for smaller guys.

I rest my case !!!

 

[wayneL]

For one reason the intra day margins can be as low as 1K for big volume regular customers.
Do IB offer that ??

Why would Hand trade on IB when his intra day margins could be 1K instead of nearly 4K ??

The local guys use Iress which has won many awards for their platform and are industry recognised.So the argument of platform does not enter the discussion.The charts on IB are not that good.Anyone who has used different
packages knows this.The iress platform is free if you do the volume.
Again it's for larger traders...IB is for smaller guys.

I rest my case !!!

LOL

See post above. Intraday margin for options is irrelevant.

Why do big traders use IB then?

BTW have you heard the term "minimum margin = minimum intelligence"?

 

[Art_Cashin]

EH?

Overnight margin is set by the exchange.

Intraday margin is irrelevant unless day trading.

Are you day trading SPI options?

You really are out of your depth here.

The exchange can only set the margin once the day is over on options.
IB use their own margin just like they do on the Spi ...7.5K not 6K like the exchange sets.

From experience if you trade Spi options and you are paying more margin than the physical then you being charged incorrect margin.Who in their right mind would pay 8-10K in margin for an option 5-600 points out of the money with less than a month to expiry.Check it yourself on IB and see.
Anyone with the IB platform can do it.

 

[cutz]

Who in their right mind would pay 8-10K in margin for an option 5-600 points out of the money with less than a month to expiry

Don't tell me you're also a wings selling penny pincher.

 

[wayneL]

Pit

Why should I be concerned about day margin? I holding the blinkin' options overnight, ergo day margin irrelevant.

ON margin is SPAN.

You are concentrating on trifles that only concern day traders. Even then, only inadequately capitalized amateurs are worried about low day margins.

Discalimer - I don't trade AP options, but trade ES, GC, CL, C, S, W, KC, CC, SB, CT, EU, BP, ZN etc options

 

[Art_Cashin]

LOL

See post above. Intraday margin for options is irrelevant.

Why do big traders use IB then?

BTW have you heard the term "minimum margin = minimum intelligence"?

Overnight margin is set by the exchange.
There is discretion for intra day margin on Spi.
very few traders trade Spi options intra day.

 

[wayneL]

Overnight margin is set by the exchange.
There is discretion for intra day margin on Spi.
very few traders trade Spi options intra day.

My point exactly.

So why is intraday margin relevant to options traders?

Folk wisdom for you - When in a hole, it's wise to stop digging.

 

[mazzatelli]

Don't tell me you're also a wings selling penny pincher.

Why not? He'll provide the market for those of us who want wing gamma

 

[Art_Cashin]

Pit

Why should I be concerned about day margin? I holding the blinkin' options overnight, ergo day margin irrelevant.

ON margin is SPAN.

You are concentrating on trifles that only concern day traders. Even then, only inadequately capitalized amateurs are worried about low day margins.

Discalimer - I don't trade AP options, but trade ES, GC, CL, C, S, W, KC, CC, SB, CT, EU, BP, ZN etc options

You shouldn't my point is the overnight margin on Spi options are a joke.
If you tell me the margin on the others I can compare.

My day margin argument concerns Spi futures only not options!!!
Last time I checked to trade ES futures intra day was way higher on IB than
the local guys charge for margin.

Remember the days when IB were charging 15K margin to trade 1 Spi.
Imagine trying to push 20 lots.Imagine if you had some in the overnight kitty and suddenly they wanted double the margin.They would knock you out of the market like a flash.Imagine what would happen if you had options and could not fund the IB margin hike.

 

[Art_Cashin]

My point exactly.

So why is intraday margin relevant to options traders?

Folk wisdom for you - When in a hole, it's wise to stop digging.

It's not I never stated it was anywhere.
I'm only referring to intra day margins on futures nothin to do with options.

 

[wayneL]

Margin on all contracts is SPAN.

Day margin on futs is 50% of SPAN

From IB's site

Futures Options
Margin requirements are determined by risk based portfolio analysis models specified by each exchange. For specific details, visit the specific exchange site in question. IB futures minimums and 50% Day trading rates will apply.

 

[wayneL]

It's not I never stated it was anywhere.
I'm only referring to intra day margins on futures nothin to do with options.

Intraday futs is 50% of SPAN.

For a well capitalized retail trader, this is fine.

Again, if holding ON, irrelevant.

 

[Trembling Hand]

Low margin, I think I've heard this 'selling point' before... Now where was it again?? Oh thats right from bucket shops,

Hey Pit if Global is so good why did the biggest prop shop in Australia, the true locals, dump them and go with Fortis????????

And who else use Fortis to clear... oh thats right IB. LOL!!