Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

Scams, whose fault?

Jump to new
N

newbie trader

Joined
14 February 2010
Posts
387
Reactions
0
There seems to be an increasing number of news reports about scams run by both domestic and international criminals (many from Nigeria as it would seem). From cars guide scams to scams involving a non existent inheritance. A lot of the articles I read attribute some blame to the victims (stupidity, greed etc). This article is one example...

http://au.todaytonight.yahoo.com/article/6956582/general/car-scam
(i know today tonight isnt the best source but it seems to be authentic)

So do you think blame should be soley placed on the criminals, victims or a bit of both?

N.T
 
The Qld "Statewide" programme last night had an item on these scams.

Featured an elderly chap who'd succumbed to an email saying he'd won $300,000. From Nigeria, of course.

I just can't believe anyone would fall for this especially if quite obviously they'd not bought a ticket in a lottery with such a prize.

But apparently hundreds of people are continuing to get sucked into this despite all the publicity and warnings.

The poor old bloke last night said he'd like the perpetrator of the scam to live in his life for just one day so he could realise the dreadful harm he was doing.

To say that just demonstrates his naivete all over again: no scammer is going to give a moment's thought to any misery caused.
 
I agree Julia, however for some reason I can't help but feel sorry for the really elderly who are hooked in by these scams.

With the car scams I just can't belive people are so silly. One lady probably about 25 was scammed when she 'bought' a BMW X5 for somewhere between 9-15k. She never saw the car other than in pictures and all communication was done via email. She sent off her money which was then directed to someones bank account in London I think. All these cars are being 'sold' for 3-15x less than their real worth. Considering these scams seem to all be done through the internet, people with limited knowledge/experience with the internet will probably be more susceptible to the scams, such as the elderly.

N.T
 
Some people just seem to be easily duped when large amounts of money are waived at them.They go into what I call the "My ship has come in" mode

Believing that ,one day they would receive a windfall,they fail to apply any logical reasoning before responding to the scam.

Perhaps psychologists could explain the phenomenon more adequetely ,but that is my rationale for it..

As for the poor old guy..he seems to be trying to express his pain the only way he knows..by sharing it with those who gave it to him

It is a jungle out there
 
So do you think blame should be soley placed on the criminals, victims or a bit of both?
Click to expand...

Definitley both. What I don't like is when people try to blame others as well, such as blaming cars guide in the examples above, or stating that such companies should do better checks.

As for the people who get sucked in, I guess alot of the one's we hear about are due to greed, and most of the time although I feel sorry for what's happened to the victims, I still think they're idiots for sending large amounts of money over the internet, to a person they've never met (or checked out), for a car that they've never seen (as is way underpriced).

Again, those types of people are idiots, the one's I truly feel sorry for are the longer cons, where smaller amounts of money add up, like those looking for love on the net, or those unfortunate enough to hire the services of a dodgy dealer.
 
demiser said:
As for the people who get sucked in, I guess alot of the one's we hear about are due to greed, and most of the time although I feel sorry for what's happened to the victims, I still think they're idiots for sending large amounts of money over the internet, to a person they've never met (or checked out), for a car that they've never seen (as is way underpriced).

Again, those types of people are idiots, the one's I truly feel sorry for are the longer cons, where smaller amounts of money add up, like those looking for love on the net, or those unfortunate enough to hire the services of a dodgy dealer.
Click to expand...

Exactly, if I was offered a car (regardless of hindsight) for 10k that retails at 150k and im in QLD (seller being in NSW for instance) I would gladly spend a few hundred to fly down and check the car out for myself.

It's also, im guessing, quite hard to police? It reminds me somewhat of unsolicited goods (people send you goods with a bill and demand you pay for them). People were for some reason (guilt, fear of the consequences of not paying etc) paying for goods that they had not requested and had just turned up on their door step. Eventually everyone became wise and they made amendments to the TPA (s50-55 I think) which 'killed' it not making it worthwhile. It is a tenuous link but it just came to mind. Not sure what can be done to crack down on these scams though.

N.T
 
I think the saying goes 'A fool and his money are soon parted' something like that...the majority of net scams are easy to see through and can only be successfully perpetrated on the most gullible/stupid/greedy/lonely in our society.

Still i really hate these scammers...a very common scam globally (that never gets reported here) is the Nanny/cruise ship/Au pair type scam that is aimed at poor Eastern Euro and Asian women.

These poor, non world wise women look on the net for unskilled foreign jobs hopeing to earn a couple of hundred bucks a week to help the family etc and are lured by fancy web sites with hundreds of jobs...and all they have to do to get one of these jobs is pay a visa processing fee to the agency....as of course the employer will pay the airfare.:rolleyes:

All the scamers are after is a lousy 50 or 70 dollars (US) from these girls, so many pay up in the hope its all for real...after all its only 50 or 70 dollars and while its a months pay to them...big picture its seen to be worth the risk so they borrow from there rellies and send it western union.

I mean how low is that, taking money from poor people. :disgust:
 
nomore4s said:
Commonsense isn't that common
Click to expand...

Sad, but oh so true.

I have no sympathy for those taken by the blatantly obvious scams. Sure it's hard not to feel sorry for the poor old ditty taken for her life savings. But..... Common-sense for goodness sake.

The cunning scams are a different ball game. Madoff is one classic example. Sure it may have smelt like dog pile towards the end there to the informed investor. But to the uninformed, it all sounds legit - give me your money and I'll invest it in the markets for you.

Think of all the legit businesses promoting the exact same plug.
 
demiser said:
the one's I truly feel sorry for are the longer cons, where smaller amounts of money add up, like those looking for love on the net, or those unfortunate enough to hire the services of a dodgy dealer.
Click to expand...

So do I, demiser
And there are plenty of pretenders (you say "dodgy dealers") in the environment that this Forum is living in.
I mean the "I know" types, the "Listen to me!" rampers - who make earning a living by playing the sharemarket look so easy that many newbies get sucked in. They come up with this glorious idea: all it takes is a couple of minutes a day and the profits keep piling on.

So, any newbies out there believing such crap: It ain't so!
Unless you have somewhere between 5,000 and 10,000 hours to spare on studying the basics of accounting, statistics, technical analysis, and a swag of related subjects, your only chance of leaving the share market with a small fortune is to enter with a big one.

As regards "Licensed Advisors", the names of all really savvy ones that are working solely in YOUR best interest will probably fit on the back of a postage stamp. As long as they can charge you for their time and effort rather than tangible results, that's unlikely to change.
 
I would happily charge scamsters for attempted stealing irrespectively if they succeeded to pull scam through or not.

After all that was the aim in a first place.
 
So_Cynical said:
Still i really hate these scammers...a very common scam globally (that never gets reported here) is the Nanny/cruise ship/Au pair type scam that is aimed at poor Eastern Euro and Asian women.
Click to expand...
Yes, awful, but not as bad as the advts also aimed the above groups of women offering jobs as au pairs or hospitality/bar workers, where the advertiser actually pays the air fare for the girl to come here.

When she arrives she finds herself locked up in a brothel with many years of having to service up to 50 men a day. Usually she can't speak English and has no idea that she can appeal to authorities for help. That is, if she was able to escape the premises at all.
 
Julia said:
Yes, awful, but not as bad as the advts also aimed the above groups of women offering jobs as au pairs or hospitality/bar workers, where the advertiser actually pays the air fare for the girl to come here.

When she arrives she finds herself locked up in a brothel with many years of having to service up to 50 men a day. Usually she can't speak English and has no idea that she can appeal to authorities for help. That is, if she was able to escape the premises at all.
Click to expand...

Do you know much about this? I wouldn't have thought it would be such a big thing here, is it?

N.T
 
Proves that big brother would do more good if authorities could do random checks on how dwellings are used, who is there and if everybody has all papers intact.

I know police-state, but people don’t seem to worry too much about the law and what is right, so random checks could pick up a Fritzl or two.
 
I get plenty of scam emails, but this one is a new twist to my usual lot.

I've deleted the email address in case someone is stupid enough to try it out.

Dear Sir/Madam

We here to inform you there a compensation for scammed victim by
Nigeria scammed and fraudsters in Malaysia to protect our name
Malaysia crime investigation with America FBI Malaysia we have been
able to recall millions of dollar from the Nigeria Scammers in with
aid of Special Intelligence Task Force Malaysia and the government of
Malaysia is compensating each scammed victim with the sum of
USD$250,000 Dollar.

Regard,
Mr,Ahmed Bin Aziz.
Email xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Click to expand...
 
Whiskers said:
I get plenty of scam emails, but this one is a new twist to my usual lot.

I've deleted the email address in case someone is stupid enough to try it out.
Click to expand...

Are they saying that they are giving you the money because youve been scammed? If people are falling for this scam idk what they wont fall for.

N.T
 
newbie trader said:
Are they saying that they are giving you the money because youve been scammed? If people are falling for this scam idk what they wont fall for.

N.T
Click to expand...

Yeah, email them claiming you've been scammed (to claim the $250,000) and no doubt you'll be scammed to send them your delails to send the money too, or something similar.

The last part of the Email address is another give away... @wordwhiledmail.com... just the sort of address and standard of grammar you'd expect from an 'Official' Malaysian Government Special Intelligence Task Force. :rolleyes:
 
Top