Road Safety Remuneration Tribunal

SirRumpole · 14 April 2016

Seems that both parties are making a fuss about this.

Federal Government to introduce bill to abolish Road Safety Remuneration Tribunal next week

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=...&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=GQQPV-DwIOTLmwWpyKvQDA

Does anyone have any views ?

It seems to me that if owner drivers are forced to accept jobs for minimal returns they will have to be on the roads for longer periods, may take drugs to stay awake and may not spend the required money to maintain their vehicles.

They will then become a threat on the roads.

It seems the government will get on their high horse about people's rights to work for the lowest amounts possible whereas if people can't make enough money to operate without being a threat to others then maybe they should be in another business.

noco · 14 April 2016

SirRumpole said:
Seems that both parties are making a fuss about this.

Federal Government to introduce bill to abolish Road Safety Remuneration Tribunal next week

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=...&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=GQQPV-DwIOTLmwWpyKvQDA

Does anyone have any views ?

It seems to me that if owner drivers are forced to accept jobs for minimal returns they will have to be on the roads for longer periods, may take drugs to stay awake and may not spend the required money to maintain their vehicles.

They will then become a threat on the roads.

It seems the government will get on their high horse about people's rights to work for the lowest amounts possible whereas if people can't make enough money to operate without being a threat to others then maybe they should be in another business.

No...No...Noooooo Rumpy...You have got it all wrong......These truckies are owner drivers who do not want a bar of the unions...........Small Mum and Dad businesses trying to make an honest living but the LUG Party does not believe they should so Shorten brought in these stupid rules to try to force these poor bu99ers into joining their beloved TWU to prop up the coffers to feed the Labor Party and the Greens......Win by fair or foul means....Safety is far from the LUG party's mind......This safety crap is nothing more than a tool used by the unions as did the CFMEU on building sites.....That old adage has worn thin with voters and most of us are well and truly awake to it all.

Under Shorten's rules there has been some 30 truck accidents in the past year....So much for their safety excuse.

Turnbull has won over the cross benches with the proviso that safety rules will be updated.

Did Shorten and the unions ask the truckies their opinion or was it the usual trade union bully tactics.

I am afraid to say your thread will be short lived.

Tisme · 15 April 2016

I have a view:

If individuals or families want to live the life of a pikey they should buy a caravan and finagle their income like any other gypsy.

If, however, they want to earn enough to put their kids through a decent childhood, makes sure the rest of us motorists are not in the company of badly maintained death on wheels and want to participate in business with the same rules and barriers the rest of us business owners have to endure, they should pick up their game and raise the bar above hand to mouth in the name of freedom of choice.

I have friends who dropped out into the long haul trucky life ..... my godfather the blue wife beater singlets, the tattered flannel shirts, the stubbie shorts, the thongs, the course language delivered with nasal shrill, the fake driving sheets, the pills....it's like a different nation of people who have no idea of value add and wealth accumulation.

I wonder if it would be better for the kids to be abducted and taken to Lebanon

SirRumpole · 15 April 2016

Tisme said:
I have a view:

If individuals or families want to live the life of a pikey they should buy a caravan and finagle their income like any other gypsy.

If, however, they want to earn enough to put their kids through a decent childhood, makes sure the rest of us motorists are not in the company of badly maintained death on wheels and want to participate in business with the same rules and barriers the rest of us business owners have to endure, they should pick up their game and raise the bar above hand to mouth in the name of freedom of choice.

I have friends who dropped out into the long haul trucky life ..... my godfather the blue wife beater singlets, the tattered flannel shirts, the stubbie shorts, the thongs, the course language delivered with nasal shrill, the fake driving sheets, the pills....it's like a different nation of people who have no idea of value add and wealth accumulation.

I wonder if it would be better for the kids to be abducted and taken to Lebanon

Agree, and the holier than thou attitude of Barnaby Joyce defending such a meagre lifestyle and promoting it as a grand example of free enterprise was disgusting.

macca · 15 April 2016

Well, we do live in a land of free enterprise, this law is nothing more than price fixing in disguise, Russia and China tried that

Unions do make demands on and for their members but I am not sure if they should be able to set the market price for private owners to protect their union members and hence the union officials employment.

Should the government or a union be able to set the price for anything ? Should they be able to say to Aldi / Coles" you need to charge more than $1 for milk so that the truckies can earn more to transport it."

If they can dictate any freight rate, then that rate filters through to everything that we buy that has been transported. It would be very inflationary and if applied to every profession or trade then it would be crippling for small business.

It is up to the larger firms to remain competitive through economies of scale rather than draconian rulings enforced by the bully boys on someone doing there own thing.

If any small business wishes to discount their rates/prices why can't they, we get quotes/compare prices on just about everything we buy it is called free enterprise

noco · 15 April 2016

macca said:
Well, we do live in a land of free enterprise, this law is nothing more than price fixing in disguise, Russia and China tried that

Unions do make demands on and for their members but I am not sure if they should be able to set the market price for private owners to protect their union members and hence the union officials employment.

Should the government or a union be able to set the price for anything ? Should they be able to say to Aldi / Coles" you need to charge more than $1 for milk so that the truckies can earn more to transport it."

If they can dictate any freight rate, then that rate filters through to everything that we buy that has been transported. It would be very inflationary and if applied to every profession or trade then it would be crippling for small business.

It is up to the larger firms to remain competitive through economies of scale rather than draconian rulings enforced by the bully boys on someone doing there own thing.

If any small business wishes to discount their rates/prices why can't they, we get quotes/compare prices on just about everything we buy it is called free enterprise

Macca, you have hit the nail on the head but mention free enterprise to our Fabian friends in the LUG party and it becomes a dirty word.....their aim is central control over what we do and what we say.

SirRumpole · 15 April 2016

macca said:
It is up to the larger firms to remain competitive through economies of scale rather than draconian rulings enforced by the bully boys on someone doing there own thing.

If any small business wishes to discount their rates/prices why can't they, we get quotes/compare prices on just about everything we buy it is called free enterprise

Fine in theory, but there is no doubt that people who cut costs also cut corners when it comes to things like safety.

That's been proven in the airline industry and it's the same in the trucking industry.

So if you get mashed on the road by a bleary eyed owner driver who spent 18 hours at the wheel and can't afford to get his brakes fixed, don't come complaining to me (assuming you are still able to complain).

noco · 15 April 2016

SirRumpole said:
Fine in theory, but there is no doubt that people who cut costs also cut corners when it comes to things like safety.

That's been proven in the airline industry and it's the same in the trucking industry.

So if you get mashed on the road by a bleary eyed owner driver who spent 18 hours at the wheel and can't afford to get his brakes fixed, don't come complaining to me (assuming you are still able to complain).

What a load of cods waddle Rumpy....You have got more chance of getting smashed by some brainless kid with a "P" plate intoxicated out of his mind with grog or drugs than you have with a truckie.....As I said before this thread will be short lived as it is about to go through the senate with the blessing of the cross benches so stop trying to support a LUG Party lost cause.

The majority of truckies are responsible people and you will always get one bad apple as in any business.

macca · 15 April 2016

SirRumpole said:
Fine in theory, but there is no doubt that people who cut costs also cut corners when it comes to things like safety.

That's been proven in the airline industry and it's the same in the trucking industry.

So if you get mashed on the road by a bleary eyed owner driver who spent 18 hours at the wheel and can't afford to get his brakes fixed, don't come complaining to me (assuming you are still able to complain).

That is why we have scaleys, surely in todays world it should be simple to have locating and tracking devices installed in every truck.

They already have average speed cameras, why not just read a tag as they go past ?

If the union can dictate what the freight rates are then surely the next step is to set rates for all industries, all sparkies must charge XX per hour, all mechanics must charge YY per hour etc

This quickly stamps out the opportunity for anyone to discount their price to get the job or to start a new business from scratch

As I said welcome to the controlled world of communism

SirRumpole · 15 April 2016

macca said:
That is why we have scaleys, surely in todays world it should be simple to have locating and tracking devices installed in every truck.

They already have average speed cameras, why not just read a tag as they go past ?

If the union can dictate what the freight rates are then surely the next step is to set rates for all industries, all sparkies must charge XX per hour, all mechanics must charge YY per hour etc

This quickly stamps out the opportunity for anyone to discount their price to get the job or to start a new business from scratch

As I said welcome to the controlled world of communism

I can see your point and I've no problem with competition per se.

If owner operators pass the safety tests (whatever they are) they should be able to charge what they like, but unregulated competition is just a race to the bottom as far as standards are concerned imo.

macca · 15 April 2016

SirRumpole said:
I can see your point and I've no problem with competition per se.

If owner operators pass the safety tests (whatever they are) they should be able to charge what they like, but unregulated competition is just a race to the bottom as far as standards are concerned imo.

The race to the bottom is applicable to every industry anywhere there is free enterprise.

Why do people pay $100 for a steak in one restaurant and $20 all you can eat in another, we pay for what we want. There are specialist freight companies that charge accordingly, there are truckies that have been sub contracting to the same company for years.

Trucks are already regulated by safety standards but that hasn't stopped some terrible accidents in Sydney where trucks have crashed, the two most recent ones are both from large companies. The standards the Union wants to apply to owner drivers are already in place at these companies and it did not help one bit.

If I was the actual owner/driver of the truck I am far more likely to make sure the brakes work

There are honest hard working people starting out and there are ratbags in every industry you can name, the safety catch cry is a Union excuse to control things, just look at the CFMEU, "safety" is just an excuse to manipulate and control the site.

Free enterprise is the only way that works, look at the turn around in China since allowing a free market.

noco · 15 April 2016

macca said:
The race to the bottom is applicable to every industry anywhere there is free enterprise.

Why do people pay $100 for a steak in one restaurant and $20 all you can eat in another, we pay for what we want. There are specialist freight companies that charge accordingly, there are truckies that have been sub contracting to the same company for years.

Trucks are already regulated by safety standards but that hasn't stopped some terrible accidents in Sydney where trucks have crashed, the two most recent ones are both from large companies. The standards the Union wants to apply to owner drivers are already in place at these companies and it did not help one bit.

If I was the actual owner/driver of the truck I am far more likely to make sure the brakes work

There are honest hard working people starting out and there are ratbags in every industry you can name, the safety catch cry is a Union excuse to control things, just look at the CFMEU, "safety" is just an excuse to manipulate and control the site.

Free enterprise is the only way that works, look at the turn around in China since allowing a free market.

Well spoken Macca....The Unions and the Labor Party are becoming desperate for money and they will stop at nothing to get it as their membership sinks to an all time low.

Any way Shorten's dumb policy will soon be done and dusted ...out the doors with Labors other hare brain schemes.

Tisme · 15 April 2016

macca said:
Well, we do live in a land of free enterprise, this law is nothing more than price fixing in disguise, Russia and China tried that

Unions do make demands on and for their members but I am not sure if they should be able to set the market price for private owners to protect their union members and hence the union officials employment.

Should the government or a union be able to set the price for anything ? Should they be able to say to Aldi / Coles" you need to charge more than $1 for milk so that the truckies can earn more to transport it."

If they can dictate any freight rate, then that rate filters through to everything that we buy that has been transported. It would be very inflationary and if applied to every profession or trade then it would be crippling for small business.

It is up to the larger firms to remain competitive through economies of scale rather than draconian rulings enforced by the bully boys on someone doing there own thing.

If any small business wishes to discount their rates/prices why can't they, we get quotes/compare prices on just about everything we buy it is called free enterprise

I take it you are not being selective and would rather the law of the jungle in every aspect of business? No rules, just unfettered competition, not consumer protections, not safety nets, no government, a free for all....?

macca · 15 April 2016

Tisme said:
I take it you are not being selective and would rather the law of the jungle in every aspect of business? No rules, just unfettered competition, not consumer protections, not safety nets, no government, a free for all....?

I am quite happy for the government to have rules and regulations, else we do not have civilisation, I am not sure why you would suggest that ??

Nowhere in my post have I suggested no rules, I have said that we need to encourage competition between all sizes of business within the laws of our country.

I am a strong believer in free enterprise, small business is vital in our society to fill all sorts of needs in our world, big business does have some advantages over small but the small can and should be nimble and adaptive in filling niche markets.

If we start allowing Unions to insist that they should have the right to dictate to small business owners, (who are rarely union members) then it is very unlikely that the Union will be acting in the interest of the small business, they will always do what is best for the Union.

As is demonstrated regularly, Unions consider themselves to be able to make their own rules and expect to control the Labor Party in return for electoral support and huge advertising prior to each election. I don't have a problem with that part, it makes sense that the Unions formed the Labor Party and support it so they should work together.

However, I do fear for the welfare of small business if Unions start making decisions that apply to them when they are not members of that Union.

noco · 15 April 2016

Tisme said:
I take it you are not being selective and would rather the law of the jungle in every aspect of business? No rules, just unfettered competition, not consumer protections, not safety nets, no government, a free for all....?

It is called free enterprise Tisme.......If you want all those rules, protection and regulations you seek then vote Labor, Green, Democratic Socialism, Communism or what ever you like to call it.

If you want to save money, then shop around you might be surprised just how much competition there is out in that big wide wonderful world...If you are mug enough to pay a higher price, then you deserve all you get.

In the modern world there is a system called the internet......E-Bay.....Gum Tree.....you will be pleasantly surprised just how much you can save.

There is an old saying...."BUYER BEWARE"......so don't be so lazy next time you want to buy something...Don't depend on consumer protection, safety rules and no government protection....We go into business to make a profit and it is pretty obvious you know very little about the way a business operates.

If you want to pay a higher price, then stop whinging about it.

SirRumpole · 15 April 2016

Don't depend on consumer protection, safety rules and no government protection....We go into business to make a profit and it is pretty obvious you know very little about the way a business operates.

Hang that out the front of your business and see how you go.

The Creed of the Ripoff Artist.

Tisme · 15 April 2016

noco said:
It is called free enterprise Tisme........

I don't need to be lectured about free enterprise Noco. I am astounded to realise that I might just be one of the very few free enterprise business owners here, because some of the comments here point to rather poor business acumen.... the voice of the puritan wages and salaries hostage more likely (when I was a boy mentality...)

I'm surprised people like (et al) you didn't study your high school economics harder and the reason the brakes are put on laissez faire.

The impudence of Barnaby Joyce to keep the transport costs down so his beleaguered rural community doesn't have to raid the already empty tin cans on the fridge is an insult to common sense. Surely the vagabond status of farmers and their constant hand in taxpayer pockets for subsidies and bounties is testament to the lunacy of the sole trader being able to make a decent quid without a floor under them provided by govt legislation and governance.

Just pack it guys. You have no cred when it comes to making a small family business profitable. You need to go and see the squalor many of those trucky families live in, while hubby is out of the road trying to pay for a big rig he just can't afford. The determination to drive the economy down to third world status is disingenuous to the people and the community at large. IMO

noco · 15 April 2016

Tisme said:
I don't need to be lectured about free enterprise Noco. I am astounded to realise that I might just be one of the very few free enterprise business owners here, because some of the comments here point to rather poor business acumen.... the voice of the puritan wages and salaries hostage more likely (when I was a boy mentality...)

I'm surprised people like (et al) you didn't study your high school economics harder and the reason the brakes are put on laissez faire.

The impudence of Barnaby Joyce to keep the transport costs down so his beleaguered rural community doesn't have to raid the already empty tin cans on the fridge is an insult to common sense. Surely the vagabond status of farmers and their constant hand in taxpayer pockets for subsidies and bounties is testament to the lunacy of the sole trader being able to make a decent quid without a floor under them provided by govt legislation and governance.

Just pack it guys. You have no cred when it comes to making a small family business profitable. You need to go and see the squalor many of those trucky families live in, while hubby is out of the road trying to pay for a big rig he just can't afford. The determination to drive the economy down to third world status is disingenuous to the people and the community at large. IMO

I could not help LMAO Tisme.

I successfully managed four free enterprise business of my own and managed one for 28years.......I even took on two that were running at a loss and turned them around to be profitable....If I had not succeeded I would have gone broke....If I had not shown a profit for my company (who I might add had share holders) I would have been sacked.....I am not going to reveal my professional base to you but I can add 2 and 2 together.

So you have your own business!!!!!.....Are you happy to run at a loss, break even or make as much profit as you can?...Do you pay your workers as little as possible or do you reward them for their efforts and results?

So you don't you believe that an owner truck driver is entitled to make as much profit as he can without the interference of the Labor Party or the unions?

Stop trying to be holier than thou Tisme...Get over your ego trip.

luutzu · 15 April 2016

Tisme said:
I don't need to be lectured about free enterprise Noco. I am astounded to realise that I might just be one of the very few free enterprise business owners here, because some of the comments here point to rather poor business acumen.... the voice of the puritan wages and salaries hostage more likely (when I was a boy mentality...)

I'm surprised people like (et al) you didn't study your high school economics harder and the reason the brakes are put on laissez faire.

The impudence of Barnaby Joyce to keep the transport costs down so his beleaguered rural community doesn't have to raid the already empty tin cans on the fridge is an insult to common sense. Surely the vagabond status of farmers and their constant hand in taxpayer pockets for subsidies and bounties is testament to the lunacy of the sole trader being able to make a decent quid without a floor under them provided by govt legislation and governance.

Just pack it guys. You have no cred when it comes to making a small family business profitable. You need to go and see the squalor many of those trucky families live in, while hubby is out of the road trying to pay for a big rig he just can't afford. The determination to drive the economy down to third world status is disingenuous to the people and the community at large. IMO

Wise words there Tisme. With heart too. Mr Hyde taking a day off?

luutzu · 15 April 2016

noco said:
It is called free enterprise Tisme.......If you want all those rules, protection and regulations you seek then vote Labor, Green, Democratic Socialism, Communism or what ever you like to call it.

If you want to save money, then shop around you might be surprised just how much competition there is out in that big wide wonderful world...If you are mug enough to pay a higher price, then you deserve all you get.

In the modern world there is a system called the internet......E-Bay.....Gum Tree.....you will be pleasantly surprised just how much you can save.

There is an old saying...."BUYER BEWARE"......so don't be so lazy next time you want to buy something...Don't depend on consumer protection, safety rules and no government protection....We go into business to make a profit and it is pretty obvious you know very little about the way a business operates.

If you want to pay a higher price, then stop whinging about it.

What you're proposing sounds a lot like Communist VN and Communist China to me noco.

Buyer beware; Let the entrepreneurs do their things without red tapes and regulations and the results will be cheaper goods, more flexibility... OR, or cancer, early deaths, illness, poisoning... or cheaper goods.

Take a trip to VN or China and see what an unregulated market does to consumers.

Road Safety Remuneration Tribunal

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Tisme

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Tisme

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