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Query on Dales Pty Ltd Brisbane - flogging software

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If only I had known this site beforehand. I too have been talked into purchasing this software on March 12 2007. My initial encounter with them was back in December by means of cold call. I was told all the virtues of this software and how there were limited licenses left and that I have to hurry. Because there was absolutely no way I could even afford the software they gave up. I thought that was the end of it.
Then they rang again in March! He said apparently two more licenses became available bec. some people did not get their finance approve. I don't know how many times they rang. In total I think atleast 6 times. They said exactly the same about half now half later, the profit you'll make (20% he said) and made me check ASIC website to show that they are a registered business. The salesperson (head accountant (?)) said if I don't ring back by such and such a time I might just miss out because there were other people in his list that were interested! By then the tone of his voice sounded irate :mad:. It was like almost a threat. Guess what I didn't ring. His attitude put me off.
The next day to my surprise he still rang! This was then he came up with the 'Protection from the credit card consumer rights', tactic. 'What is stopping you? You have nothing to loose at all,etc, etc'. - that was the only talk that made me take the risk thinking to myself surely with a price tag like that you must be protected. These people would just about use all the sales tactics they can to wear you down. Somebody has used the term 'wear you down' and 'seduce you into submission'.
Although I signed credit card authorisation, I didn't sign and send the deed of acknowledgement which came with the package because I didn't know I had to spend on all these other extras. I I never got to use the package. I have asked for refund within a week of getting software and they declined saying 'change of mind' is not justifiable and that I had opened package! But I didn't know all these other cost and I never signed the deed of acknowledgement!
I have been corresponding with Consumers Affairs Victoria which has been very helpful. I have found that in many cases Dales contravene the rules for telemarketing in Victoria (Well in my case anyway). In my case they did not inform me of my cooling off rights AS PRESCRIBED by the FTA (if they didn't inform you, in Victoria you have 6 months rights to cancel agreement)
If you want to know the telemarketing rules go to Full details of the Fair Trading Act requirements in Victoria go to

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_act/fta1999117/

I have sent them my 4th letter of request for refund and I have attached email from Consumers Affairs Victoria. If I don't hear from them within this week, CAV will intervene. If they still don't refund I have no option but to take them to court.
Needless to say the day I made telephone marketing agreement (credit card authorisation) just happens to be on a public holiday, labour day Victoria, which according to FTA telemarketers are not suppose to allowed to call you at all!!:mad::mad:
 
Before court I'd be contacting ASIC and/or FICS.

The Financial Industry Complaints Service (FICS) is an external dispute resolution (EDR) scheme that was established to provide free advice and assistance to consumers to help them in resolving complaints relating to members of the financial services industry, including life insurance, pooled superannuation trusts, funds management, financial advice, stock broking, investment advice and sales of financial or investment products. There is no charge to consumers for any service provided by FICS in handling complaints. We are a national service.

The financial services regulator, the Australian Securities and Investments Commission (ASIC), issue Australian Financial Services Licenses (AFSL) to providers of financial services. One of the conditions of an AFSL is that the license holder must be a member of an approved External Dispute Resolution (EDR) scheme if they are dealing with retail clients. FICS is an approved EDR scheme.
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CAV is the one who advised me to take the matter to court if they still refuse to refund after he talks to them. The one who has been handling my case is the Senior conciliator of Consumers Affairs Victoria.
By the way I just want to add something about the way I've been treated by Dales with regards to my request for refund. On my first request, I asked to speak to the so called head accountant because he was the one who pestered me about this software. All those things he said and all those things he hadn't told me. They wouldn't let me speak to him but directed me to the customer service person who rudely said to me 'Well you bought it, you sell it for $4000~!'. 'How can you talk like that! What do you know?', I thought with my blood curdling. I rang again they still wouldn't let me speak to the sales person.
My goodness, they just about hounded me and said everything they can possibly think of just to hook you and lock you in on making a telephone agreement and then when they find out that I do not want to continue they treat you like that! They even unappropriately use the 'law' as their argument to refuse refund when they have obviously breached a number of the rules for telemarketing themselves! Also the very people they assured me who would protect me (the banks - the credit card consumer rights) they now use as their defense for their refusal to refund. The banks showed me I authorised it, so they can't assist me. How can I be so stupid! Of course the banks don't care about the legalities of the whole thing. No wonder this head accountant said credit card consumer rights and not consumer rights knowing the bank is more on their side! It is all well planned!
To quote the so-called head accountant
'I have to go to a meeting now! If you don't ring back by 5 o'clock, there are other people interested in my list and we only have a couple of licenses left etc etc !!!', he threateningly said. I think he thought I was going to ring. I didn't ring.
Now I wonder what really the meeting was about (if there really was any). I think he was just trying to sound professional or maybe they were discussing 'How else can we possibly hook this people, they just wouldn't give in! What about the most risky one - the credit card consumer rights protection. Don't forget to emphasise Credit Card.......'.
Then the next day, Labour Day Victoria, I get a very courteous call - 'Hello there, it's me (so and so). How are you? Just checking if you did check the ASIC website?..... Look I know you want to make money. What is stopping you? Is there anything you're unsure of.....Did you know if you use the banks money blah blah blah'. :banghead:
 
Vivienne said:
It seems to me I can get more advice etc from Commsec.
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Thank you Vivienne for your comment, that's exactly what I was thinking as the "boiler room" salesman (Kahn) was doing his job.

I believe this product does what it says, but is it worth 4,500?
Can a beginner do this on his own using free resources? ... I believe I can.
They are definitely dogs for pushing the CC type purchase to me when I say I don't have that in savings.

The fact that they didn't allow me to pay $0 upfront, and just monitor my portfolio and bill me as soon as I have made 8.5K was a bit weird, but I guess they need money to run a company too.
I told them that even Harvey Norman will allow you to purchase 4.5k worth of stuff interest free ;) :D Not that I would have anyways.

I would like to point out that they told me, "we wouldn't give you the software for nothing coz we don't know you from a bar of soap". My reply was, "well why the hell would I buy a piece of software for 4.5K from one phone call? I don't know you either", also I've never seen the guarantee, shouldn't I be able to read all legal materials before paying any money?... yes of course, and everybody should think this before handing anybody any money.

Personally, I keep telling my self that "if you can't convince a friend to lend you money for an investment, then there is something wrong with your plan"
My goal now is to create such a solid investment plan that even a mate would say, "that's cool, I'll jump into that with you." So... with this great software deal, too hard to convince a mate to fork over 4.5k for it.

By the way, I've made those returns just playing Virtual Stock Exchange. And I wasn't even day trading. And, I'm a total beginner.

A solicitor advised that all legal materials should be looked at before jumping into a contract. These guys wanted the money before anything, and that just smells like trouble to me. :cool:

Thank you to all who have posted in this forum, you've been a great help.
 
I too have been ripped off by the Dales Slicksters - I am so peeved that I hadn't checked them out more thoroughly by searching on the web prior to commiting to purchase their rip off software. I have been running various trials for a couple of weeks only to discover the sytem is a total rip off.

It is sad that people like this exist - they are liars, cheats and fraudsters of the first degree. All of the posted comments on this site re. their slick sales pitch were plied onto me with similar pressure and relentlessness.

I am now in the process of seeking a full refund. I wonder how many other people have been ripped off. I have written 3 times and have been ramping up the pressure each time after their denials and refusal to admit to their illegal practices. My last letter informed them that I would be informing the ASIC, and the various consumer protection authorities.

We need to gang up against this company so that our combined pressures to recover our monies and to prevent others from being ripped off are more effective.

To those of you out there who have fallen prey to these malicious predators - please take heart that there may be hope to recover our hard earned monies. We need to combine our efforts and make these slicksters regrete what they have done in their illegal practices. I have vowed to Dales that I will not stop my efforts to recover my full refund - we must all do the same but as a combined effort. Lets get our monies back.

I am not sure how we can pool our resources - possibly continue through this forum?? I am prepared to put time and effort into recovering my money - how many others out there are of the same mind and determination??
 
:( Not Happy at all I got sucked in to paying 8.5k on my C.C now im paying that off, on my own as a single mother of 5, it has ruined my marriage and my family. How can these people be so cruel, dont they have a heart, I have just been let out of hospital after a month im on lots of medication to lift my spirits. I hope someone can get some money back from them. I feel so stupid and angry.:banghead:
 
I have only seen 1 person trying to run various trials??of the program.Has anyone on this forum actually bought and been running it for a while to see if it does work and if so, to what result??:confused:I too have been contacted by them and ABSOLUTELY HATE there sales ethics (If you could call it that),but is the program actually any good??
 
I conducted some trials for 2 weeks - it is nothing but a random number generator as far as I can see. The sales pitch is focussed on the systems "unique and sophisticated" technical analysis "using 250+ technical analysis tools" that then allocates points for each stock and then ranks them in order from "Best" to "Worst". According to the sales pitch all you have to do is pick the top stocks.

In practice this is absolute RUBBISH - there is NO way of verifying how the number is generated - it is all over the place with no consistency from one day to the next as stocks move up and down the list with no real consistency or predictability.

When challenged regarding their system - Dales quickly back-off claiming their system is nothing more than a charting program - thats right a simple charting program!! And simple it is - the charts are absolute RUBBISH - simple moving averages and thats it - nothing else!!

My STRONG ADVICE - AVOID AT ALL COSTS!!

DON"T BE FOOLED INTO PURCHASING - JUST HANG UP ON THEM - IF THEY KEEP CALLING AS THEY ARE PERSISTANT IF THEY GET A WHIFF OF INTEREST - AGAIN HANG UP - THEN IF THEY KEEP CALLING - START THE ABUSE AND TELL THEM TO LEAVE YOU ALONE.
 
Thanks for your advice it is greatly appreciated.....They have a very strong and persuading sales staff,that when I asked if i could preview the program where not interested and said even if i did it would be on data over a month old and that they don't do demo discs....funny that you can buy $200 accountancy programs which have FREE demo discs that you can take home and preview!!!!
 
I HAVE JUST FINISHED SEARCHING THIS MOB thank god i found this place i will be speaking to GEORGE from DALES tomorrow and im gonna give him a big chunk of verbal.. I am also going to contact CH9 A current affair this needs to be made public fast....

edit.... phone call made to a current affair they took details and a return call will be made within 2 days
 
mickg said:
I HAVE JUST FINISHED SEARCHING THIS MOB thank god i found this place i will be speaking to GEORGE from DALES tomorrow and im gonna give him a big chunk of verbal.. I am also going to contact CH9 A current affair this needs to be made public fast....

edit.... phone call made to a current affair they took details and a return call will be made within 2 days
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good onyer mickg, give these slimebags a good dose of ACA, i still feel my blood boiling when i remember the fastest talking salesperson i have ever heard telling me to use the old mastercard. i put the phone on speaker to give all my workmates a chuckle.
to all those who have been conned, my sympathies, and i hope you join mickg in kicking up a stink on ACA. these cockroaches pull their heads in when the light is shone upon them. they remind me of the horse racing programmes larry pickering was flogging.:mad:
 
George just rang me i told him i had a few questions i would like answered first before making a decision and i asked him about the comments i had read on here i dont think i have had anyone hang up on me so quick..
But i did catcha phone number for them guess what its a1300 number (1300733193) if anyone interested i tried to call back but kept getting told he was IN A MEETING ha yeh right.. still waiting to hear from ACA when i do are any of the people that have been caught interested in getting involved in the action against them i will post more info when i hear from them.. once again thank you to the members here bringing my attention to these scum before i parted with my hard earned $$
 
mickg said:
George just rang me i told him i had a few questions i would like answered first before making a decision and i asked him about the comments i had read on here i dont think i have had anyone hang up on me so quick..
But i did catcha phone number for them guess what its a1300 number (1300733193) if anyone interested i tried to call back but kept getting told he was IN A MEETING ha yeh right.. still waiting to hear from ACA when i do are any of the people that have been caught interested in getting involved in the action against them i will post more info when i hear from them.. once again thank you to the members here bringing my attention to these scum before i parted with my hard earned $$
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Yes I certainly would be interested in getting involved in an action against them. Keep me informed! I tried to get a refund but no luck so far. We all need to stick togther on this one and put a stop to this scam once and for all!
 
Vivienne said:
Yes I certainly would be interested in getting involved in an action against them. Keep me informed! I tried to get a refund but no luck so far. We all need to stick togther on this one and put a stop to this scam once and for all!
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Hi all,I also have been stung by these knobs and have had the same responce from them as everyone else on the forum.
According to their high presure salespitch you don't need to know anything about the stock market because the programe dose everything for you in very little time, Ha,I have spent nurmous hours giving this very expensive programe the benifit of the doubt and have found there is no consistancy what so ever in the results it returns.
I'm glad I didn't actually invest any more money in the stock market thru this programe because I found by paper trading that I lost a lot more money than I made.
I have put this down to experience and won't be caught again.
I'm more than willing to jump in to the pool with everyone else and give these plebs what they deserve. I only wish I had found this site before I got sucked in.
Thanks for all the advice on the forum.
 
follow up call made and was told by ACA investigations still in progress:banghead: heres hoping will keep you all posted
 
The main point here is Lodge complaints with ASIC and have a good case.

Everyone should read their contract... if you have one. I believe there is a certain time before you can ask for a refund, however Australia protects consumers (or should).

Lodge complaints with ASIC. They deal with financial company complaints. Make a lot of noise, but make sure you have hard evidence for your statements.

Listing Keywords here so that others may find it: "TopStocksTomorrow", and "TomorrowTopStocks", and "Stock Top Tomorrow", and "Tomorrow Top Stock"
:(

ASIC - how to complain link

Wish everybody the best of luck :cool:
 
Not yet - still in process of dealing with CAV in claim against Dales. Will submit claim with VCAT if CAV negotiations fail. We "won't let the bastards grind us down!!!" Right is on our side!!
 
Hi Vivien,

I would suggest you undertake an good quality education program from a reputable education group, I can make some recommendations which will very depending on where you live.

I have been involved in the indusrty for in nearly 8 years now and have seen some shonks in that time, however there are some very reputable people out there, you just need to know where to look.

Have a great day

Pete
 
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