Paying for Information and Education

[patn]

Hello to all. Im a novice when it comes to trading and not sure where to start or what to look at. I have looked at some companies that will sell you a program, trading platform and access to their live trade calls for Commodities, Currency and Eminis and the returns seem great if you want to believe it. I have no problem with paying for education or information as long as it is effective. Has anyone brought from these companies, is it a good thing for the novice or should they be avoided. Thanks

 

[esolano]

Just looking into this as well. Anyone know a decent online subscription service that provides reliable information and with good track record?

 

[prawn_86]

Think about this. If a company or someone could consistently profit from the market, why would they need to sell you their 'packages'? Most online brokers provide a news service which will show valuations of companies etc. (this doesnt mean they are correct though)

Depending on the type of investing/trading you are after, there are subscription services which give advice and insights of their opinions, but avoid paying big dollars for 'black box systems' as they are virtually always a scam.

 

[Timmy]

Good questions and there is plenty around the forum addressing them.

Have a browse through the Beginners Lounge, Trading/Investing Resources, Trading Strategies/Systems to start with and you will see many discussions of the various resources, both free and paid, available.

Take very careful note of what prawn has said too - avoid the scams.

 

[esolano]

Thanks guys. Appreciate the advice.
I'm more a part-time trader if there is such a thing.

 

[patn]

Thanks for the reply's. I have asked my Finance Adviser the same question, if it's all so great what are you still sitting across the table from me for. I thought these companies may be a good place to get started in trading quickly and hopefully not burn your money straight off the bat.

 

[wonderrman]

Don't use programs their a waste of money. Use the money to buy books and read about what great traders have done and how they did it. Keep your system simple as complexity breeds confusion. Be prepared to lose your first wad of cash, because you probably will. Paper trade, but remember that it is a lot different when you have real money on the line. Save up before your first start as well, trying to trade anything less then $15K when your a beginner in a bear market is a killer as commission will eat you alive. Read these forums as there are many many pages of answers to your questions.

wonder.

 

[Mr J]

In my opinion, it's beneficial for a trader to figure it out for themselves. Most of these services are probably rubbish, and following others' trades is a crutch at best. Best to play around with paper money, finding something that suits you. Then apply it to real trading and refine it. I wouldn't bother listening to a financial advisor unless they had proven themselves, but in that case they would unlikely still be a financial advisor! Of course, this is just my opinion, and it may be as worthless as the typical FA or internet forum "trader" .

Save up before your first start as well, trying to trade anything less then $15K when your a beginner in a bear market is a killer as commission will eat you alive. Read these forums as there are many many pages of answers to your questions.

No they won't. Deposit 12k at IB, remove 7k and then day trade the SPI for one contract. Or, 10k with overnight positions.

 

[dutchie]

Hi patn & esolano

The answer to your questions and more can be found in this forum.

You just need to search.

Cheers
dutchie

 

[Krusty the Klown]

The old saying is "If it seems too good to be true, it usually is....." especially anything that is advertised.

 

[esolano]

so i guess it all comes down to doing your own research and trusting your own instincts.

 

[prawn_86]

and trusting your own instincts.

Once you have a fair idea that those instincts are likely to be correct, and you have appropriate money management in place.

 

[johenmo]

Search for books here - I recommend Van Tharp Financial Freedom, Adaptive Analysis. If you want to do yr own charting Louise Bedford Charting Secrets is a good start.

The answers are here in some form but not easy to find. Be wary of spending money on a programme.

Find a mentor or someone to bounce ideas off. If they are learning but are ahead then that can be handy as you can discuss ideas.

Look at the chartist (i subscribe) there are some free items there. It's worth it to me for education. HAs a free 2 week trial I believe.

 

[GumbyLearner]

If you are looking for consistent yields. Read The Intelligent Investor by Benjamin Graham. Understanding the stock is the most important thing according to him.

 

[Julia]

Have you read the Education section of the ASX website, www.asx.com.au?
It's free, explains in clear terms how the market works and gives an introduction to shares, derivatives, technical and fundamental analysis etc.

Then if you decide you're interested in a technical approach, the book I found most useful was Stan Weinstein's "Secrets for Profiting in Bull and Bear Markets".

But do the ASX info first.

 

[tech/a]

Think about this. If a company or someone could consistently profit from the market, why would they need to sell you their 'packages'? Most online brokers provide a news service which will show valuations of companies etc. (this doesn't mean they are correct though)

This is a comment that is often seen.
I think there are reasons "Why" they NEED to sell their packages.
(1) Its very good Business. Many years ago I went to a Guppy seminar in Adelaide---which isn't renowned as the business mecca of Australia.It was $149/head. There were 200 jammed into this room and another 200 for the next 2 nights. Some quick maths and that's $75k in 3 nights + all the trailing goods on offer which were snapped up. Then off to Melbourne-- with bigger crowds.

(2) Provides excellent very low risk cash flow.
So if you really can trade what a great low risk way of gaining more capital--whether you need it or not.

(3) Gives the educators a life
Face to face contact with people,satisfaction in what your doing.
Profitable trading is boring--this can help arrest some of the boredom.
Personal satisfaction of building a business.


Don't get me wrong there are people who cant build businesses Nor trade Nor Educate.

THEN
There is the topic often discussed of cost of education.
If you really think about the cost of setting someone up in a serious training course,the amount of work could vary greatly.The cost could well run into the $1000/s,if your talking software and or time---say a 6 mth course.
Teasers can be $100s as seen above.

It really boils down to buyer beware.
My gauge has always been in most things---word of mouth.
If there is lots of positive feed back then that's where I'll look.
We do the same in our company and people search us out!

 

[Sean K]

This is a comment that is often seen.
I think there are reasons "Why" they NEED to sell their packages.
(1) Its very good Business. Many years ago I went to a Guppy seminar in Adelaide---which isn't renowned as the business mecca of Australia.It was $149/head. There were 200 jammed into this room and another 200 for the next 2 nights. Some quick maths and that's $75k in 3 nights + all the trailing goods on offer which were snapped up. Then off to Melbourne-- with bigger crowds.

(2) Provides excellent very low risk cash flow.
So if you really can trade what a great low risk way of gaining more capital--whether you need it or not.

(3) Gives the educators a life
Face to face contact with people,satisfaction in what your doing.
Profitable trading is boring--this can help arrest some of the boredom.
Personal satisfaction of building a business.

Tech, I think the only good reason you're presented there is (3) that it gives a trader a life outside of a computer screen. Otherwise, if their trading plan / black box / education is so good, they obviously don't need 1 and 2.

The other reason could be that they are a genuinely altruistic beast.

However, I don't believe altruism exists.

So, it must just be to get a life.

As far as eduation goes, try all the low cost approaches first to get a basic knowledge before committing to big money courses.

 

[tech/a]

Kenna's

They dont have to NEED to

I dont NEED to trade but I do.
I dont NEED to work but I do.
I dont NEED to ride 30k to work then 30K back but I do.

There are lots of things we dont NEED to do
but we do them.
Why not.

On my bike!

 

[Sean K]

Kenna's

They dont have to NEED to

I dont NEED to trade but I do.
I dont NEED to work but I do.
I dont NEED to ride 30k to work then 30K back but I do.

There are lots of things we dont NEED to do
but we do them.
Why not.

On my bike!

We NEED to do everything Tech.

I'm just coming from a different philosophical position.

You're on your bike for a reason I guess. ie, you NEED to get on your bike. You can think up a reason.

Or, I'm a lunatic.

As usual.

 

[Trembling Hand]

THEN
There is the topic often discussed of cost of education.

It is funny how the cost of the course has little relationship to the quality of the material thou

But correlated to the BS in the marketing.