My Obstacle to Trading Success

[Trembling Hand]

Forget the excuses and the intellectallising and "Make up your mind"

Yeah James stop stuffing around and just make your mind up that this week you will make a heap of $$'s.

LOL always works

 

[James Austin]

Yeah James stop stuffing around and just make your mind up that this week you will make a heap of $$'s.

LOL always works

that was the theme last week, sheer will power!

 

[cuttlefish]

Cuttlefish,

It sounds logical. I have built extensive lists of what works and what doesn’t.

But undiscipline, emotional trading, I suspect is actually a “symptom” not a “cause” in my case. I’ve tried to explain my view on this in post #32 above.

It’s more likely that my temperament is not suited to staring at a screen 10hrs a day, and that’s what I’ve been doing. So I am reducing my screen time significantly; previously when I have done this my results have been consistently profitable, and more importantly I am happier within myself.

Trading is still my passion, but as Frank said above, “Don’t feel you have to be busy to make money.” Less in my case, is probably going to end up being more.

** Trading is far more involved than I imagined when I began. I never realised I need more than a strategy that works and the ability to implement it in real time. I also need to synchronise temperament with instrument, time-frames and style. Aligning all of these takes time.


Frank,

Yes, there is the issue of too much screen time as mentioned, but also the issue of real time skill/ experience. Your system does provide blatantly obvious set-ups and varying degrees of, along the continuum. Sorting these in real time takes experience.

As you say, a range of markets/instruments will give me access to more high probability set-ups, than the SPI alone does; potentially warding off the tendency to try and squeeze more out of the SPI than it has to offer.

Another instrument or market is something to implement when I decide to increase my screen hours, in the future.



Thanks again to All who have contributed.

James - cheers for a very interesting thread. I read your comments about the length of time and the shift into an ADD type of mindset if you prolong the hours - and agree that this would be a very real phenomenom - so minimising the hours or getting away from the screen when you are starting to notice yourself slipping into a gambling mindset makes sense. Still - by implementing something along the lines I've described above it might be possible to both prolong the time that can be spent at a screen (ideally to the extent that it is simply inbuilt into your psychology not to adopt gambling/undisciplined behaviour) and also greatly reduce the risk of making poor decisions in a situation where you are under a lot of pressure.

Clearly using appropriate money management so you are always trading within your comfort zone and within your rules/system help to avoid situations where you feel undue pressure. Now that you are also making sure you trading within your attention span limits you've implemented a lot of factors for avoiding the emotional state of mind that can lead to the undisciplined/gambling like decision making process.

But even with the best planning you can still find yourself in a situation where you are tired and/or under pressure - and in those situations you need to be well versed in avoiding the emotional pitfalls that lead to bad decisions. Something as simple as a technical hiccup like a loss of a connection for a few hours while you have some significant trades going could put you into a state of mind where your emotional control is reduced.

Thus my view is that training your mind to avoid the pitfalls, even when you are tired and under pressure, is something that is possible and worthwhile.

You might even be able to, instead of stopping when you are reaching the 'ADD' state, deliberately trade for one more hour with the single goal of not making any irrational/emotional decisions for one hour - make this the actual focus of your session. You might also try tightening up your trading during this time period - for example selecting prior to this extended practice session some classes of trade from your system that you will specifically not trade even if the entry criteria are met - just to practice restraint. You could even try watching the screen for an hour, two hours and not take a single trade even if it completely matches your system - again just to practice and confirm to yourself that you can exercise this restraint.

 

[James Austin]

Cuttlefish,

no doubt there are ways to increase screen-time without drifting off into ADD mode.

From a lifestyle perspective, 2x 3hr blocks/ day, should be a nice balance for me. So for the moment, increasing screen-time isn’t a goal.

But even with the best planning you can still find yourself in a situation where you are tired and/or under pressure - and in those situations you need to be well versed in avoiding the emotional pitfalls that lead to bad decisions. Something as simple as a technical hiccup like a loss of a connection for a few hours while you have some significant trades going could put you into a state of mind where your emotional control is reduced.

Thus my view is that training your mind to avoid the pitfalls, even when you are tired and under pressure, is something that is possible and worthwhile.

I agree, even the most experienced and skilled will “lose the plot” if mind gets out of control.

For me the relationship is symbiotic; a robust trading strategy will offset “losing the plot”. As will a steady, focused mind maximise a robust strategy’s outcomes.

Personally, I don’t think you can have one without the other (unless the system is computerised/mechanical).

I need a robust strategy and the ability to apply it in real time. But I also need my mind to not be playing tricks.

Reducing screen-time as mentioned will aid that. But when actually trading, the simplest way I know of is simply to pay attention to the “tricks”. Not easy, particularly in the heat of battle.

 

[Cartman]

geez i somehow missed this thread !!! --- brilliant --

this is at the guts of trading and good onya James for bringing this stuff up

Try this :- have enough margin so you can throw more contracts in to defend your losing position as it goes against you.
Place an another when its 9 points against , then hit again at 11 points farther .
\
If it all turns to sh*t get out when it goes 22 or 23 your call , I do it with good results , better then suffering continual stop hits like at 4, 6, 8 ,10 , your pick .
:sheep:

u poor bast@rd Bob ----- u think like i do --- lol ---

You are being undermined by your own ego. You have a winning streak, subconsciously think you're pretty damn good,

sorry Nick --- gotta disagree with u again on this one (becoming a habit) -- nothing to do with James' ego ----- he is simply 'unsure' about his trading plan ----- thats y he keeps deviating from it (join the club James ) ---- I think TH mentioned simming ----- but as he said ----
(i'll paraphrase/elaborate ---- u gotta do it in the same "zone" as the real thing otherwise its a waste of time cause all u r doing is replicating bad habits

Whenever you are tempted to make an emotional trade but don't proceed and do exercise appropriate discipline - go and find that pitfall on your list and put a tick next to it for succesfully avoiding it.

I believe that if you follow this you will very quickly start to develop a new behaviour pattern surrounding these emotional/undisciplined trade pitfalls.

C/F --- as always yr posts are filled with useful stuff ---- people should read yr stuff ---- insightful info only comes from experience --- hope u r trading well


no advice from me James --- other than i know exactly what u r feeling ---- good luck with it ----

 

[acetrader]

Hi James

I do intraday tradings and overcame the same mental barrier about 1y ago. so I think my tips may help you.

First you need a trading plan package. This trading plan package has 2 parts.

1. Your trading rules. This is you own rule book. Write down your entry and exit rules, your money management rules and 5 of your most critical trading sins as warning. This plan is not a book or to showoff to other people. it is for yourself. So it must be simple and concise so you can read everything in one glance (no more than 2 pages). Use those words or pictures when you talk to yourself. print it out and put it beside your keyborad.

2. Your trading journal. This is the records of your dailly transactions. buy/sell price, entry time, stop loss, target, exit price ,exit time. Very simple and concise. Normally you can get those info from your brokers, but i'd like to write myself actually I'm filling in a trading records form on paper. To prevent overtrading (it is one of my trading sins), I only give 8 lines for each day in that records form. If you are lazy enough just write down entry price, stop and target immediately after you place the order.

Secondly, you need to change your objective. I realise that at this stage consistency is not the immediate objective, but following your own rule book is. So forget the profit and loss of each day. If you can follow your own rules today you are a winer today. If you break your own rules you are a loser. Set your target like one winning week then 2 winning weeks then one winning month. Give yourself some rewards when you finish your target each time. Just forget counting the beans. Believe me it won't take too long to find out what is the real cause of inconsistency.

Good Luck!

 

[James Austin]

. . . . but following your own rule book is. So forget the profit and loss of each day. If you can follow your own rules today you are a winer today. If you break your own rules you are a loser.

acetrader

i hear you and am with you
my approach to the market is quite rules based,
rules as central, profit as by-product, focus on the rules not the profit,
yes, i understand

thanks for the input
James