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Labor's carbon tax lie

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why
Ruby said:
Well you must be the only person who knows this...... even the government is confused! Everyone in government - from Gillard down - refers to it as a carbon tax!
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They have been backed into a corner by Scaremonger Co.


wayneL said:
Just like a levy is not a tax?
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Levy is a sort of tax; an emissions trading scheme is hardly that.

Julia said:
For god's sake, you're really pushing your luck here. The government itself introduced it as a tax.
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Is this a joke?



For all the economically illiterate here (not to offend, but clearly quite a few people fall into this category), a simple explanation;
http://macrobusiness.com.au/2011/07/why-gillard-has-a-mandate/
 
Ruby said:
I think you will agree he has the right credentials!
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One way they cheat is in the way they measure temperature.
The official thermometers are often located in the warm exhaust of air conditioning outlets, over hot tarmac at airports where they get blasts of hot air from jet engines, at wastewater plants where they get warmth from decomposing sewage, or in hot cities choked with cars and buildings.

This is from Dr Evans's anti tax diatribe. Highly rated by others in this thread too. It obviously explains to me the satellite evidence of the progressively early onset spring conditions across the entire northern hemisphere, Oh also the rise in global ocean temperature. Any thinking regards rising ocean acidification Ahhh I just stop thinking.
Seems to be a bit more than just warmth from the sewarge.
If Lord 'Monky python' was any more Dada-esque He'd have a BBC series to his name. If you ever want to follow his gibberish to logical conclusion try this

http://www.crikey.com.au/2011/07/20/denniss-my-tactics-for-debating-monckton/
 
drsmith said:
Michael Pascoe needs to take a closer look at how British Columbia generates most of its electricity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Canada#Generation

It's very different to Australia.
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Yes, I agree Drsmith. I can't see how Pascoe can possibly compare BC (and even NZ) with Australia. Both BC and NZ have hydro schemes and we don't.

I listened to some of Four Corners tonight where some people living close to windmill farms are complaining of health problems - presumably from the noise causing sleep deprevation which in turns causes other problems.

Trying to replace our coal fired power stations with wind and solar power seems pretty risky. And I think we should not be shutting down power stations and taxing the hell out of people without properly developed and tested alternatives.

But, sadly, that doesn't seem to be how this government works. It's a case of jumping in the deep end and then deciding if we can swim without life jackets. Foolhardy imo.
 

Its a tax.
You can argue round it as being a permit, but it still ends up being a tax. That blog is hardly relevant after the PM called it a tax

tax
–noun
1.
a sum of money demanded by a government for its support or for specific facilities or services, levied upon incomes, property, sales, etc.
2.
a burdensome charge, obligation, duty, or demand.
 

Why is it when the Labor Party don't like criticisim of their stupid policies they accuse the Opposition of SCAREMONGERING.

Doesn't the Labor Party use scaremongering tactics to push their own barrow on carbon (dioxide) tax?

a) the Great Barrier will die if we don't have a carbon tax.

b) the sea will rise 1 meter or is it 10 metres if we don't have a carbon tax.

c) we will have more droughts and run out of water if we don't have a carbon tax.

d) we will have more floods if we don't have a carbon tax.

e) we will have worse cyclones if we don't have a carbon tax.

Yes, we will all be better off if we have a carbon tax.

DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT SCAREMONGERING COMRADE, YOUR FAVOURED GREEN/LABOR LEFT WING SOCIALIST GOVERNMENT IS A PAST MASTER AT IT.
 
noco said:
....DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT SCAREMONGERING COMRADE, YOUR FAVOURED GREEN/LABOR LEFT WING SOCIALIST GOVERNMENT IS A PAST MASTER AT IT.
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Careful Noco, Christine Milne will have you enquired into and 'regulated'.
 
Vaclav Klaus (head of state and an economist) was good at the National Press Club Address today. Adapt don't mitigate, he says.

He exploded Labor's claim that not one economist agrees with the Coalition's direct action policy. Klaus said that direct action is at least tangible and visible, in contrast to complex economic models (which as a former economic modeler himself, he places little credence in) and artificial interference with the operation of markets via carbon tax and ETS.

Klaus said he grew up under a communist regime, and thinks the real threat is not from the climate, but to our personal freedoms.

The ABC usually replays the program late at night.
 
Some interesting information from The Australian.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...arket-post-kyoto/story-e6frgd0x-1226101594677

According to the World Bank's recently released 2011 State and Trends of the Carbon Market report, for the first time since 2005 the international carbon market went into recession last year.

The cause of its decline was the lack of clarity "urgently needed on the post-2012 international climate change regime and on other countries' plans to use market-based mechanisms to meet domestic greenhouse gas [reduction] objectives".

While Australia goes headfirst to introduce a market-based scheme, other countries aren't following our lead: Japan and South Korea have effectively shelved their trading schemes until a post-Kyoto framework is established; New Zealand is watering down its scheme; participant states in regional US emissions trading schemes are withdrawing; and China has flagged the possibility of trialling a scheme, but to date its carbon pricing experience has been to profit, having secured 42 per cent of Europe's offshore emissions reduction projects.

Even in Europe, with its operational emissions trading scheme, its "year-on-year declines in greenhouse gas emissions . . . now appear to be over", with emissions on the rise again after recent dips in its floating carbon price.

Instead of pursuing their plan, Gillard and Climate Change Minister Greg Combet should be listening to the advice being sent by carbon markets, especially when the market and its message is put into context.

There is no global carbon market. There is only a European one.
 
I suppose a licence to blog (presumably from the Ministry of Truth) will follow soon after. You think I'm joking don't you.

 
Logique said:
I suppose a licence to blog (presumably from the Ministry of Truth) will follow soon after. You think I'm joking don't you.
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What an awesome way for Greens supporters to control everything. Simply change policy so the only ones that would want to control it are in line with the governments BS
 

Just when you think the Greens cannot get any more nutty, they do. Would the government really go for the Greens' agenda to this extent? Just incredible, if they do, presumably on the coattails of the present outrage against the British arm of Newscorp.
 
Remember the Chaser CNNNNN show

We report - you believe!
 
moXJO said:
Its a tax.
You can argue round it as being a permit, but it still ends up being a tax. That blog is hardly relevant after the PM called it a tax
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So basically you will ignore all logic and reason and economic fact to suit your own agenda?

noco said:
Why is it when the Labor Party don't like criticisim of their stupid policies they accuse the Opposition of SCAREMONGERING.
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The two are unrelated; the opposition is scaremongering

noco said:
Doesn't the Labor Party use scaremongering tactics to push their own barrow on carbon (dioxide) tax?
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Except all of those things are scientifically proven facts, and ALP has nothing to do with them, except trying to prevent them from happening - arguably a good thing.



I also find it funny how several members have posted links to News Ltd. I'm just curious, is News Ltd actually regarded as reputable on this forum?
 
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