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Israel in the Gaza Strip

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Saturday 27 December 2008: That date will now go down in history as one of the bloodiest in the sixty year conflict between Israel and the Palestinians as Israel launches airstrikes into the Gaza Strip killing some 225 people, mostly civilians. Don't mean the understate the point, but do you think this has gone far enough?

Having lived in the UK twice in the past few years, I can say that the British media are not cheerleaders of Israel as are the Americans and even the Australian media.

Both Jews and the secular Israeli's are now seriously questioning the terrorism perpetuated by the state of Israel, and beginning to name it for what it is. Jews seem to be fairly well taboo to criticise - but how about enough is enough on this one? Stories of border crossings? Cutting water, electricity, services, roads and medical supplies to Palestinians on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip over such a long period of time?

Of course, Hamas, perhaps the Mid Easts ONLY properly democratically elected government, is being painted as the bogey man: Here is Gordon Brown last night "I understand the Israeli government's sense of obligation to its population. Israel needs to meet its humanitarian obligations, act in a way to further the long-term vision of a two-state solution, and do everything in its power to avoid civilian casualties."

No sympathy for the KIDS and CIVILIANS killed.

The American response ' "[America] urges Israel to avoid civilian casualties as it targets Hamas in Gaza... " Again, no condemnation of the murdering of kids and civilians.

Time to dust of my copy of Edward Said's Orientalism again I think. The human Palestinian face will not be shown on the news tonight - except for a decontextualised wailing which further seeks to 'Other' this suffering group of people.

By the way, I would bet my balls in the 225 dead that very very few were Hamas operatives.

I guess those crazy Israeli military generals will consider the whole exercise close enough for jazz, while their American backers stand back. Silent.

Brad
 
I have met many Israelis and many Palestinians in my time, and much prefer the Israelis.

The Palestinians are a dreadfully tribal people, riven by petty hatred for the outside world and for other Palestinians. Israelis make good friends and loyalty is their strong point.

That is just my experience of them both.

The Israelis can be tiresome at times but need a land to call their own, I would support them against the Arab collective which surrounds them.

gg
 
This is some thing we have to get use to it will only stop once religion is banned.
Its been going on for thousands of years and will continue to do so long after we have passed on.
 
Saturday 27 December 2008: That date will now go down in history as one of the bloodiest in the sixty year conflict between Israel and the Palestinians as Israel launches airstrikes into the Gaza Strip killing some 225 people, mostly civilians. Don't mean the understate the point, but do you think this has gone far enough?

Having lived in the UK twice in the past few years, I can say that the British media are not cheerleaders of Israel as are the Americans and even the Australian media.

Both Jews and the secular Israeli's are now seriously questioning the terrorism perpetuated by the state of Israel, and beginning to name it for what it is. Jews seem to be fairly well taboo to criticise - but how about enough is enough on this one? Stories of border crossings? Cutting water, electricity, services, roads and medical supplies to Palestinians on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip over such a long period of time?

Of course, Hamas, perhaps the Mid Easts ONLY properly democratically elected government, is being painted as the bogey man: Here is Gordon Brown last night "I understand the Israeli government's sense of obligation to its population. Israel needs to meet its humanitarian obligations, act in a way to further the long-term vision of a two-state solution, and do everything in its power to avoid civilian casualties."

No sympathy for the KIDS and CIVILIANS killed.

The American response ' "[America] urges Israel to avoid civilian casualties as it targets Hamas in Gaza... " Again, no condemnation of the murdering of kids and civilians.

Time to dust of my copy of Edward Said's Orientalism again I think. The human Palestinian face will not be shown on the news tonight - except for a decontextualised wailing which further seeks to 'Other' this suffering group of people.

By the way, I would bet my balls in the 225 dead that very very few were Hamas operatives.

I guess those crazy Israeli military generals will consider the whole exercise close enough for jazz, while their American backers stand back. Silent.

Brad
The British have problems of their own.
http://www.melaniephillips.com/diary/?p=1688
Conservative Muslim Forum, a body set up by David Cameron to advise the Conservatives on Muslim issues and which is headed by Lord Sheikh, has condemned the government’s support for Israel on the grounds that this displeases Muslims and says that Iran has ‘legitimate’ reasons for wanting nuclear weapons. It also argues that preachers who advocate a rejection of democracy and its institutions should not be denied entry into Britain.
So lets be careful on the anti Israel propaganda.

Hamas is an Islamist movement that is quite unlike Fatah. They make Fatah look like picnic taking Jesus loving boys with skipping ropes.

Israel is threatened by Islamists and the only defence at times is offence.
 
The British have problems of their own.
http://www.melaniephillips.com/diary/?p=1688

So lets be careful on the anti Israel propaganda.

Hamas is an Islamist movement that is quite unlike Fatah. They make Fatah look like picnic taking Jesus loving boys with skipping ropes.

Israel is threatened by Islamists and the only defence at times is offence.

Agree with these sentiments Snake, though probably wouldn't be game to state them as forcibly as you have.

gg
 
Let's ask Voltaire...

Arabs
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/v/voltaire/dictionary/chapter44.html

Jews
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/v/voltaire/dictionary/chapter288.html

I posted the above mostly as a didactic larf, don't take it seriously, please. DYOR. Really got no comment on Israel vs Palestine...it just makes me sigh...and I'm Iranian.

Isn't it obvious to everyone by now that this has nothing to do with a line in the sand, them and us, who started it, I mean ****, it's so clearly about geopolitical power plays based on religious fundamentalism/extremism ideals.

Condoleeza Rice was in shipping so many AK-47s to Fatah (for use against Hamas) that they measured it in raw tonnage!

Iran funds Hisbullah, Hamas is mostly grassroots at least, plenty of Jordanian and Saudi money floating in the area too.
 
Let's ask Voltaire...

Arabs
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/v/voltaire/dictionary/chapter44.html

Jews
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/v/voltaire/dictionary/chapter288.html

I posted the above mostly as a didactic larf, don't take it seriously, please. DYOR. Really got no comment on Israel vs Palestine...it just makes me sigh...and I'm Iranian.

Isn't it obvious to everyone by now that this has nothing to do with a line in the sand, them and us, who started it, I mean ****, it's so clearly about geopolitical power plays based on religious fundamentalism/extremism ideals.

Condoleeza Rice was in shipping so many AK-47s to Fatah (for use against Hamas) that they measured it in raw tonnage!

Iran funds Hisbullah, Hamas is mostly grassroots at least, plenty of Jordanian and Saudi money floating in the area too.

Good points there sinner.

The role of Fatah is more important than the role the of Hamas. For two reasons: freedoms in the Gaza will be better under them and they are not increasing the Wahabi's influence.

Thanks for the links.
 
Good points there sinner.

The role of Fatah is more important than the role the of Hamas. For two reasons: freedoms in the Gaza will be better under them and they are not increasing the Wahabi's influence.

Thanks for the links.

Sorry to disagree mate, they are all a pack of tinkers, untrustworthy and double dealers. That is my experience

gg
 
increasing the Wahabi's influence.

Thanks for the links.

You mean like how the neo-con crew in the US (Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bush, Gates, etc etc) is enriching the Wahhab majority populace and government in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and UAE? Which funds Hamas?

O wait...power play again...

The neo-cons and you are dumb (sorry) enough to believe Fatah won't bite them in the ass like the extremist groups and sham govts they instigated and supported in Iran, Iraq and Afghanistan have done in the last 50 odd years.
 
Agree with these sentiments Snake, though probably wouldn't be game to state them as forcibly as you have.

gg
Hardly forcibly GG.
Ok so fatah aren't picnic taking skipping rope boys. But they are a better bunch when it comes to freedoms for their people. You only have to refer back to when the Gaza was taken over by hamas. We are talking politics here as they are political groups but one more verile than the other.
 
You mean like how the neo-con crew in the US (Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bush, Gates, etc etc) is enriching the Wahhab majority populace and government in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and UAE? Which funds Hamas?

O wait...power play again...

The neo-cons and you are dumb (sorry) enough to believe Fatah won't bite them in the ass like the extremist groups and sham govts they instigated and supported in Iran, Iraq and Afghanistan have done in the last 50 odd years.
I am talking about freedoms. Not morals. Freedoms are better under Fatah than Hamas as has been shown.

Forget the neo con propaganda.
 
This is some thing we have to get use to it will only stop once religion is banned. Its been going on for thousands of years and will continue to do so long after we have passed on.

Good point Glen. You'd certainly never find any massacres, brutality, inhumanity on a grand scale in non-religious regimes or atheistic regimes like Stalin's Russia, Mao's China, Pol-Pot's Vietnam etc.
 
Good point Glen. You'd certainly never find any massacres, brutality, inhumanity on a grand scale in non-religious regimes or atheistic regimes like Stalin's Russia, Mao's China, Pol-Pot's Vietnam etc.
Good points there refined silver.
Pol pot was in Cambodia.
Mao had millions of people killed. So much for the commos.
 
The sooner Israel is gone, the sooner the rest of the world can get on with more pressing issues.
 
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