House prices to keep rising for years

[wayneL]

yeah Wayne....I do not sound a trumpet, its only been mentioned a couple of times, to put my case into the correct context...and only after others accuse me of being greedy or having an alternative reason.....

anyway, why attack the poster...when the forum is for debating the subects and voicing a view on the subject in question ????

You consider that an attack? You ain't seen nuttin' LOL

If I was going to attack you I would start on your appalling sentence structure and diabolical punctuation, while really going to town on the monumental hypocrisy. But I haven't gone there have I.

I am in fact merely debating points raised by YOU.

 

[cutz]

Contrary to what i used to believe i don't think the property boom will end, governments don't have the courage to put an end to the propping up and the routs nor is it in their best interests.

A collapse in values would be a detriment to the economy with so many relying on their homes as a source of collateral for non productive proposes, you gotta ask yourself how the the BMW tractor has become the new Commodore.

I feel sorry for the gen Y's who are destined to be straddled with a lifetime of bad debt breaking in to the national ponzi scheme.

Go figure, when i purchased my home in inner city Melbourne back in the latter part of the nineties i paid around 5 times the average wage of the day, now similar properties are going for 11 times or more todays average wage depending on the emotions running at auction, what the hell is going on, something doesn't quite add up.

Anyway enough ranting for now, good luck to you property gurus, hopefully one day a bit of normality will be restored.

BTW, kincella post up one of your charts so we can check it out.

 

[wayneL]

My post was 100% on the money as we can see by your oh so defensive response. I dont give a rats how hard you worked, those who revell in a residential property boom are a-holes in my opinion, it locks the young out or forces them to take crushing mortgages.
I'd be quite happy if my residential ptoprties halved in price tomorrow.
Less rates and the kids would be able to get in.

Those who call it paradise are selfish morons.

I'm sort of on the same page Burnsie. We've got a couple of piles in SW England pretty close to being paid off. The actual value is academic as I don't ever envisage selling. Technically I've dropped about £100k or more from the 2007 between them. Who cares? It's the long term inflation hedged income that interests me.

The bubblicious values made the capitalist in me happy, but at the same time knew it was illusory. I also don't like the overall sociological effect of house price overvaluation. It's not the society I want to live in.

 

[MrBurns]

. I also don't like the overall sociological effect of house price overvaluation. It's not the society I want to live in.

Correct, not too many people think of that.

Commercial and industrial property is different, let those dogs eat each other, and they do, been there done that, but residential property is prmarily a place to live, and that should be affordable.

 

[wayneL]

Contrary to what i used to believe i don't think the property boom will end, governments don't have the courage to put an end to the propping up and the routs nor is it in their best interests.

And it will be disaster for their generation... the boomers (as it has been already for many boomers in US and UK).

The whole structural premise of the economy currently is predicated on house price growth.

The Keynesians believe they've saved the day. Most Austrians aren't convinced. I'm on the fence for now, but 100% sure that we will revisit this problem at some point in the future. When? No idea.

We live in interesting times.

 

[BradK]

Furthermore booming property prices dont help anyone except the greedy fat bastards who trade in those conditions at the expense of the young.

I've seen it I was a real estate agent for 20 years remember.

Those greedy selfish pigs more often than not go bust then raid mum and dads equity to do it all over again.

I despise them with a passion.

Share trading hurts no one, residential property booms hurt people and those who revell in it are vultures in my opinion.

Instead of sitting on your worthless backside waiting for a boom to make money for you why dont you just work like everyone else.

This is the angriest post I have ever seen! But, funnily enough, I agree with most of it. I bought properties in Sydney and Perth and did really well. Went to England and European holidays on the profit with my family. And paid off a chunk of my mortgage.

However, I came to similar conclusions. Property bubbles will eventually hurt EVERYONE.

Sorry to sound all socialist on you - but, isn't owning a house a right that we have given up?

Brad

 

[BradK]

The bubblicious values made the capitalist in me happy, but at the same time knew it was illusory. I also don't like the overall sociological effect of house price overvaluation. It's not the society I want to live in.

Here here. And this is coming from someone who did VERY well out of property in 2000-2003 thank you very much! The blindness of some of these selfish ba$tards is astonishing.

Brad

 

[robots]

And it will be disaster for their generation... the boomers (as it has been already for many boomers in US and UK).

The whole structural premise of the economy currently is predicated on house price growth.

The Keynesians believe they've saved the day. Most Austrians aren't convinced. I'm on the fence for now, but 100% sure that we will revisit this problem at some point in the future. When? No idea.

We live in interesting times.

hello,

is that the same problem that happened last year? which smashed resi property values by a whopping 5%

the biggest financial disaster since 1929, smashed resi property by 5%

the society we live in is fine for those who want to put in, the bludgers, hand out crew, slackers can get stu$$ed

technically, i have picked up those $ figures and it is awesome, equity mate

thankyou
professor robots

 

[Beej]

My post was 100% on the money as we can see by your oh so defensive response. I dont give a rats how hard you worked, those who revell in a residential property boom are a-holes in my opinion, it locks the young out or forces them to take crushing mortgages.
I'd be quite happy if my residential properties halved in price tomorrow.
Less rates and the kids would be able to get in.

Those who call it paradise are selfish morons.

Why do you own multiple properties then?

PS: You could always sell your extra properties to some young-uns for half their correct market value if you really cared.....

Sorry to sound all socialist on you - but, isn't owning a house a right that we have given up?

Since when, anywhere, and especially in Australia, has land/property ownership been a RIGHT??

Cheers,

Beej

 

[BradK]

There is a difference between paying off properties (or even buying them with capital) and relying on the RENTAL INCOME as an inflation hedging income until kingdom come, and using Other People's Money to leverage up to the neck and wait until CAPITAL GAINS and BOOMS skyrocket the price of the atmosphere and cash in on someone OVERPAYING for a house.

So frustrating that property bulls can't see that!

Property bulls MUST BE THE DUMBEST individuals I have seen.

Talk about twisted logic from every angle!

Someone shoot me!

Brad

 

[BradK]

Since when, anywhere, and especially in Australia, has land/property ownership been a RIGHT??

Well, ownership hasn't been a right, but having a roof free from exploitation must surely qualify.

This thread makes me so frustrated.

Im off it! hahahaah

Brad

 

[wayneL]

hello,

is that the same problem that happened last year? which smashed resi property values by a whopping 5%

the biggest financial disaster since 1929, smashed resi property by 5%

the society we live in is fine for those who want to put in, the bludgers, hand out crew, slackers can get stu$$ed

technically, i have picked up those $ figures and it is awesome, equity mate

thankyou
professor robots

Can't speak for Oz cause I'm not there. But UK got swatted about 20% on average. America worse.

I suspect WA copped more than 5%, but again don't know for sure. Don't really care, don't have any financial interest.

The Australian gu'mint is directly supporting the house market however. Your taxes are supporting housing. Young couples struggling to save a deposit and facing massive mortgages are paying taxes to make it harder for themselves to buy.

It's another form of middle class welfare. You're actually on the take equity-mate, either directly or indirectly. That's morally hazardous in my opinion.


The self-centred may be happy about that, the more community minded not so much.

 

[robots]

hello,

thanks for everyone's opinions today, great posting as usual at ASF

such a cross section of the community, fantastic

thankyou
professor robots

 

[wayneL]

Since when, anywhere, and especially in Australia, has land/property ownership been a RIGHT??

Cheers,

Beej

Housing is a basic need, like food.

If food rises and becomes too expensive it is considered very bad, but if housing does that, a different logic is applied. Funny that.

Premium housing is a different matter, but basic suburban housing has become expensive for no other reason than speculation fuelled by loose money. That cannot be a good thing for a society.

 

[Glen48]

If inflation is to push up house prices and they only go up on average by the cost of construction, how much is house in Mug Arbie's country were inflation is 1,000,000,000, % and if inflation gets that high here why not own Gold in stead?
How much longer can the you pay for propping up our housing and hoping some un-employed homeless migrant will keep buying ?

 

[MrBurns]

Why do you own multiple properties then?

PS: You could always sell your extra properties to some young-uns for half their correct market value if you really cared.....

Since when, anywhere, and especially in Australia, has land/property ownership been a RIGHT??
Cheers,

Beej

My sister lives in one and the ex Mrs Burns in the other, both rent free, non of them give me any income. A concept foreign to some in here.

To own your own home in Australia is something everyone should be able to achieve, to make residential property a great investment through tax breaks is wrong, it should be limited the commercial property where the greedy element belong, not wading in and stuffing it up for our kids.

 

[MrBurns]

Well, ownership hasn't been a right, but having a roof free from exploitation must surely qualify.
Brad

Yes , agree, that sums it up quite well.

 

[robots]

My sister lives in one and the ex Mrs Burns in the other, both rent free, non of them give me any income. A concept foreign to some in here.

To own your own home in Australia is something everyone should be able to achieve, to make residential property a great investment through tax breaks is wrong, it should be limited the commercial property where the greedy element belong, not wading in and stuffing it up for our kids.

hello,

handing out the capital growth as well Mr Burns, or keep that HUGE bit for yourself?

its all about the capital

thankyou
professor robots

 

[MrBurns]

hello,

handing out the capital growth as well Mr Burns, or keep that HUGE bit for yourself?

its all about the capital

thankyou
professor robots

I dont give a root about the capital growth, this is housing people, unselfish, you know what unselfish means Robots ???? Look it up, you could do with a good dose of it.

Capital growth means nothing if every other house in the street has gone up as well, you havent woken up to that have you ?

I bet you get a kick out of watching young people walk away from Auctions broken hearted.

 

[Beej]

Housing is a basic need, like food.

If food rises and becomes too expensive it is considered very bad, but if housing does that, a different logic is applied. Funny that.

But people (including yourself) seem to be getting this idea mixed up with the idea of land/property ownership. Shelter/housing can be provided without every individual owning property. Last time I checked there aren't any western countries with communist dictators, so I don't think that is going to be changing anytime soon in Australia, UK, US etc.

The provision of shelter for all is a government policy issue. Governments may provide housing directly (publically owned), they may subsidise the private sector to provide it (negative grearing PIs), or they may regulate/control rents etc with no compensation (eg New York City historical rent controls - complete disaster, but can happen). They may put policies/schemes in place to *encourage* people to own their own homes (FHBG, stamp duty exemption for FHBs in NSW etc). They may as a matter of policy release greater amounts of land on the city fringes and sell them or service them at below market value/cost, or they might encourage industry (jobs) to move to regional towns etc to take the pressure of the big cities.

All of these things play a part in ensuring that everyone in our society has "shelter", but none of them imply any sort of right to land ownership.

Premium housing is a different matter, but basic suburban housing has become expensive for no other reason than speculation fuelled by loose money. That cannot be a good thing for a society.

So where is the line drawn?? Besides, in Sydney and most of Australia "basic" suburban housing is actually not that expensive (as has been demonstrated here numerous times by myself, Kincella and others). 3 bedroom houses on reasonable size blocks all over western and south-western Sydney can be had for < $300k easily = 3-4 times a very average household income. It's only when you start getting closer to the CBDs etc that prices start to get higher, and even there 2 bedroom units can be had from $400k up. It's all about trade-offs, compromise, supply/demand, and having a long term plan.

Life wasn't meant to be easy.....

Cheers,

Beej