Home Insulation Debacle

[roland]

Garrett attacked over insulation no-show
February 15, 2010 - 7:19PM

AAP

Federal Environment Minister Peter Garrett has been accused of living in a "different moral universe" for failing to attend a meeting on the safety of roof insulation.

source: http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-new...ked-over-insulation-noshow-20100215-nzq1.html

Garrett fiddles while Rome burns...

Not a good look for Peter to be off counting reptiles in State Forests and missing meetings on the insulation issue ... "What was he thinking"????

 

[Julia]

Incredibly stupid of him at such a sensitive time.
Likewise his defensive stance over this whole mess when he should have been falling over with sympathy for the families of the dead young people.

 

[Smurf1976]

HWS being stolen isn't that uncommon. Generally speaking, they're stolen for use as a working HWS or, in the case of low pressure types, for the copper they contain.

The mild steel "glass" lined tank in a mains pressure HWS and the surrounding insulation isn't particularly valuable as scrap. It's just mild steel and that's not really valuable. It's only the copper tanks that have any real scrap value in terms of $. Stainless steel tanks do exist but are not at all common - not sure what they're worth as scrap.

Worth noting that it was 20+ years ago that Rheem (which has a pretty large market share in the manufacture of water heaters) changed to using foam insulation in their water heaters and that is virtually impossible to recover for any useful purpose. Not sure when other manufacturers introduced it, but they all use foam these days.

 

[Trembling Hand]

Insulation scheme a gross waste of money

http://www.theage.com.au/national/i...aste-of-money-inquiry-told-20100217-ocfh.html

A Senate inquiry has been told of an alleged "gross waste" of taxpayer dollars with ineffective insulation used in up to 400,000 properties under the national home insulation program.

About one million homes have taken advantage of the federal government's program in the past 10 months.

But a study of the insulation being used shows that 30 to 40 per cent is non-compliant, Tino Zuzul, an industry leader, told the Energy Efficient Home Packages Inquiry in Melbourne today.

 

[Julia]

Does anyone know if Senate enquiries are televised or transcripts made available on the web?
This one should be pretty interesting.

I should have done some enquiring before posting the above. Have now discovered the Enquiry is not being broadcast. A helpful staffer says a transcript will be available probably early next week.
For anyone interested, here is where it can be accessed when completed.

http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/committee/eca_ctte/eehp/hearings/index.htm

 

[GumbyLearner]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...-halt-to-rollout/story-e6frg6n6-1225831571025

 

[matty77]

News of the warnings came as Kevin Rudd stonewalled in the face of media questions about why he pumped so much stimulus money into the sector if he knew it was not properly regulated.

The Prime Minister simply refused to answer the question. He also ignored a question from The Australian about whether the Department of Environment made similar warnings early last year, when cabinet was hammering out the details of the scheme

he is an arrogant prick isnt he??

Heard on the grape vine that a company had employed kids to help install the insulation, not sure how true that is though?

 

[noco]

Does anyone know if Senate enquiries are televised or transcripts made available on the web?
This one should be pretty interesting.

I should have done some enquiring before posting the above. Have now discovered the Enquiry is not being broadcast. A helpful staffer says a transcript will be available probably early next week.
For anyone interested, here is where it can be accessed when completed.

http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/committee/eca_ctte/eehp/hearings/index.htm

Julia, I have watched it quite regularly on Austar 648. Some times it is repeated later. I recently watched Senator Joyce grill David Parker from treasury and Senator Cherry on the leaks from the Henry Tax Review which the Labor Party are refusing to release for reasons known only to the Labor Party. I thought BJ was on the ball, but the answers BJ kept getting was like "maybe, could be, purely hyperthetical, purely supposition etc,etc. Typical of Labor Party answers.

 

[Calliope]

Hardly a week passes that Rudd does not put on his sorrowing face and claim that his "thoughts and prayers go out to the loved ones'' of someone who has died in a tragic accident.

But not a sorrowful word has passed his lips on the deaths of the four young men killed in the roofing insulation balls-up.

As for Rudd, he speaks about the program in his trademark cold bureaucratese. Nowhere, from either politician, has there been a public hint of sorrow for the tragedy of four hard-grafting young men dead. Instead, they use language to obfuscate and cloud their motives, which in this case is to evade blame - political, legal or moral - for a program ill-conceived and implemented too hastily, without adequate ministerial supervision and with little thought given to outcomes or safety.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...ant-hide-an-empty-morality-20100217-odtm.html

 

[Julia]

I don't think the lack of compassion will have been unobserved by the voting public, Calliope.

I couldn't help imagining the scene in Rudd's or Garrett's office when the news of the deaths came in. There wouldn't have been a millisecond of sadness for the young life lost, but rather much cursing about what a bad look it was for the insulation programme.

However, to be fair, the installers surely have to bear some responsibility for not turning the mains power off before doing the installation. It's not unreasonable for Garrett to assume such a simple precaution would have been taken.

 

[moXJO]

However, to be fair, the installers surely have to bear some responsibility for not turning the mains power off before doing the installation. It's not unreasonable for Garrett to assume such a simple precaution would have been taken.

First time installers need a lot of supervision or training. The majority of young blokes I put on have to be told consistently through the day of what not to do. If it's dangerous and they don't know the risks, then you can guarantee they will stumble over it without constant warning. Turning of the power would not have occurred to a good % of people. And the roof still would have been live.

 

[Calliope]

At least the home insulation debacle has put the spotlight fairly and squarely on the incapacity of Commonwealth bureaucrats to administer any national program, whether it be renewable energy, water conservation, aboriginal housing or just wisely spending taxpayers' money without most of it disappearing in administrative waste and graft.

God help us if the Commonwealth ever takes over the hospitals, as Rudd keeps threatening.

 

[Trembling Hand]

At least the home insulation debacle has put the spotlight fairly and squarely on the incapacity of Commonwealth bureaucrats to administer any national program,

God help us if the Commonwealth ever takes over the hospitals, as Rudd keeps threatening.

Or a 50 bil technology infrastructure project without a business case run by Labor cronies - NBN.

Scary!!

 

[Trembling Hand]

They have pulled the plug on the game. But they are rolling out mark II.

A new household Renewable Energy Bonus scheme
A new household Renewable Energy Bonus Scheme will assist households save money on power bills and reduce their carbon emissions.

This new Scheme will replace the Home Insulation Program and the Solar Hot Water Rebate Program both of which have been discontinued as of close of business today.

The Government’s focus is on the safety of households and tradespeople who will both benefit from the operation of this new scheme.

Under the household Renewable Energy Bonus scheme households will be able to receive a rebate for the installation of ceiling insulation or a solar hot water system or a heat pump.

$1000 rebates will be available for ceiling installation and solar hot water systems and $600 rebates for heat pumps systems.

The new rebate for solar hot water systems and heat pumps will be available for systems installed after today.

This scheme will institute several key changes to the delivery of ceiling insulation including:

Householders – rather than installers - will claim the $1000 rebate directly through the Medicare system.
Introducing a new registration scheme requiring all installers to reregister, pay a cash bond, show evidence of meeting the training and skills requirements and provide certified quality assurance and occupational health and safety plans.
Introducing a strengthened compliance regime in concert with State and Territory occupational health and safety and fair trading authorities.
It is intended that the insulation component of the Renewable Energy Bonus scheme will come into operation by 1 June.

http://www.environment.gov.au/minister/garrett/2010/mr20100219.html

 

[satanoperca]

So they screwed up the first time, so they stop the program, dress it up under a new name and go again.

How about if pollies are incompetent they loose their pension privileges.

Seems the people of this country are happy with them consistently wasting taxpayers dollars.

Go Labor, you are great at wasting money that is not yours.

Sorry for the rant but just read the thread and are a little cheezed off at how this has come about.

Cheers & Everyone except those who voted for these fools have a good weekend.

Long live indebtedness.

 

[awg]

I am in agreement this orgy of spending is disturbingly wasteful.

Just in my own case, after getting a heat exchange hot water system, 6 months later, I still hadnt recieved a segment of the rebate,($1000) so after several calls, they decided they had lost my claim..I had to resubmit evrything in triplicate etc..fortunately, I was prepared prior and had all the docs ready in case some klutz lost them, so they sent me a cheque

Today I got a duplicate cheque, from the original 9 month ago claim.
The envelope had been handwritten and resealed with sticky tape.
Every person I spoke to was an Irish backpacker

I have decided to deposit the cheque into my CMT, and wait and see if they ask for it back, hoping they continue this slackness..(a high R/R position)

I am dismayed at the NBN, and the distorting effect it is having in telco

As to insulation, waste is obvious in many areas, everyone wants to stick there snouts into the public trough before it runs dry.

And of course its you and me must eventually pay, cause there aint no-one else

 

[Julia]

It's difficult to see how Garrett can hold his job now, with the admission of total failure in the sudden shut down of the scheme.

His ad nauseam repetition that he did everything he possibly could to ensure total safety sounded very hollow on "PM" this evening in light of his refusal to tell the interviewer how long he had held the audit result from (I think) Minter Ellison advising of massive problems and dangers in the rapid roll out of the scheme. The interviewer said the Opposition had alleged that he had received it six months ago.

And now he will be the target - and rightly so - of all the perfectly decent small insulation businesses who have been working ethically, as demand completely dries up between now and June. Obviously they will have to lay off staff, and will have considerable stockpiles of material in hand which will now have to be paid for but which will sit in the warehouse.

What a total ***** stuffup by Garrett.

The only positive out of this will be the amusement offered by next week in parliament as the Opposition milk this gift horse for all it's worth.

 

[Macquack]

And now he will be the target - and rightly so - of all the perfectly decent small insulation businesses who have been working ethically, as demand completely dries up between now and June. Obviously they will have to lay off staff, and will have considerable stockpiles of material in hand which will now have to be paid for but which will sit in the warehouse.

No compassion here for insulation companies, particularly the massive number of "fly by night" companies that have sprung up overnight. I am a building contractor and I am the mug compared to these cowboy insulation installers who are making filthy money for just literally "throwing" insulation into a ceiling space. The sooner they totally can this scheme the better.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Law firm warned Garrett about dangers of insulation program
The Australian February 20, 2010
by Nicola Berkovic

DAMNING legal advice to Peter Garrett's department last April warned that the government's $2.45 billion insulation program could lead to house fires and fraud.

The advice was released yesterday, as the embattled Environment Minister finally axed the program -- which has been linked to four deaths and 87 house fires -- declaring that the safety risks had become unmanageable.

The advice from top-tier law firm Minter Ellison outlined strategies to tackle serious risks in the program. It warned that the government's timeline was too tight for the program to be delivered in a "properly controlled way" and said the Environment Department was ill-equipped to roll out such a massive program.

Oh well, the ALP will still probably romp home while the non-cognitive Minister
doesn't acknowledge that he has made a major and deadly blunder here.

The cognitive elites in the PM's team do know I suspect.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Does anyone on ASF know what percentage of the pink batts were imported from the USA?