Help with trade gone wrong!

[Timmy]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Jono - can you give us some good news?

 

[jonojpsg]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Jono - can you give us some good news?

Well, as I kind of expected, the move down ( at one stage 600+ pts) was overdone and the CFD closed for the weekend at 20054, which is still way down on my buy in, but less worry, distress and disgust to think about over the weekend now

I have learnt though - always stick to my stop loss, avoid trading low probability setups, and never trade sensitive trades when I can't watch eveything as it happens.

Thanks again TH, Timmy, Wys for your input

Now, just to show that I can't help myself, my prediction for the HSI Monday is a 200+ pt jump...my bad

 

[jonojpsg]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Well, as I kind of expected, the move down ( at one stage 600+ pts) was overdone and the CFD closed for the weekend at 20054, which is still way down on my buy in, but less worry, distress and disgust to think about over the weekend now

I have learnt though - always stick to my stop loss, avoid trading low probability setups, and never trade sensitive trades when I can't watch eveything as it happens.

Thanks again TH, Timmy, Wys for your input

Now, just to show that I can't help myself, my prediction for the HSI Monday is a 200+ pt jump...my bad

And jono breathes a big sigh of relief as his much hoped for prediction is well and truly borne out - HS42 currently around 20350.

Note that this still leaves me over 100pts down on my buy in point - now, do I set a new stop loss at -150-200pts and take what comes?

 

[Trembling Hand]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Note that this still leaves me over 100pts down on my buy in point - now, do I set a new stop loss at -150-200pts and take what comes?

Are you still in the trade?

 

[skyQuake]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Well this is the hang seng and there was a time where you could be 600pts offside and come back breakeven.

But what about the times that it continues running a few thousand points? There was a week in 08 that saw basically a 5000pt downmove in 5 days. Sure it was 'oversold' but what can you do about it?

 

[jonojpsg]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

Well this is the hang seng and there was a time where you could be 600pts offside and come back breakeven.

But what about the times that it continues running a few thousand points? There was a week in 08 that saw basically a 5000pt downmove in 5 days. Sure it was 'oversold' but what can you do about it?

skyQuake that is NOT what I want to be hearing right now!! Agreed though, if it had kept running I was STUFFED, wouldn't have been able to sleep if it had gapped down again as TH suggested

Given the current situation globally though, I am of the opinion (dangerous I know) that the current move up will continue for the short term. Obviously the major danger that I can see is China's data taking a turn for the worse as stimulus comes out of the system, and that really is a big worry

Am still in the trade though, and looking for a target of around 20600 (see attached screen dump of some lines drawn on a chart).

 

[Trembling Hand]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

So let me see. You take a trade on this idea,

The trade I took was on the Hang Seng as I thought it would jump when Hong Kong opened today following a reasonable lead from the Dow.

Then you pulled your stop because it was going to be hit!!

And Timmy, yep I had a stop loss when I took out the trade (20405) which for some inexplicable reason that I think has something to do with a brain malfunction (or maybe some deep buried gambling urge that makes me think I can beat the system), I removed

And held off side for 600 odd points

And,

Given the current situation globally though, I am of the opinion that the current move up will continue for the short term. Obviously the major danger that I can see is China's data taking a turn for the worse as stimulus comes out of the system, and that really is a big worry

Now you are talking about global macro reasons to hold for what seems like a much longer period than what you entered it for only on Friday morning.

And the only danger you see is "China's data taking a turn for the worse as stimulus comes out of the system"

Am still in the trade though, and looking for a target of around 20600 (see attached screen dump of some lines drawn on a chart).

So target is 125 above your entry yet you held on 600 points offside?????

lol this has the making of a classic thread.

 

[Timmy]

Re: FED raises emergency rates

What TH said, especially this:

by taking a trade for a reason, that is the US is up, but then when it reversed and completely removed your reason for being in the trade in the first place you have still held?

Also, Jono, nothing wrong with a bit of luck from time-to-time, and you'll agree its not a good basis for a trading plan/philosophy. You got a "Get Out of Jail Free" card, don't expect too many. At the very least stick to your stop now.

 

[brty]

Jono,

In another thread you claim to have a high IQ, with that brainpower I suggest you use it here and spoil TH's amusement.

A few dollars here and there is immaterial. Close the trade and study it and yourself during the trading of this position. Work out what you should be doing and stick to it, or change the way you do things until you have a plan that you can stick to.

Here are some questions to ask yourself...

What is the overall performance of my method when I pull the stop everytime it gets hit??

Does pulling the stop enhance performance when the market turns to go in the original direction and of course is the only time one should/would do it??

Is trading just another form of gambling, game of chance??

Does my engineering background mean that I have an undying belief that I should be right in my choices of trade, after working out the mathematics of the trade??

Why am I trading??

brty

 

[jonojpsg]

Thanks for the feedback all

I think my main problem is one of laziness. I keep intending to trade rigorously with attention to detail, technical signals, position sizing, etc. and then get lazy and omit some or all of the above.

I will take your input brty and try and make this a lesson that I will actually learn from

BTW TH can you help me out with why the HS decided to run some 300pts in the last half hour or so??

 

[symmetry]

WTF are you doing ?

seriously , while im not giving advice on here , you need rules and plan , not some gut feel fundamantal instinct which will will burn you finaically and mentally

Now rule one when wrong get out !
rule 2 make sure you know your limits and where you can afford to loose
rule 3 educate your slef and learn to plan , far out ! , hey you dont use IG brokers either they arant real as so many have pointed out , what your doing is gambiling , NOT trading.

u might as well toss a coin every time you trade ( place a bet )

i dont mean to be hard on you , but seriosuly u givr guys like me a bad name and wifes ammo to beat with when u mention trading , then the funds and brokers rub their hands together coz everyone runs to them thinking they ar ethe only true traders.

STOP ! LEARN , LISTEN and then you can TRADE otherwise you will LAMENT !! ever starting

if you were a electrician or something you would be dead , gee what does this mean 415 votls - danger , ill touch it and see what happens ... thats what you did gee i wonder if the market is going to go up, ill touch it and see , WHACK !!!!!!!!

anyway please please do some study and FFS dont loose your shirt

 

[symmetry]

NEVER TRUST FUNDAMANTALS they are for the sheep !! that follow ..

 

[jonojpsg]

WTF are you doing ?

seriously , while im not giving advice on here , you need rules and plan , not some gut feel fundamantal instinct which will will burn you finaically and mentally

Now rule one when wrong get out !
rule 2 make sure you know your limits and where you can afford to loose
rule 3 educate your slef and learn to plan , far out ! , hey you dont use IG brokers either they arant real as so many have pointed out , what your doing is gambiling , NOT trading.

u might as well toss a coin every time you trade ( place a bet )

i dont mean to be hard on you , but seriosuly u givr guys like me a bad name and wifes ammo to beat with when u mention trading , then the funds and brokers rub their hands together coz everyone runs to them thinking they ar ethe only true traders.

STOP ! LEARN , LISTEN and then you can TRADE otherwise you will LAMENT !! ever starting

if you were a electrician or something you would be dead , gee what does this mean 415 votls - danger , ill touch it and see what happens ... thats what you did gee i wonder if the market is going to go up, ill touch it and see , WHACK !!!!!!!!

anyway please please do some study and FFS dont loose your shirt

Oh I agree with everything you say. I have been trading like this for about 7 years and and am pretty much exactly where I started. It has been an interesting ride though, kept me entertained.

Yep, I reckon I should ditch IG, although what diff does it make if you are trading oil, currencies, indexes whether you use CFDs or other brokers? Doesn't the price track the same anyway?

 

[Synergy]

WTF are you doing ?
if you were a electrician or something you would be dead , gee what does this mean 415 votls - danger , ill touch it and see what happens ... thats what you did gee i wonder if the market is going to go up, ill touch it and see , WHACK !!!!!!!!

Quality analogy.

Jono, if after 7 years of active trading you are still in the game, you must be doing some things right at least some of the time.

 

[Trembling Hand]

OK, well I try and keep up with the macro stuff going on, eg latest news, interest rates, economic data. That at least helps me trade from an informed perspective (OK so far?).

Then from the charts I would look for support/resistance points, short/long term trends, volume, etc. and identify entry/exit points.

Sort out my position sizing and stop loss based on current capital.

So how do I get an edge? Is it intuition?

Blah Blah Blah, That's not actually,

really am trying to become a better trader,

In fact you listing what I would call just the most basic of functions, like lifting your feet when going for a run. Is a real worry. If after,

been trading like this for about 7 years and and am pretty much exactly where I started.

And your still pulling stops give up. You cannot even lift your feet to start to train for the running race, let alone think about winning it.

So how do I get an edge? Is it intuition?

Whats that line about doing the same thing and expecting a different result?


Here is a suggestion which I'm betting you will ignore.

Get on a sim account and find a pattern that repeats with good R:R and where you can recognize what market condition it applies to.

Then,

Trade it on sim for about 500 trades. If you have positive expectancy after the whole 500 start with correct MM in the real market with small amounts.

build from there.

But I know you won't cuz thats to hard and takes too long and already you want to ask what pattern "with good R:R".

 

[symmetry]

there a good brokers with low fees , real markets .

IG does not track markets 1:1 they delay and soemtimes skew the numbers, same as CFD brokers, i have many a time when im in a good position , had a large fall say in the AUD usd with little or no movment on my account when in fact i should be up 10k i stopped using them as id ring and ask why it hasnt moved, they d give some BS excuse about delays or the forex market im looking at isnt as live as theres or they are taking it from a another exchange lol so i ve seenthis in stocks too - when you have no market runnign they skew the figures on what they see plus take into account your entry as its all about them being profitable thats the difference between brokers , they win on entry, exit ( win win ) cfd brokers ala cmc win win win , they get u on the spread in , the proft , then the spread out . look at the fininacial statements see how much they make lol


so use real markets , like futures, forex ( mini's ) these are real movments and you are trading with genuine market makers, NOT MAKERS OF THE MARKET to suit their pocket. plus its small margins

seriously hang seng is a serious mover and nikkie ull die if you have no plan , while you can make good money on them u have to study how they work a nd why they move great gaps , its not hard !! its just hard work !!!

listen , as the previous guy said go to go markets or IB or MBT and get a demo account hell go to synthesis bank demo they give you nearly every demo / market with cash galore , practice until ( yes 500 trades is good ) and do it as if its real

PLACE BIG SIGNS up on your monitors WHERE IS MY STOP ! ... AM I FOLLOWING MY PLAN !!! etc..

look u may be lucky so far but u will physco out or loose more than your shirt ... i guess if u like giving me money away hell give it to me .. : )

as an engineer you should apply sound methodolgy , look try using some basic math ...

are you trading daily or intraday ? coz there is a big difference.

 

[Temjin]

Errrr...trade gone the opposite way, so...sell it and take the actual loss?

Don't EVEN try to "hope" that it will goes back up and then you will sell it. This is a common trap for pretty much 99% of beginner traders.

It's a worry that you are "playing" CFDs without a proper plan. Advise you to sell everything now and go back to the drawing boards for several months.

 

[symmetry]

just wondering if your still alive ? or still sane ?

hopefully you have rethought what your doing ? anyway let us know how your getting on