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Greece default/exiting Euro?

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Debt forgiveness would be welcomed for this due payment but really this race of people going back thousands of years needs to file for bankruptcy and start again.

This present scenario has little economic effect on most of the world but regardless, the psychology manifested is mass fear. It's disappointing but it's what happens when budgets aren't balanced.
 
Just wondering why the market has reacted so sensitively to Greece? Surely this wasn't unexpected or unforeseen - the date for payment had been known well ahead of time and the market should've known. Even someone on here a few months back said it would be interesting come the date for payment.

It's almost as if the market has gone "omg Greece may be defaulting!" and reacted, whereas I think the market should've known this all along. And if an individual investor was aware of it, why would they keep buying prior to this date?
 
My feeling was that expectation was that there would be last minute deal as that is the 'usual' outcome of such meetings. So no it was not expected. Nobody knew Tsipras was going to call it to vote.
 
avion said:
My feeling was that expectation was that there would be last minute deal as that is the 'usual' outcome of such meetings. So no it was not expected. Nobody knew Tsipras was going to call it to vote.
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Nobody could reasonably expect that to happen. To the rest of Europe, it's all Greek to them.
What that referendum boils down to: "Do you want to pay your debt? Yes/No."

Sure, it was widely known that Greece would be unable to make the scheduled repayments. For any Lender doing proper Due Diligence, the writing was on the wall for years. Recent discussions and demands were never about that. The Creditors finally demanded, "If you continue to keep asking for extensions, at least start to fix your budget. Cut spending. Stop blustering. Convince us you're worth the additional risk!"
 
lol...Thats a great idea TH...I wonder if Tsipperass would just take the money and run? I mean whats to say he hasn't got some prop jobber making a personal fortune from all these swings and round a a bouts anyway!!


TH, you haven't got a new job working for Greece have you
 
Varofakis strikes me as a very sane sober thinker.

Money unfortunately is produced from thin air these days. It is given to the rich to do something with as there is the assumption they can be trusted. These guys spread it amongst themselves but give the debt to the people .
.
If the people were smart they would transfer the risk back to the loan provider. Change the law in Greece. If someone is bankrupt their debts are cancelled. The lender made a bad investment decision.
 
avion said:
So no it was not expected. Nobody knew Tsipras was going to call it to vote.
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On the contrary, Tsipras and others have been constant in this. They told the Greek electorate what they hoped to achieve vis a vis Greek debt and the austerity regime, and the reasons for their stance - the Greek electorate voted them into power with the expectation that the new government would pursue these goals.

As negotiations unfolded and it became clear that the troika would not allow the democratically elected government of Greece to fulfill its election pledge Tsipras and others stated publicly, in April 2015 - “If the solution falls outside our mandate, I will not have the right to violate it, so the solution to which we will come to will have to be approved by the Greek people,” Tsipras said. http://fortune.com/2015/04/28/greeces-pm-signals-a-step-back-from-the-brink-with-referendum-talk/

Again "Tsipras threatened to call a referendum if lenders insist on demands deemed unacceptable by his leftist government, elected to scrap austerity." and "Pressed on options if no deal were found, Tsipras ruled out snap elections but said the government did not have the right to accept demands "outside our mandate", and any deal that required such terms would have to be put to Greeks in a referendum." http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/28/us-eurozone-greece-idUSKBN0NJ0FT20150428

In holding the referendum, Syriza is keeping faith with the Greek electorate.

The referendum cannot have come as a surprise to anyone who was paying attention.
 
I'd forgotten this old Monty Python sketch until the SMH mentioned it today, very funny. Greece and Germany play a football match.

Using the Insert Video icon didn't embed the Youtube as I'd expected.

[video]https://youtu.be/B6nI1v7mwwA[/video]
 
I think this whole thing is **** end about.

It should be the 500 million people in the EU Who should be voting to allow Grrece to stay in the EU or give them the boot.

Greece will never and can never repay it debts. It is about time the world started growing some balls and making countries and companies responsible for their actions and debts. These same entities expect people to honour their actions and payback the debts.

Why worry about Greece when China has wiped off the whole capitalization of the ASX in 30 days. Makes Greece look like a tiny pimple on a teenages acne face.
 
notting said:
Greek used car salesman prime minister starting to look very stupid.
No stagger left just a knitted brow.
Should go down in history as a buffoon who took a cheap shot to become the idiot prime minister for a moment.
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Four months later. So it was!

They will vote "Yes", stay in the Euro and adjust their behavior a little toward what they agreed upon in the first place in order to be in the Euro.

Varoufakis and Tsipras should have been locked up for treason and embarrassing the country with the rubbish they were saying even before the 'terrorist comment' which is the ultimate insult and most harmful thing any representative could have stated on behalf of the Greek people.
 

When something can't go on forever, it will stop. Didn't some wise man said that?

You can't make loans on harsh terms where it would be impossible for people to pay back, and keep at it hoping they can't pay back so they'd have to sell their assets.

Watched interviews with Yanis (something), the Finance Minister... They want to stay in the Euro, want to pay back their debt... but do it by changing their policies. For example, raise tax on the rich, on corporations... the troika said no, they demanded cutting public spending, cut support to employment benefits, no investment to create jobs. They want austerity because it works so well like never before.

It's one thing to lend and expect repayment, it's quite another to expect repayment made through ways you want. That's like the bank lending people and then tell them to have to work at this job and not another job... when they tried and can't repay, tell them to sell their car to you for nothing, or eat less or sell their clothes too.

Well, if it's capitalism and free market... when you make bad loans, you suck it up.
 
Sub Prime lending to brokeners in the US.

Sub Prime lending to Greece in the EU.

Same result eventually.

The more they kick the can down the road the worse it will be IMO.
 
Straw polling indicates that the "OXI" ("NO") vote may be leading by somewhere in the vicinity of 8-10 points.
 
61% voting NO with 35% of the vote counted.

Congratulations? to Greece.

Now to sit back and watch the SHTF in China from any flow on effect
 
This is going to be a crazy week......
 
An interesting spread of views - from noco to luutzu and lots in between.
I guess it will create a burst of volatility in international markets, starting on the ASX in a couple of hours.
How much of that is caused directly by Greece? Or is it simply a case of the Media homing in on any bad news, like -
China's jitters: http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/quickchart/quickchart.asp?symb=CN:SHCOMP&insttype=Index
Abbott's bad Budget: https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/28677153/budget-at-risk/

Oil down to $55; AUD down to 74c.

It may be prudent to stay calm and wait for the dust to settle and a clear trend to emerge.
The very nimble among us could however take advantage of volatility and snip lots of points from swings.
 
wayneL said:
Sub Prime lending to brokeners in the US.

Sub Prime lending to Greece in the EU.

Same result eventually.

The more they kick the can down the road the worse it will be IMO.
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I agree.
Voting no, the Greeks have acted in their own interest and allowed the Government to force the Euro nannycrats to strike a better deal which should include wiping out some of the debt. Good on them.
 
Knobby22 said:
I agree.
Voting no, the Greeks have acted in their own interest and allowed the Government to force the Euro nannycrats to strike a better deal which should include wiping out some of the debt. Good on them.
Click to expand...

I don't think the general population knows what their doing, i think they're going the route of Argentina. Good luck...

I feel bad for the investors that believed in them. The Greeks are happy to have their comfy state pensions, new infrastructure, but they don't stop and think where its all coming from.
 
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