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Going to Laos & Cambodia

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http://elephant.elehost.com/About_Elephants/about_elephants.htm

An elephant ´s trunk, a union of the nose and upper lip, is a highly sensitive organ with over 100,000 muscle units.
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Elephant trunks can get very heavy. It is not uncommon to see elephants resting them over a tusk!
Elephants cry, play, have incredible memories, and laugh!
Elephants are sensitive fellow animals where if a baby complains, the entire family will rumble and go over to touch and caress it.
Elephants have greeting ceremonies when a friend that has been away for some time returns to the group.
Elephants grieve at a loss of a stillborn baby, a family member, and in many cases other elephants.
Elephants don't drink with their trunks, but use them as "tools" to drink with. This is accomplished by filling the trunk with water and then using it as a hose to pour it into the elephant's mouth.
Interestingly, the Asian elephant is more closely related to the extinct mammoth than to the African elephant (see evolution).
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The roots of the word "elephant" in latin is divided into two words; ele means arch and phant means huge.

http://elephant.elehost.com/About_Elephants/Senses/Elephant_Joy/elephant_joy.html - elephant joy... etc
Some cases in which Elephants show explicit joy is

In the greeting of a friend or family member (even a human friend)
After the birth of a baby elephant
Playing games
Typically this expression of joy takes place in the form of a greeting ceremony. Obviously, there are may other aspects to this ceremony that goes without recognition, but joy is one of the most predominant factors. When family members or friends meet, they can be seen to become collectively involved in a joyous meeting. This is usually observed when a friend or family member is absent for a long time. When he/she returns, an incredible welcoming takes place. During this greeting the elephants involved will spin around, defecate, and urinate. With their heads held high, and ears flapping they fill the air with a symphony of trumpets, rumbles, screams, and roars.
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This type of playing involves elephants young and old--acting in expressions of personality-- having fun. A good exampe of this is recounted in the the book The Fate Of The Elephant. Douglas Chadwick records a story that Joyce Pool observed in the Amboseli Reserve. While she was winding up a string that was set down to mark out a vegetation study plot, elephants came indifferent to such feelings of fear, and shyness and had a blast. They started trumpeting, racing around. One elephant wound it around her trunk, and the other whirled it around winding it around all her four legs. They off they bounded into the bush playing, and taking the string with them.

http://elephant.elehost.com/News/General_News/About_Circuses/about_circuses.html
Over Eighteen people have been killed and 89 others have been seriously injured by captive elephants since 1990. As a result, lawsuits totaling in the many millions have been filed.
Many "circus elephants" are carrying a strain of tuberculosis contagious to humans
Elephants are repeatedly beaten in order to train them. These intelligent social mammals often live their whole lives in travel trailers, sometimes in the blazing heat or the freezing cold. The majority of the time, they are chained by two feet, unable to take even one step forward or back.
 
Oh God, 2020, I wish I hadn't read your final paragraph.

That's as bad as the bears in China which are caged so tightly they cannot move at all and which are milked for their bile.

What is it in human beings that allows them to enact this terrible cruelty to animals?

Give me an animal over a human being any day.

Julia
 
Julia said:
That's as bad as the bears in China which are caged so tightly they cannot move at all and which are milked for their bile. Julia
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yep ;) - the world would be so much better if, when Noah was rounding up the animals, he and his wife accidentally missed the boat;)

As if the bile was beneficial anyways !! - like Rhino horn the original viagra! Sometimes you have to worry.

The good news is that its getting publicity (even the strange Chinese delicacies like bears paw, and bits of elephant and tiger etc are pretty much things of the past) -

The other good news is the previous post (thanks to Channel 9 :))- those elephants from Thailand seem real happy - sounds like the Thai protests that delayed their shipment for months were more founded in Thai possessiveness about their beloved elephants yes? -

"Elephants Live to about 70" etc. I was told in Thailand that man and elephant are a natural union. - their lifespans the same etc - hence they are/were "matched for life" at least in the old days. Worked the timber , cleared land - or built buildings etc etc. Even their childbearing age - "reach puberty at 13-14 and continue to have calves till about 50". Not that I think they were matched in that sense lol. More a case of "me-and-alice-..-and-Jumbo-and Jumbette ;) Must've been fun on yearly vacations at the beach resort.

PS speaking of viagra - I wonder if it works on Panda bears ? "and here , children is the Panda cage - yes tommy they remind ME of SBS as well - and over here.."
 

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I went to Cambodia /Laos last year with wife & kids, Laos was wonderful, river trips, caves etc. Cambodia would have been better if it wasn't spoilt right from the start & onwards by greedy, corrupt govt officials. First we missed the sea boat to Siahnoukville from the border because the border guards picked on us because my wife was Thai/Australian. EVery govt worker we ran into afterwards had thier hand in my pocket, we flew out of Siem Reap simply so we wouldn't have anymore hassles. My advice & I normally love travelling/ roughing it by land is to fly. Occoteaul Beach was nice, Cambodia was interesting, (the food was awful, they somehow think us faraengs like everything floating in oil. Inedible). Angkor Wat is absolutely incredible.
We flew to Luang Prabang from Siem Reap, it is a lovely place to spend a few days but dare I say it, over-rated. Went north to Nong Kioew near Chinese border few days there & boat trip back to Luang Prabang, went to VIentiane via different waterfalls & caves (Vang Vieng 3 days) over a week. Laos is lovely but Thailand is easier. I plan to go to Burma next time but my wife & kids might stay behind at relatives in NE Thailand as they didn't enjoy the travel esp' since the hassles we had just getting into Cambodia.
Good food is harder to come by in Laos, just eat where the locals eat, like Cambodia, once they think they're cooking for faraengs the food turns tastless & awful, even in Luang Prabang which is a shame because Laos food is really good.
* We do all our travel by local transport with backpacks. Everything changes (STERILE) when you take package tours.
** Best place to get up to date/ down to earth info is on Lonely Planet Forum.
*** esp' Don't bother with Grand Palace in Phnom Phen, It's a rip off & a poor mans copy of the real thing in Bangkok even down to having a plastic green buddha in the centre temple.

I could go on forever, want to know about Thailand? Malaysia? Singapore?
 
Out Too Soon said:
I went to Cambodia /Laos last year with wife & kids, Laos was wonderful, river trips, caves etc. Cambodia would have been better if it wasn't spoilt right from the start & onwards by greedy, corrupt govt officials. First we missed the sea boat to Siahnoukville from the border because the border guards picked on us because my wife was Thai/Australian. EVery govt worker we ran into afterwards had thier hand in my pocket, we flew out of Siem Reap simply so we wouldn't have anymore hassles. My advice & I normally love travelling/ roughing it by land is to fly. Occoteaul Beach was nice, Cambodia was interesting, (the food was awful, they somehow think us faraengs like everything floating in oil. Inedible). Angkor Wat is absolutely incredible.
We flew to Luang Prabang from Siem Reap, it is a lovely place to spend a few days but dare I say it, over-rated. Went north to Nong Kioew near Chinese border few days there & boat trip back to Luang Prabang, went to VIentiane via different waterfalls & caves (Vang Vieng 3 days) over a week. Laos is lovely but Thailand is easier. I plan to go to Burma next time but my wife & kids might stay behind at relatives in NE Thailand as they didn't enjoy the travel esp' since the hassles we had just getting into Cambodia.
Good food is harder to come by in Laos, just eat where the locals eat, like Cambodia, once they think they're cooking for faraengs the food turns tastless & awful, even in Luang Prabang which is a shame because Laos food is really good.
* We do all our travel by local transport with backpacks. Everything changes (STERILE) when you take package tours.
** Best place to get up to date/ down to earth info is on Lonely Planet Forum.
*** esp' Don't bother with Grand Palace in Phnom Phen, It's a rip off & a poor mans copy of the real thing in Bangkok even down to having a plastic green buddha in the centre temple.

I could go on forever, want to know about Thailand? Malaysia? Singapore?
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Hi OTS, I saw a doco on Burma the other day and I'd be pretty wary of travelling there .... The army "government" are a mean pack of individuals, killing their own people/including women and children if they show the slightest objection to the "army" rule ......... Of course all doco's can have a political slant, but there were certainly plenty of dead bodies on the footage as proof ............. wouldn't like to not see you come back :eek: Cheers, Barney.
 
barney said:
Hi OTS, I saw a doco on Burma the other day and I'd be pretty wary of travelling there .... The army "government" are a mean pack of individuals, killing their own people/including women and children if they show the slightest objection to the "army" rule ......... Of course all doco's can have a political slant, but there were certainly plenty of dead bodies on the footage as proof ............. wouldn't like to not see you come back :eek: Cheers, Barney.
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If only Burma had oil wells (& Sudan). It's safe enough for tourists if they stick to where they're supposed to be allowed to go. I hate the idea of giving the Burmese govt my tourist dollars but I've been waiting for years for a change there & unless they discover oil I can't see the rest of the world giving more than lip service to the problem. Have met quite a few ppl who slipped over the border & did the unofficial tour (Karen resistance), definitely not for the family. :rolleyes:
Closest I came was a 3 day raft trip near the border many years ago, that was great, although at one point we could hear the heavy guns going off just over a line of hills. :eek:
Love Thailand! plan to retire there in another 12- 15 years. :)
 
Day trips to Myanmar (Burma) are normal for a "visa run" from thailand. I've been to both Myanma and Sudan and while it often breaks your heart, it's the way the country is. India is no different, people just die there due to negligence instead of a bullet. To travel is to embrace what is there, for better or worse.

I'm with Julia on the subject of animals. I've said for a long time that I'm ashamed to be human...


cheers,
 
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