Flood of migrants overwhelm Australia's borders

While I would agree with many of the initiatives of the ALP government I feel that they are being schmoozed by the rich and powerful in Asia in to allowing queue jumpers to hire boats and just land on our Northern border.

I can see us down the track having "Australians" with agendas in other places, calling themselves Australian when all they seek is a piece of paper to further their agenda.

It reminds me of the Keating years when the Lebanese conflict was headlines, and for which we Australians are still paying.

gg

GG, do you realise that 96% of Australia's illegal immigrants arrive by plane!

And that the Chinese group is the largest group of people. The boat people get all the media flack but really, they are not the problem.

Garpal Gumnut said:

While I would agree with many of the initiatives of the ALP government I feel that they are being schmoozed by the rich and powerful in Asia in to allowing queue jumpers to hire boats and just land on our Northern border.

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If there was a queue to begin with, I suspect many would have taken their turn.
Most refugees continue to be accepted into countries which can least afford to support them.
Unfortunately we here have many empty vessels making a lot of noise about vessels full of people who, given the chance, would quietly go about making a new life in Australia.
We can afford to be more generous, but the political backlash from xenophobes will ensure our shores remain largely unwashed by the unwashed.

"Flood of migrants overwhelm Australia's borders"

What a crock...our flood is a trickle in comparison to Europe and North America,
there's a thousand a day making the run from North Africa to southern Europe.

Some times they have to close the channel tunnel due to the danger of the trains
hitting illegal immigrants....from memory the largest group of visa over stayers in
Australia is Great Britain.

rederob said:

If there was a queue to begin with, I suspect many would have taken their turn.
Most refugees continue to be accepted into countries which can least afford to support them.
Unfortunately we here have many empty vessels making a lot of noise about vessels full of people who, given the chance, would quietly go about making a new life in Australia.
We can afford to be more generous, but the political backlash from xenophobes will ensure our shores remain largely unwashed by the unwashed.

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it's not our job to bring in anyone who wants to come. if we said "yeah come along everyone and enjoy our welfare state" then we'd have millions of people try and make their way over here and destroy our way of life in the process.

our capital cities are already overburdened with water restrictions, transport gridlock, lack of property supply, infrastructure decay and over-representation of minorities in criminal statistics. our country areas regularly suffer from drought and lack access to basic services. our health and education systems are neglected, we have homeless and beggars clogging our CBD streets and our elderly are neglected and many struggle to make ends meet. as taxpayers we end up paying almost half our wage on direct and indirect tax, half of which goes to the welfare budget, of which minorities are overrepresented as recipients.

yet you and other nieve idealists like you say "we can afford to be more generous". you really don't have a clue beyond your narrow rainbow view of the world do you?

maybe you can afford to be more generous, but theres plenty of people out there doing it tough, struggling day to day and looking at possible unemployment while people like you try to assuage some pathetic cultural guilt by cramming more people into the country, then accusing anyone who may object with racism and xenophobia.

here's a newsflash for you - the fked up world is not our problem. i know you want to save the day and feel good about yourself, but selling the rest of the nation out isn't the way to go about it.

i am more than happy to send advisors and experts and provide infrastructure support to these countries that suck so badly people feel the need to risk money and life to get here. with our help and guidance we can provide a framework to build a successful first world democracy HOWEVER these nations need the cultural and psychological mindset to do it. if they don't, then why do we want to bring those people over here to destabilise our own society?

as for people saying "europe has it worse", have a look at the state of europe, especially with regards to crime, welfare dependency, loss of national identity and ghettoisation / islamisation of suburbs which are no longer under the control of the central government.

Garpal Gumnut said:

While I would agree with many of the initiatives of the ALP government I feel that they are being schmoozed by the rich and powerful in Asia in to allowing queue jumpers to hire boats and just land on our Northern border.

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Talk about a non event.

Personally I am for open borders but at minimum, these people struggle valiantly to be here, pity we don't welcome them with open arms. Seems odd to spend billions on getting ready to shoot people, when we could spend billions on helping people.

Hell we're ALL boat people, even the indigenous Australians, the only difference is the time frame.

rederob said:

IWe can afford to be more generous,

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As disarray pointed out, our infrastructure isn't designed to cope with the population we already have. If the governments can't do their job for the current population, they're just going to struggle even more with an increasing population.

Seems odd to spend billions on getting ready to shoot people, when we could spend billions on helping people.

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I'd prefer the government just not spend billions at all, and let people do what they want their own money.

i am more than happy to send advisors and experts and provide infrastructure support to these countries

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Ultimately that is what is needed. These countries have to be improved to a standard where they can sustain themselves, rather than becoming a burden on the rest of the world. Unfortunately, their leaders often don't care for it, and the developed world doesn't seem to either. Instead we ignore the problems until it becomes a problem for us.

as taxpayers we end up paying almost half our wage on direct and indirect tax, half of which goes to the welfare budget, of which minorities are overrepresented as recipients.

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Paying the tax we pay is a result of government inefficiency. Minorities or illegal immigrants/asylum seekers? We're not talking about minorities, and I'd be surprised if they were over-represented anyway.

I don't have any problem with someone who is able to sustain themselves. Perhaps for every productive immigrant we should exile an unproductive "Australian".

Hell we're ALL boat people

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No, technically most of us are only related to boat people :.

Why the hell do bleeding hearts think people in other countries shouldn't stand up and fight for their freedom? Are you bleeders such outrageous racists that you think people from developing nations are so genetically disadvantaged they have to be nannied by patronizing spoon feeding metrosexuals....or that they have a familial absence of backbone and can't fight aggressors in their own country?

My forebears fought for their freedom in the UK....for thousands of years...they never sought asylum in a welfare state....

Have you idiots ever stopped to think why you haven't seen Tibetans jumping on boats and floating over to Australia? They've done it tough for decades, and yet no asylum seeking by them thousands of km's across the ocean.....

Anyway, multiculturalism doesn't exist in Australia.....and it has never worked anywhere....not in canada, not in Malaysia, not in Fiji, not in France, not in the UK, not in the USA.......anyone who thinks Australia is multculti is a dipstick.....we expect everyone to integrate into the dominant culture within 2 generations.

Having a variety of ethnic restaurants in your burb and a convenient supply of migrants prepared to work for chickenfeed doesn't make us multicultural. It is intellectually retarded and an insult to migrants to say so.

When Australia's population is 20% Muslim, 20% Asian, and 60% Caucasian, and every street sign is written in english, arabic, and mandarin, then we'll be approaching multiculti.

Sure, controlled migration is cool....but not so much that it creates an underclass of tax revenue negative ghettoes.....with all the crime that goes with it.....haven't any of you been to England or France and seen the issues with poorly controlled migration?

ANyway, you anaemic bleeders voted in Labor and they haven't got the brains to keep infrastructure up to speed with their migrant intake.....Rudd just gave away 21b which could have built a lot of infrastructure....like maybe the dam 'we had to have'....

In 1989, Kevin Rudd as chief of staff under Wayne Goss canned the Wolfdene Dam in SE Qld to appease airhead greenies and friends of the ABC. It was the first thing he did in office.....That decision will restrict the population growth of SE Qld forever.....SE Qld's water supply got down to 15% in 2007, and there's no viable plans to increase the water supply here. That's what State Labor govts do. Bracks screwed Victoria and the unions have screwed NSW.

For as long as dkhead unionists and permanently indignant lawyers with no private commercial experience are put in control of billions, Australians will get short changed....

and read the papers this morning everyone.....Rudd just threw 21B at Chinese plasma televisions, the profits of which the Chinese will no doubt use to fund the modernization and expansion of their navy.......

meanwhile Rudd wants our military to cut 15B over the next 10 years.....

but he also now realizes our national security needs to be escalated quickly and significantly.....new subs, warships, patrol boats, helicopters, F35s......

I tell you this career public servant, this Mandarin speaking international man of mystery, this fine weather Christian, this Maaate of Obama.....couldn't run a chook raffle.......

As I posted:

rederob said:

Unfortunately we here have many empty vessels making a lot of noise ....

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Despite being a wealthy nation we play an exceptionally minor role in accommodating refugees.
By redirecting monies from border defence to humanitarian resettlement programs we would benifit both socially and financially in the longer term.
In schools throughout Australia the honour boards are strewn with non-Anglo-Saxon names, as overseas born parents sacrifice everything for their child's education.
Like it or not, some of these people will be the leaders of tomorrow, as Obama has proven.

rederob said:

As I postedespite being a wealthy nation we play an exceptionally minor role in accommodating refugees.
By redirecting monies from border defence to humanitarian resettlement programs we would benifit both socially and financially in the longer term.
In schools throughout Australia the honour boards are strewn with non-Anglo-Saxon names, as overseas born parents sacrifice everything for their child's education.
Like it or not, some of these people will be the leaders of tomorrow, as Obama has proven.

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Ah, the race card ... sorry, but I really believe that race has nothing to do with the problem, it's more simply a matter of numbers.

A line needs to be drawn, otherwise refugees will flood into Australia, and as previously stated - we simply don't have the infrastructure for it. The idea that all of these people are going to become productive members of society is nonsense as well. Many may well do this, but many may not.
Do you really believe that a middle aged man with no prior education, no knowledge of the English language, and probably a whole pile of other disadvantages, is really going to contribute in any sort of meaningful way? Few might, but I would argue that a great deal of them would not. They may work for 10 years at minimum wage, pay minimal tax, and at which point they'll begin collecting the pension until the day they die.

As I said, it's a numbers game, and with the global population exploding, and resources dwindling, everything else is irrelevant.

helicart said:

My forebears fought for their freedom in the UK....for thousands of years...they never sought asylum in a welfare state....
...

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Except they did ship their convicts to Australia and colonised (read: invaded) most of the countries around Asia.
And I think history will tell you that the UK received a damned lot of help from Australian 'colonies' in protecting their borders. And Winston Churchill did leave Australia WIDE OPEN to attack in order to protect his own. UK simply didnt do it all, ON THEIR OWN! Far from it.

I do agree with you about the infrastructure issue but that is a story that can be told in both Labor and Liberal and National circles. I think Joh has a lot to answer for in Queensland infratsructure issues.

And I am NOT a leftie commo bleeding heart unionist! And my heritage is British!

Trevor_S said:

Talk about a non event.

Personally I am for open borders but at minimum, these people struggle valiantly to be here, pity we don't welcome them with open arms. Seems odd to spend billions on getting ready to shoot people, when we could spend billions on helping people.

Hell we're ALL boat people, even the indigenous Australians, the only difference is the time frame.

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My feelings exactly.

rederob said:

As I postedespite being a wealthy nation we play an exceptionally minor role in accommodating refugees.

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No refugees in this country are actually "accommodated" until they can be provided with meaningful employment. We can't claim that we have "accommodated " anyone who is kept on welfare for years. If we think this is our obligation we could provide this in their homeland where it could be put to better use.

During the recession the chances of unskilled immigrants finding meaningful employment (or any employment) are dismal. If we have any spare resources we should direct it to helping the thousands of migrants, who are in a similar situation to the Bond factory workers in Woollongong. These women, the majority of whom are migrants have no other skills and through no fault of their own are on the scrap heap.

Charity should begin at home.

Prospector said:

Except they did ship their convicts to Australia and colonised (read: invaded) most of the countries around Asia.

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And all those countries had the freedom to defend themselves against the naturally aggressive behaviour of other 'tribes'. however, anglos had the strongest natural selection advantage....just as China has now built an advantage over australia, and will within 100 years imho, have colonized Australia.

History will show caucasians blew their opportunity over 200 years stewarding Australia, as wasted on getting fat, lazy, dumb, and outsourcing labor to more ignorant people overseas..and security to the USA....well the party is fast coming to an end.....Rudd is only waking up to that now....with the White paper that was released this week outlining the power imbalances and threats within our region...and need for a massive military build up in Australia[/COLOR]

Prospector said:

And I think history will tell you that the UK received a damned lot of help from Australian 'colonies' in protecting their borders.

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Well we all know it was the USA that saved the UK, and Hitler lost the war rather than the Allies won it.....he made many strategic errors later in the war, that if hadn't been made, he would have securely controlled Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East oil states. (but that's another story)

Prospector said:

And Winston Churchill did leave Australia WIDE OPEN to attack in order to protect his own. UK simply didnt do it all, ON THEIR OWN! Far from it.

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More wide eyed naive ignorant fool Australia.....and we still haven't learnt the lesson that ultimately we are responsible for our defence....all us Aussies sitting on our bums playing with our computers wouldn't be doing so if not for the USA saving our dumb asses...anyone who thinks we can continue to oursource our security to them deserves the Darwinian selection disadvantage that is now unfolding.

While Labor and the left have prioritized redistributing magic pie (that appears out of nowhere) to people to be unproductive including our indigenous brothers and sisters, they have been blissfully ignorant of the power shifts happening in the world around them....Australia and Rudd are about to be shocked out of that.......and he is manically having to change his election platform....when was the last time Rudd or the media front paged reconciliation? what happened to the computer for every student? what happened to ETS? what is Bligh doing about SE Qld water for the long term? hahahhahaa.......funny how Rudd et al have finally woken up to the fact that it really is "all about the economy stupid"

Prospector said:

I do agree with you about the infrastructure issue but that is a story that can be told in both Labor and Liberal and National circles. I think Joh has a lot to answer for in Queensland infratsructure issues.

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That's highly debatable.....but I haven't got time today...the trouble is all these milksop lucky country types have made a lot of crap decisions because they think we can rely on the USA to defend us and if we are nice to foreigners and let a token few come and open up restaurants here, foreigners won't attack us......haahhahaa.....Australia's misallocation of resources towards 'playing at the beach' and equality for all, is due to a seriously distorted mindset that will see us lose control of Australia.......but hopefully I won't be here when it happens...

Prospector said:

And I am NOT a leftie commo bleeding heart unionist! And my heritage is British!

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And my forebears were pre 1850 free settlers many of who died young fighting for world democracy or breaking their health working land that had laid idle since the beginning of time...and according to many Lefties, should be left idle...

rederob said:

As I postedespite being a wealthy nation we play an exceptionally minor role in accommodating refugees.

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Really? how wealthy are we? we haven't got the wealth or means of production to amass the hardware to put up a good defense of our country...not to mention the population's lack of health, obesity, and an anti-war general recalcitrant malaise amongst the young.....

Over 95% of 25-30 yo couldn't walk 10km in rugged terrain with 30kg on their back, and most young men don't know squat about machinery and engines.... they don't know how to use a screwdriver properly for God's sake....let alone a Steyr that can kill people (but they know a lot about Aboriginal rights)....I know this as a health professional intimate with the defence forces...low back pain and sprained ankles would be the norm.....

The bleeders think we're wealthy because they think bling is wealth......and they have an 8 yo's understanding of events overseas.....a lot of the difficulties in developing nations are due to overpopulation and wilfully not wanting to do the hard yards to do what is needed to create wealth and stability....go figure....it is up to other nations to realize their ignorance, apathy, and religious extremism create their problems....if they want a lifestyle like ours, they need to learn to harden the fk up and drag their butts into the 21st century.....and fight cro magnons like the Taliban and Al Queda rather than running away to..........hmmmmm......"Australia, Europe, Scandinavia look nice....James, Australia please".... and once here cling to their ignorance and a religion that created their problems, smug in the fact that someone else is looking after them....

and all those countries had the freedom to defend themselves against the naturally aggressive behaviour of other 'tribes'. however, anglos had the strongest natural selection advantage....just as China has now built an advantage over australia, and will within 100 years imho, have colonized Australia.

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History will show caucasians blew their opportunity over 200 years stewarding Australia, as wasted on getting fat, lazy, dumb, and outsourcing labor to more ignorant people overseas..and security to the USA....well the party is fast coming to an end.....Rudd is only waking up to that now....with the White paper that was released this week outlining the power imbalances and threats within our region...and need for a massive military build up in Australia.

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Could I suggest you read and analyse what you write. Writing/typing allows one to assess what they think and to put it into sensible words. Fantastic spin on things though.

rederob said:

As I postedespite being a wealthy nation we play an exceptionally minor role in accommodating refugees.
By redirecting monies from border defence to humanitarian resettlement programs we would benifit both socially and financially in the longer term.
In schools throughout Australia the honour boards are strewn with non-Anglo-Saxon names, as overseas born parents sacrifice everything for their child's education.
Like it or not, some of these people will be the leaders of tomorrow, as Obama has proven.

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The race card played again. IS this what the people in power think of Australians? Perhaps the UN thinks this?

The middle aged hairy man with no language skills is not coming ot AUstralia to be put on the walls of schools. He is coming to get HANDOUTS because he knows Australia is a HANDOUT nation that gives more to illegals than its citizens. That hairy middle aged man is keen to come here to help pay for his WIVES. This is not contributing, it is far from contributing. It is insulting to those who work, pay taxes, and expect to have a future much like their parents.
Obama is the left winger's idol, so nothing alarming about people's admiration for him.

Wysiwyg said:

Could I suggest you read and analyse what you write. Writing/typing allows one to assess what they think and to put it into sensible words. Fantastic spin on things though.

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could I suggest in addition to novice trading, you familiarize yourself with Darwin's survival advantage, which is the context of the terminology I am using.....though if your education was soft, and left leaning humanities, you may have never heard of Darwin....it is usually reserved for those doing science....

as always, no offence intended if you didn't intend....

helicart...what NATURAL SELECTION criteria has china got in common with 19th century england? LOL

there is a war being arranged.....THATS why rudd has BEEN TOLD to spend on defence....ARRANGED...!! GET IT?

you quote ql ciada??? wow. i thought you said you knew something???

you dont get out much...most 25-30 yo COULD walk 10km over rough terain......

helicart said:

could I suggest in addition to novice trading, you familiarize yourself with Darwin's survival advantage, which is the context of the terminology I am using.....though if your education was soft, and left leaning humanities, you may have never heard of Darwin....it is usually reserved for those doing science....

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Bowls the flipper, Wys. plays a cover drive for 4 runs. :