Environmental Terrorism

Bobby said:

How about some oracle of your own thoughts ?Introspection will apply

Click to expand...

gday bob - sorry - you'll have to be happy with my extracts from the poetry thread (below). Feel free to add your thoughts of course.

2020hindsight said:

1. who's saying it's just whales. - anything that's endangered.
2. otherwise no one listens (although praps you're right - the Japanese might roll over on this if we back them on the abductee question ? - now there's a thought - thanks Kauri )
3. m8 people spend a fortune just to go out on a boat to catch a glimpse of one of these magnificent creatures.

I keep thinking of that movie "Soylent Green"
Basically shows a world of the future, where you stay indoors because the air outside is unfit to breathe etc. And in your dying moments you are allowed to see a brief video of the world when it had clean air and trees and animals and so on. - anyone who hasn't seen it , make sure you have a bottle of whisky handy. (stars that new child wonder of the screen, Charlton Heston, 1973 )

ok, 1984 has come and gone and we didnt have Big Brother to the extent they predicted (maybe we did lol)
and 2022 is a bit early for this scenario - but my guess is our grandkid's grandkids will only survive if they mutate and grow smoke filtering gills.

Click to expand...

It seems to me as if you people never ever leave your own backyard or strictured ideas. I have flown up and down the Queensland coast for the last 30 years, I've visited the reef at least 6 monthly, I've fished and hunted on sea and land, I don't swim or snorkel because I'm afraid of sharks, so cannot comment on the reef, first hand. I've seen crocs increase in numbers where they now take human prey, I see no evidence of the catastrophy that you guys from ? Melbourne, Adelaide, Sydney, do. Whales still migrate up and down our Queensland coast in the same numbers.

Can you please present some evidence to back up your hyperbole and emotional investment in this debate.

Garpal

Well - I don't watch that much TV here, but the kidnappings have been big news at times. But it seems that they (the Japanese govt I guess) think their position is too precarious (no love lost with Nth Korea, China and even South Korea) to kick up too much of an international stink about it.
Military wise - Japanese are not supposed to have an attack capable military - but they can have a self defence capability - but if you can tell me what the practical difference is ...??? As I understand it - the Japanese 'Self Defence Force' has maybe the 3rd or 4th largest military budget in the world at its disposal. In addition - there are god knows how many US bases which are also supposed to defend Japan - as well as serve the US's interests in the region...
So - in the end I think the presence of the US in such force - deters even the craziest of crazies like Ol' Kim in NK. He'll crow alot - but if he did anything really stupid he would be crushed and he know this. Mostly it's a game NK is playing to try and get favourable international aid and trade.....

we hope...

Garpal Gumnut said:

Whales still migrate up and down our Queensland coast in the same numbers.

Can you please present some evidence to back up your hyperbole and emotional investment in this debate.

Garpal

Click to expand...

G - can you show us the 30 years of data from your whale count ??

Garpal Gumnut said:

It seems to me as if you people never ever leave your own backyard or strictured ideas. I have flown up and down the Queensland coast for the last 30 years, I've visited the reef at least 6 monthly, I've fished and hunted on sea and land, I don't swim or snorkel because I'm afraid of sharks, so cannot comment on the reef, first hand. I've seen crocs increase in numbers where they now take human prey ...

Click to expand...

The delicate equilibrium of life on the rusty planet - we kill them a little, they kill us a little, and those alive at the end of the day sleep soundly.

Tell me, the world according to garpal (and from some of your threads, a very thoughtful world), what do you hunt - rabbit, pig, roo, buffalo?

And any chance they are afraid of you, just before the heart shot.

Anyway, hunt hard, hunt long and if you hunt in my neck of the woods, as Edward Woodward said in Breaker - shoot straight ya bastard.

cheers

2020hindsight said:

gday bob - sorry - you'll have to be happy with my extracts from the poetry thread (below). Feel free to add your thoughts of course.

Click to expand...

Thank you for your answer 2020.

If ! you need help as a last resort PM me.

Regards Bob.

Garpal Gumnut said:

It seems to me as if you people never ever leave your own backyard or strictured ideas. I have flown up and down the Queensland coast for the last 30 years, I've visited the reef at least 6 monthly, I've fished and hunted on sea and land, I don't swim or snorkel because I'm afraid of sharks, so cannot comment on the reef, first hand. I've seen crocs increase in numbers where they now take human prey, I see no evidence of the catastrophy that you guys from ? Melbourne, Adelaide, Sydney, do. Whales still migrate up and down our Queensland coast in the same numbers.

Can you please present some evidence to back up your hyperbole and emotional investment in this debate.

Garpal

Click to expand...

Well, considering whaling finished a little more than 30 years ago, wouldn't you think that not noticing a difference in numbers would kind of... you know... prove the point? You should have noticed a difference.

Bobby said:

Thank you for your answer 2020. If ! you need help as a last resort PM me. Regards Bob.

Click to expand...

Bob I have no idea what you are on about - or what you are on for that matter. You seem to like strange personal posts.
The last time you made these sort of comments I suggested that you must have had some objection to something I had posted on another thread. You insisted no. Yet I see the following post you put on the "dual nationality" thread..

Bobby said:

I have a comment about the low lives from that so called country, but can't talk about it ! ASF rules regarding derogatory statements of muslims or islam ~~~ ? Don't know whats what with this______?" Bob.

Click to expand...

Now apart from the fact that you don't finish your sentences, it's pretty obvious that you and I don't have much in common on that subject at least - although I think you are a concerned greenie to some extent (whales etc). But we differ concerning where the world is going and/or how to stop it going there. But I'll let others be the judge of our respective contributions here.

Do you think that simply not finishing sentences avoids the fact that you have expressed the sentiment? - strange.

As for my dominating the poetry thread, I would love it if 100 people contributed. As for being introspective, Pretty difficult to post 100 poems (+/-), without stating some or your perceived reasons for existence. I concede many are absolute trivia...
"50 odd poems about this and that - most of em breezy and light,
and those that are heavy or hard to read , it's because they were easy to write".

But mate, if you don't mind - I'm gonna put you on "ignore" - and with posts like the one above, I hope the govt does too.
Sorry, I can't be bothered with the
"dear bob, regards, 2020" stuff. Arguably two faced.
as the old joke goes..One thing I can say for you, you aren't two-faced - otherwise you wouldn't wear that one out in public.

2020hindsight said:

Bob I have no idea what you are on about - or what you are on for that matter. You seem to like strange personal posts.
The last time you made these sort of comments I suggested that you must have had some objection to something I had posted on another thread. You insisted no. Yet I see the following post you put on the "dual nationality" thread..

Now apart from the fact that you don't finish your sentences, it's pretty obvious that you and I don't have much in common on that subject at least - although I think you are a concerned greenie to some extent (whales etc). But we differ concerning where the world is going and/or how to stop it going there. But I'll let others be the judge of our respective contributions here.

Do you think that simply not finishing sentences avoids the fact that you have expressed the sentiment? - strange.

As for my dominating the poetry thread, I would love it if 100 people contributed. As for being introspective, Pretty difficult to post 100 poems (+/-), without stating some or your perceived reasons for existence. I concede many are absolute trivia...
"50 odd poems about this and that - most of em breezy and light,
and those that are heavy or hard to read , it's because they were easy to write".

But mate, if you don't mind - I'm gonna put you on "ignore" - and with posts like the one above, I hope the govt does too.
Sorry, I can't be bothered with the
"dear bob, regards, 2020" stuff. Arguably two faced.
as the old joke goes..One thing I can say for you, you aren't two-faced - otherwise you wouldn't wear that one out in public.

Click to expand...

Keep the poems coming. Some of them are really thought provoking. Your intelligent contributions on the David Hicks situation are also interesting.

2020hindsight said:

Bob I have no idea what you are on about - or what you are on for that matter. You seem to like strange personal posts.
The last time you made these sort of comments I suggested that you must have had some objection to something I had posted on another thread. You insisted no. Yet I see the following post you put on the "dual nationality" thread..

Now apart from the fact that you don't finish your sentences, it's pretty obvious that you and I don't have much in common on that subject at least - although I think you are a concerned greenie to some extent (whales etc). But we differ concerning where the world is going and/or how to stop it going there. But I'll let others be the judge of our respective contributions here.

Do you think that simply not finishing sentences avoids the fact that you have expressed the sentiment? - strange.

As for my dominating the poetry thread, I would love it if 100 people contributed. As for being introspective, Pretty difficult to post 100 poems (+/-), without stating some or your perceived reasons for existence. I concede many are absolute trivia...
"50 odd poems about this and that - most of em breezy and light,
and those that are heavy or hard to read , it's because they were easy to write".

But mate, if you don't mind - I'm gonna put you on "ignore" - and with posts like the one above, I hope the govt does too.
Sorry, I can't be bothered with the
"dear bob, regards, 2020" stuff. Arguably two faced.
as the old joke goes..One thing I can say for you, you aren't two-faced - otherwise you wouldn't wear that one out in public.

Click to expand...

Dear 2020, Where is the poetry thread?

Garpal

Garpal Gumnut said:

the poetry thread?

Click to expand...

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2106
Garpal, As I have said many times, I wish more people would post there.
sorry m8, I can't add the "dear..." in the intro - haven't done that in 5 years of writing emails, and not about to start now. (except for writing to chinese or japanese who treat eg business cards as something with a soul etc)

2020hindsight said:

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2106
Garpal, As I have said many times, I wish more people would post there.
sorry m8, I can't add the "dear..." in the intro - haven't done that in 5 years of writing emails, and not about to start now. (except for writing to chinese or japanese who treat eg business cards as something with a soul etc)

Click to expand...

Dear 2020'

I'm a great fan of Larkin.

How do you know what my nationality is? Judge not.

Garpal

I hate greenpeace with a passion... Don't get me wrong I love the planet, but they are a pack of anti capitalists using global warming and stuff to mask their intentions... I can't believe they're against Genetically modified food so much that they starved 1,000,000 people in East Africa by convincing the governments that GE food is poisoness... Shame shame shame... just because they have full tummies already... they're responsible for over 1 human million deaths deaths...

The greenies that ram ships are pirates and should be jailed... And the "research ships" should be confiscated because they are clearly not for research...

They're all bastards

Garpal Gumnut said:

Dear 2020' I'm a great fan of Larkin. How do you know what my nationality is? Judge not. Garpal

Click to expand...

please add some samples
I dont judge poets on poetry - poetic licence - which is a-political
PS. I have no idea what your nationality is, nor do I care.- but I add the following comments (and here I guess I'm judgemental)
a) I think the mafia is a negative image with negative connotations, and
b) smoking is not that popular either

as for judgement - you'll find a poem on the poetry thread "how do you judge" #112

PS also #75 - I'm still trying to get up the courage to challenge the RSL that the words are "age shall not weary them , nor the years contemn" (not condemn) - but ...
to be fair, the difference between the two options is only evident when you are stone cold sober, and who would wish that on a returned digger

insider said:

I can't believe they're against Genetically modified food so much that they starved 1,000,000 people in East Africa by convincing the governments that GE food is poisoness...

Click to expand...

This isn't quite true. In exchange for the GE seeds, governments are asked to remove the native seeds from circulation. The GE seeds are designed so they don't flower and produce the seeds that the villagers collect for the next season's crop. So every year the villagers have to buy the seeds from the (usually) US company. Hence wiping out the subsistence culture.

chops_a_must said:

This isn't quite true. In exchange for the GE seeds, governments are asked to remove the native seeds from circulation. The GE seeds are designed so they don't flower and produce the seeds that the villagers collect for the next season's crop. So every year the villagers have to buy the seeds from the (usually) US company. Hence wiping out the subsistence culture.

Click to expand...

I was talking about already package food... It was AID relief from the US... Anyway GE food crops are engineered to with stand extreme climate conditions hence they grow more... Nothing wrong with that

insider said:

I was talking about already package food... It was AID relief from the US... Anyway GE food crops are engineered to with stand extreme climate conditions hence they grow more... Nothing wrong with that

Click to expand...

There is if it leaves people continually subservient on international aid.

insider said:

I hate greenpeace with a passion... Don't get me wrong I love the planet, but they are a pack of anti capitalists using global warming and stuff to mask their intentions... I can't believe they're against Genetically modified food so much that they starved 1,000,000 people in East Africa by convincing the governments that GE food is poisoness... Shame shame shame... just because they have full tummies already... they're responsible for over 1 human million deaths deaths...

Click to expand...

A lot of this comes back to the sustainability versus conservation argument. It's a point that conservationists truly hate and for good reason.

We have a global environment movement focused on conservation rather than sustainability to the point that the latter is frequently sacrificed to benefit the former.

More irritating than any of that however is the practice of opposing the things the "environmentalists" themselves promote as solutions. At various times the Greens in Australia have promoted coal-fired power, "put more pressure on the forests", Basslink, downstream processing of wood, wind power and tourism (and others).

They have also opposed every one of these things when someone actually tries to do them or supply the necessary products and services necessary to support the favoured activity. And yes, it is quite often the very same people on both sides of the debate at different times or in different places.

I long ago concluded that it just isn't possible to actually win any debate with the Greens over the long term. No matter what you do, even if it is exactly what they are advocating, they will launch a campaign against it once enough people have forgotten they once supported it.

Don't misunderstand me. I'm absolutely in favour of doing things in a manner that is sustainable or at least more sustainable than the alternatives. But opposing things just for the sake of opposing them is doing more harm than good as far as I'm concerned. At best it is diverting attention and effort away from the really serious issues. At worst, we end up doing things in a LESS sustainable manner just to please some narrow conservation agenda.

Has anyone worked out, for example, the real environmental issues surrounding something as seemingly simple as plastic shopping bags. We've heard plenty of reasons for banning them. But I can guarantee you there will be a downside somewhere. Without even knowing what that downside is (I suspect increased greenhouse gas emissions are one but there's little if any proper research) we can't possibly know if what we're doing is really a step forward or not. And yet we climb aboard the bandwagon as though all the facts were available and it was a clear cut argument.

Just look at the debate over climate change. Being lead in this country right now by the very same people who have by virtue of opposing the viable alternatives been the key promoters of coal-fired power generation. People who conveniently fail to mention that if you take out nuclear and hydro then basically all power in the world is from fossil fuels and that the major reason for Australia's high per capita emissions is our relatively lower use (or total non-use in the case of nuclear) of these two energy sources. The same two energy sources absolutely opposed by the very same people now screaming about the need to cut emissions.

chops_a_must said:

This isn't quite true. In exchange for the GE seeds, governments are asked to remove the native seeds from circulation. The GE seeds are designed so they don't flower and produce the seeds that the villagers collect for the next season's crop. So every year the villagers have to buy the seeds from the (usually) US company. Hence wiping out the subsistence culture.

Click to expand...

Apart from the moral aspects, that's outright dangerous in terms of security of food supply. The world dependent on a single country (US) for food supply is incredibly dangerous. All it takes is one Hitler-style dicator in the US and the world starves. Or an economic collapse, massive natural disaster, atomic bombing of the US etc could do much the same.

The world panics about the Middle East in relation to oil. And yet it is only 30% of the oil produced in the world with some of that used within the region. Just imagine a world totally dependent on one or two countries for GE seeds.

you better believe that the USA has worked it out to the cent of expected profit by going down that route.