Do you have solar panels?

[inq]

The sun will be further north during most of the year. If the evap cooler is directly west of the panels and only casting a shadow late in the day during Summer then it won't really be an issue. But if it's north of the panels then that's certainly a big problem.

Since they are wired in series, and the panels themselves are also in series, shading part of the array disproportionately drops the output relative to the area shaded. So you want no shade at all if possible for most of the day.

The Evap is indeed West of the proposed area, and the only shade from 6am-9pm is from around 7pm where the shadow forms. If what you say is true about the sun being further north most of the year, this will alleviate that problem.

So in essense this isn't a deal breaker, just a reduction in effeciency for that part of the evening?

 

[DocK]

Be warned - there's an awful lot of dud heat pumps and dud installers out there.

If they recommend running on peak tariff then Smurf recommends that you also do some running - well away from that supplier and/or product.

Usage will determine which tariff is most appropriate for a heat pump, but in a domestic situation it should be an off-peak tariff almost always. To do otherwise defeats the financial benefit of installing the heat pump in the first place.

In Qld, most will be best on Tarff 33 but if your usage is lower then 31 should be fine. I'd suggest leaving it on 31, assuming that is already installed for the existing hot water, unless there's a proven need to change.

In regard to heat pump brands, let's just say that if it has a booster element then that's not a sign of good design. If we can heat houses and hot water with heat pumps in the middle of the night in Winter here in Tassie with no booster, then you sure don't need a booster in most parts of Australia.

I have no association with the company, but I'll put a good word in for the Siddons Solarstream heat pump water heater. It's far better than the big name heat pumps in my opinion. It works fine at zero degrees with no booster, and a Google search will turn up plenty of praise without the horror stories associated with Rheem and Dux heat pumps.

The Siddons tank is stainless steel and made in Australia, compressor is Japanese. And being a split system design, you can still have the tank under the house, in the garage etc if you want to. It doesn't have as much fancy electronics as some of the big name brands which is a good thing - it's those fancy control systems that seem to cause rather a lot of trouble with breakdowns.

Whether or not you're better off with a heat pump or some other solar water heater is very site and location specific.

Thanks for the info Smurf - as I mentioned I'm not looking at installing an alternative hot water system until my present electric one dies - but it is reassuring to find that the company I'm dealing with for the solar panels use the Siddons heat pump (also carry Stiebel Eltron). Gives me hope that their claim of using the best available products might just be true

 

[Smurf1976]

Thanks for the info Smurf - as I mentioned I'm not looking at installing an alternative hot water system until my present electric one dies - but it is reassuring to find that the company I'm dealing with for the solar panels use the Siddons heat pump (also carry Stiebel Eltron). Gives me hope that their claim of using the best available products might just be true

Stiebel Eltron is another "good" brand judging by all reports I've seen (I have no personal experience with the Stiebel Eltron units). It does seem to be a quality product and is made in Germany to my understanding.

The other one I'd mention is Quantum. They were basically the pioneer of heat pump water heaters in this country and that dates back to the 1970's, systems going on sale in the 80's. The only downside is that they've since moved the manufacturing to China which raises a few questions...

I was planning on doing much the same as you, not replacing the hot water until later. But it just so happened that the hot water heater sprung a leak only a few weeks after the solar power went in so they both ended up being done around the same time (12 weeks apart).

One reason you might consider doing the hot water sooner is to beat the end of the $1000 rebate for solar HWS. But then, others would argue that prices would probably fall anyway without the rebate thus offsetting any real benefit of getting in early.

As for the existing water heater, if it is a conventional mains pressure vitreous enamel unit (Rheem, Dux etc) then replacing the sacrificial anode will greatly extend its life through prevention of corrosion (yes I did mine when I moved into the house, but it was too late with the tank already very badly rusted).

 

[Smurf1976]

The Evap is indeed West of the proposed area, and the only shade from 6am-9pm is from around 7pm where the shadow forms. If what you say is true about the sun being further north most of the year, this will alleviate that problem.

So in essense this isn't a deal breaker, just a reduction in effeciency for that part of the evening?

What location are you in? This affects what angle the sun will be at during different times of the year.

But assuming it's directly west of the panels and that the panels will be facing north, a bit of shade after 7pm is only going to cause a loss of a few % of annual power production so wouldn't be a major issue. Output tends to be low during the last hour or so of daylight anyway due to the angle of the sun relative to the solar panels at that time.

 

[inq]

Thanks for the info Smurf, FYI my location is Adelaide if that changes anything.

 

[RandR]

Dude! That's epic!
Is much from government contributions, or is it mostly the electricity price? Also, why not keep scaling this up? Also, regarding personal use, by your estimate is the area of a 'standard suburban' house's roof big enough to fit the cells required to power the contents of the house? Do you need much in the way for batteries for your installation, or does it just feed into the grid in the daytime?
Cheers

If you look at the section you qouted it contains the answers to most of the questions youve raised

- Its mostly the electricity price, government contributions were only really factored into the install. (as explained, by running through a seperate meter on the property to the house, we were able to achieve what is in effect, the price of the 'net feed' in tariff, at a gross tariff rate of production.)
- You cannot keep scaling up, because 30kw of power is as much as you can put on a 3 - phase line (3 phase is 10kwx3) and once you go past 30kw you are paid a commercial rate.
- each house and roof is entirely different (mostly) i cant give you an answer on a 'standard suburban roof'. But i think most standard households should be covered by about a 3kw system.
- there are deninitly no batteries ... because batteries are entirely innefficient ... all power is fed straight to grid.

 

[RandR]

Be warned - there's an awful lot of dud heat pumps and dud installers out there.

If they recommend running on peak tariff then Smurf recommends that you also do some running - well away from that supplier and/or product.

Usage will determine which tariff is most appropriate for a heat pump, but in a domestic situation it should be an off-peak tariff almost always. To do otherwise defeats the financial benefit of installing the heat pump in the first place.

In Qld, most will be best on Tarff 33 but if your usage is lower then 31 should be fine. I'd suggest leaving it on 31, assuming that is already installed for the existing hot water, unless there's a proven need to change.

In regard to heat pump brands, let's just say that if it has a booster element then that's not a sign of good design. If we can heat houses and hot water with heat pumps in the middle of the night in Winter here in Tassie with no booster, then you sure don't need a booster in most parts of Australia.

I have no association with the company, but I'll put a good word in for the Siddons Solarstream heat pump water heater. It's far better than the big name heat pumps in my opinion. It works fine at zero degrees with no booster, and a Google search will turn up plenty of praise without the horror stories associated with Rheem and Dux heat pumps.

The Siddons tank is stainless steel and made in Australia, compressor is Japanese. And being a split system design, you can still have the tank under the house, in the garage etc if you want to. It doesn't have as much fancy electronics as some of the big name brands which is a good thing - it's those fancy control systems that seem to cause rather a lot of trouble with breakdowns.

Whether or not you're better off with a heat pump or some other solar water heater is very site and location specific.

All good advice smurf ... except not neccesarily the bit i have bolded.

This is because as a plumber, if called to a property to fix a hot water system, if that system is a heat pump and the refrigeration component is malfunctioning, my options to fixing the system are quite limited, because im not a refrigeration mechanic, i do not carry tools, equipment, nor have the legal right as a licensed tradesperson to work on a heat pumps refrigeration system.

So having a back up booster element is quite a benefit, as it enables a plumber to disengage the heat pump, and enable the customer to have hot water in the time before they or I can arrange for a friggie to inspect the system.

 

[Smurf1976]

All good advice smurf ... except not neccesarily the bit i have bolded.

This is because as a plumber, if called to a property to fix a hot water system, if that system is a heat pump and the refrigeration component is malfunctioning, my options to fixing the system are quite limited, because im not a refrigeration mechanic, i do not carry tools, equipment, nor have the legal right as a licensed tradesperson to work on a heat pumps refrigeration system.

So having a back up booster element is quite a benefit

I'll agree there is that benefit...

But if the element is being used on a regular basis then that's not a good sign. If one manufacturer can heat water with a heat pump and still achieve decent efficiency when there is snow on the ground, yet another thinks you need a booster in Brisbane that will actually be used quite often, then something is clearly wrong with the design of the latter.

 

[Lantern]

I have a 305L solar hot water system., and also a 3.7kW solar grid feed system running through a SMA 3.8kW inverter.

I was lucky to get in whilst the 60c NSW FIT was still operating.
A scheme just too good to miss.

The next reading will be the first with the system connected for the whole duration of the bill.

 

[Logique]

The Qs I'm trying to work through are:
- what % savings are people getting on their bills
- is it important whether the panels are Sharp brand or something else, also made in China
- anyone having trouble getting their power utility to come out and install a new meter

 

[Calliope]

The Qs I'm trying to work through are:
- what % savings are people getting on their bills
- is it important whether the panels are Sharp brand or something else, also made in China
- anyone having trouble getting their power utility to come out and install a new meter

For some reason someone started another thread on solar panels yesterday. The information you seek may be there.

 

[DB008]

My Dad's place up in Brisbane.
3.0 kw System. Cost around 6k (for everything, including rebates).
16 panels, split, 2 groups of 8 (restricted roof space).
Inverter in picture too, picture taken around 11AM

 

[drsmith]

My Dad's place up in Brisbane.
3.0 kw System.

How has he gone with that inverter when it's generating a reasonable amount (say, 1kW+) and AM radio interference ?

I've got the same type of inverter (Solarlord 1.5kW, box, display, connections look otherwise identical) which sends out a signal that obliterates AM radio stations above about 900W.

That's a good price for 3kW bearing in mind the solar panel rebate structure. I paid $2.4k for 1.5kW in late March, system installed at the end of June.

In WA, the government has cut the feed in tariff off at the knees for new applicants. This is after reducing it in May.

http://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.a...?ItemId=142552&minister=Collier&admin=Barnett

 

[DB008]

Hey drsmith,
I will have to ask, but since he has an iPod (full of music) and listens to Jazz CD's (which he has lots of), I honestly don't think that he listens to AM anymore...

 

[pixel]

The Qs I'm trying to work through are:
- what % savings are people getting on their bills
- is it important whether the panels are Sharp brand or something else, also made in China
- anyone having trouble getting their power utility to come out and install a new meter

No problem with Western Power installing the two-way meter; we had ours connected within 2 weeks - that was almost 2 years ago. Recently, neighbours decided to install smaller systems, and their meters were installed the same week.

As regards savings: A 300 litre solar hot water system (formerly Rheem electric) plus now 2KW Solar panels had an unexpected savings effect for us. The first 2-month period resulted in a Credit of $50 as opposed to a $250 bill two years ago; the next period, which included more use of heating (electric, RC aircon) came out with a $5.15 charge, compared to $280 pcp.
As we were among the first to take up the 40c FIT offer - which has now been scrapped completely - our P/L account will obviously differ from others. The downside for us: We paid obviously a higher price than is now being charged for comparable systems.

 

[pilots]

We have a new way of ripping of the power, if you have solar panels, and you are getting more for your power from them, than you get from the grid, all you have to do is get a battery charger wired up to your solar panels, at night you turn on the battery charger.
Good one Labour.

 

[sptrawler]

How has he gone with that inverter when it's generating a reasonable amount (say, 1kW+) and AM radio interference ?

I've got the same type of inverter (Solarlord 1.5kW, box, display, connections look otherwise identical) which sends out a signal that obliterates AM radio stations [/url]

Do you still listen to steam driven radio Doc? LOL

 

[sptrawler]

Do you still listen to steam driven radio Doc? LOL

Actually Doc, I'm only joking a.m has the only informative broadcast. However in Perth I find the tunning drift and static terrible.

 

[Smurf1976]

Stage 3 of my solar power system, adding a complete new 1.52 KW string on the NE roof face, will be a goer soon as I'm about to order the equipment.

 

[drsmith]

Actually Doc, I'm only joking a.m has the only informative broadcast. However in Perth I find the tunning drift and static terrible.

I can't live without my daily dose of Howard Sattler.........

Only joking..........

Really, honestly, and for true.