Crocodile Hunter Killed by Stingray

[visual]

Hi 2020...dignity?
I understand everyone identifying with Steve and Terry and Bindy and Bob, they were in your face all the time, and he was a woderful ambassador for Oz...
I think what I'm trying to say is put it in perspective, take into account his type of work, you can't say you are too shocked and surprised he died the way he did...ditto for Brock.
I respected him enormously and feel sad for the kids and Terry...but....

What about the 1000,000's of kids with no family, no home, no nothing, who wake up every day to struggle to keep themselves fed and warm, all by themselves with no one to bury their dead mothers, fathers and siblings. What about the ones who crawl off to die alone, or the ones left maimed and greivously wounded. Think of just one country right now being bombed and shot to bits, and then think of the kids and woman who are innocents in it all. And yes the fathers too.
The amount of people paying for trips to Australia Zoo, paying for flowers, all red eyed and depressed.....most of them wouldn't think of sponsoring a kid in a third world country or supporting Amnesty International or funding a cot programme over in Botswana.
You don't even have to look that far, try our own back-yard. I'm sure you read the news papers, people die tragically all the time.
All I'm saying is get a perspective.

So if you mean by 'dignity' that we shouldn't post how we feel about this and only write sob sob posts on this subject maybe you should have posted a thread titled "Everyone who wants to talk about their allegedly sad feelings on Steve Irwin....." Then you wouldn't have to read this.

Cheerful

Nelly,
those kids you are taliking about and all,lack exactly the leadership that Steve Irwin displayed towards what he believed in and towards his family,
people are sad for him and his family because he was such a good leader and person,not because he brought havoc on his community or enviroment.
Surely if people have nothing good to say about good people they should really say nothing at all,after all isn`t that a sign of civilization and what distingushes us from those who would inflict harm on others.

 

[nelly]

Nelly,
those kids you are taliking about and all,lack exactly the leadership that Steve Irwin displayed towards what he believed in and towards his family,
people are sad for him and his family because he was such a good leader and person,not because he brought havoc on his community or enviroment.
Surely if people have nothing good to say about good people they should really say nothing at all,after all isn`t that a sign of civilization and what distingushes us from those who would inflict harm on others.

Hi visual...huh...???
You'd tell people who have lost a loved one that 'they don't show leadership qualities,' and that 'they don't beleive in their families,' and that they brought havoc on their communities or environment.????
I really don't think you understood my post at all. Did I say Steve Irwin wasn't a good person???? I don't really know because I didn't know him!!!!!!
Just like I've never met any war torn refugees or orphans or met all the unfortunate souls out there but I still 'feel' for them, and because of that I do the best with what I have and put my money where my bleeding heart should be.
"Inflict harm on others."????? [ I suppose you are referring to all the two year olds loading those guns over in Lebanon/Israel and soon to be Iran]
What I call a 'civilisation' is one where the more fortunate help up the less fortunate.

So as far as Irwin being a 'good' man...he probably was heck I don't know.
Am I sad he died...I suppose so. [ He lived his life the way he wanted to.]
I feel more for the family he left behind...and maybe if he thought more about them he might have taken it easier...I don't know.
It's not really for me to say, after all I didn't know the man.

P.S. I felt more deeply for Sophie and her family [the terrifying experience she must have gone through before she died.] And I didn't know her either.

Nelly

 

[visual]

Nelly,
re read your post,you make some fanciful claims almost as if you personally can speak from experience and yet you claim you dont.
Althought you also dont know Steve Irwin you seem to think that you can speak about him as if you knew him yet you say you dont,hmmm

People feel sad for him because he represented something good,also he achieved things that other people talk about and thats all.

 

[2020hindsight]

Hi 2020...dignity?
I understand everyone identifying with Steve and Terry and Bindy and Bob, they were in your face all the time, and he was a woderful ambassador for Oz......I respected him enormously and feel sad for the kids and Terry...but....

What about the 1000,000's of kids with no family, no home, no nothing, ....
The amount of people paying for trips to Australia Zoo, paying for flowers, all red eyed and depressed.....most of them wouldn't think of sponsoring a kid in a third world country ....So if you mean by 'dignity' that we shouldn't post how we feel about this and only write sob sob posts on this subject maybe you should have posted a thread titled "Everyone who wants to talk about their allegedly sad feelings on Steve Irwin....." Then you wouldn't have to read this. Cheerful

Nelly, sure there are plenty of cases of fatherless kids - I was one way back - be all that as it may be - and by the way our family does sponsor a kid in Africa - if you would just ask the moderator to delete your post about "so you weren't cut to pieces over his death" or kennas reference to the "crocodile lunatic" - then we could all move on without further risk of your being misunderstood, or (worst of all) those statements being read by an 8 year old angel - or her mother struggling to come to terms with a freakish acident that has robbed them of a great man - not just a good one , a great one who did more away from the cameras than he did in front of them - they don't need to read such insensitive and arguably nasty stuff as some of these recent posts - what do you think?.
PS maybe treat Kerri as a person entitled to be depressed, and all that that implies in the way of the empathy expressed on another lead around here somewhere.

 

[nelly]

Hi y'all

I've obviously ruffled a few feathers....
I'm sure if you knew me you would take my comments in a different light...
Lotsa my friends have made the comment I can come off sounding like a mean be-atch......until they got to know me.
As thats not going to happen so be it.
But I'm not gonna stop being honest to appease sensibilties.

Cheerful [have a great day]
p.s. the net is an expresionless environment at best.

 

[Julia]

Nelly,
those kids you are taliking about and all,lack exactly the leadership that Steve Irwin displayed towards what he believed in and towards his family,
people are sad for him and his family because he was such a good leader and person,not because he brought havoc on his community or enviroment.
Surely if people have nothing good to say about good people they should really say nothing at all,after all isn`t that a sign of civilization and what distingushes us from those who would inflict harm on others.

So Visual, "if people have nothing good to say about good people they should really say nothing at all....."?

What, then, is the point of a discussion? Everyone will just agree with everyone else and there simply is no discussion.

I think Nelly has made some good points. All this semi-hysterical outpouring of grief for Terri and her children has become rather excessive. It seemed to me that Nelly was attempting to strike some sort of balance with a reminder of all the kids who have never had a father to love them, or worse had one who abused them. And the millions of women who bring up children on their own with not a fraction of the support, personal and financial, which will be available to Terri Irwin.

Sure, Steve Irwin struck a real chord with those who like to think of Australian blokes as Ocker-accented larrikins. That's one type of Australian. But I can't help wondering if the same sort of fuss would be made if, e.g. Ian Frazer unexpectedly died? Frankly I doubt it.

A 'freak accident" has been referred to. I suppose it was. I don't know anything about stingrays. But remember, Irwin spent his entire life handling dangerous creatures and taking risks with them. Is it really so surprising that one of them killed him?

I realise I will cop some flak for this post since I appear not to be joining in the mass mourning for Steve Irwin. I'm not making any comment about him as a person. I can't. I didn't know him.

I'm just suggesting a sense of proportion might be appropriate and Nelly's post provided that imo.

Julia

PS Visual, your comment about not saying anything if you can't say something good takes us back to the era where children were expected to "be seen and not heard"!

 

[nelly]

thank you Julia that is exactly what i was trying to say....
cheerful [at work on someone elses 'puter]

 

[visual]

Julia,
if you read Nelly`s post,he was making it personal,how can one family`s grief be minimised to maximise someone elses grief?
And as for your last comment surely you jest!

 

[Prospector]

Julia, your post is exactly the way I feel too!

I feel deeply deeply sorry for The Irwin family who are left behind. I heard Terri say that Bob said he wanted to get sick, so he could join his Daddy in heaven!

And I think that we will miss Steve Irwin just because he was a real Australian Identity. But I never wanted to aspire to be like him, nor do I think that he captures the spirit of what makes Australia great.

However, he probably did capture what other people (eg the Americans) think makes Australia great! But should others be our yardstick for self-esteem - nope!

I have often wondered would Steve Irwin have been so popular in Australia if he had not appealed to the US. Certainly in South Australia his death has been acknowledged but not really much more than that!

As a family we have discussed why his death has created so much impact and we all think that it is very much media driven, there is so much media available about him, his death was even filmed, so the media has to use these resources to the maximum extent.

In the same week that Steve Irwin died, a very worthwhile South Australian also died - Colin Thiele who was a children's author (Storm Boy) and who worked extensively with youth. Did that even make a headline elsewhere?

 

[nelly]

Julia,
if you read Nelly`s post,he was making it personal,how can one family`s grief be minimised to maximise someone elses grief?
And as for your last comment surely you jest!

if i'm not mistaken thats what you implied visual and if you'd bothered finding out who you were havin a go at you'd know it is miss not mr
cheerfully female :

 

[Julia]

Julia,
if you read Nelly`s post,he was making it personal,how can one family`s grief be minimised to maximise someone elses grief?
And as for your last comment surely you jest!

No, Visual. I do not jest as you so quaintly put it. The suggestion that if we can't say something "nice" we should refrain from commenting does in fact come from the same social sensibility as the dictum that children should not express their opinions about anything.

Hopefully, you now realise Nelly is a woman, not that that makes any difference to the content of her post.

Sorry, but I can't really make sense of your comment about one family's grief being minimised to maximise someone else's grief. You seem to have missed the point I was trying to make. I wasn't attempting to quantify anyone's grief. What I was trying to do was restore some sense of proportion to the whole Irwin media frenzy.

Julia

 

[justjohn]

Thanks girls for hijacking this thread to ram down our throats your social issues. I thought the fellas can ramp but you girls are non stop. WHY are you wasting your time on the ASF when theres is so much work to be done in our cruel harsh world of fatherless children, broken families, poverty blah.......blah............blah..........blah........or as they say ladies GET A TV :

 

[visual]

Post 128 was in reference to what Nelly was saying,so she is a woman,so what? :
Julia you`ve completely missed what I wanted to say.
Seems to me that if one loved child loses his dad whether rich or poor or in a war situation or not the important thing is the relatioship thats broken.Not the geographical location.
At the end of the day Nelly and Kennas were being rude,and thats offensive whether the person is dead or alive.He achieved a lot,he loved his family he did what he said, what the hell more do people want,in this case I think the tall poppy syndrome is alive and well.Sure we all have a right to say what we want but why be nasty about someone who can no longer defend himself.Don`t get it .

 

[2020hindsight]

....In the same week that Steve Irwin died, a very worthwhile South Australian also died - Colin Thiele who was a children's author (Storm Boy) and who worked extensively with youth. Did that even make a headline elsewhere?

Prospector, you're right - to a degree. Id never heard of him (though I recall Storm Boy) - found this on the internet ... "Colin Thiele was born in Eudunda, South Australia, in 1920. ... Colin Thiele has published almost 80 books in various fields including poetry, prose, ..." Heck if he's half the poet that Adam Lindsay Gordon was (also SA originally), he can't be all bad. ("Life is mostly froth and bubble, two things stand like stone - kindness in another's trouble courage in your own")

But there's at least one difference - one was 44 the other almost twice that. Its the difference between burying a father - that's the way Buddha surely intended - and burying a son - assisted by his infant grandchildren. Steve's son in turn won't come close to understanding this for another twenty years, maybe more. You hit it on the head when you mentioned him talking about wanting to visit his dad in Heaven. I think a little bit of self censorship under these circumstances would be justified.

 

[nelly]

Thanks girls for hijacking this thread to ram down our throats your social issues. I thought the fellas can ramp but you girls are non stop. WHY are you wasting your time on the ASF when theres is so much work to be done in our cruel harsh world of fatherless children, broken families, poverty blah.......blah............blah..........blah........or as they say ladies GET A TV :

Oh....ok, I'll leave it to you fella's.....

Post 128 was in reference to what Nelly was saying,so she is a woman,so what?

It doesn't make a difference in the slightest if I'm a woman...just wanted to clarify.

Julia you`ve completely missed what I wanted to say.

Ditto for you visual..

Cheerful :

 

[Julia]

Oh....ok, I'll leave it to you fella's.....

Post 128 was in reference to what Nelly was saying,so she is a woman,so what?

It doesn't make a difference in the slightest if I'm a woman...just wanted to clarify.

Julia you`ve completely missed what I wanted to say.

Ditto for you visual..

Cheerful :

Nelly, I'm a bit confused here. In your Post 172 you said

thank you Julia that is exactly what i was trying to say....
cheerful

And now you say I've completely missed what you wanted to say, as has Visual. Perhaps you can clarify what you did want to say?

Julia

 

[Bearman52]

"Irwin media frenzy"
Julia you nailed it !! no kids being eaten by cannibals ,no blokes stuck down mineshafts,no politicians being assasinated (damn) I don't think I've seen so much maudlin c#@p in years.
And by the way I thought that this was a trading site??? :
BM

 

[Prospector]

General chat = whatever you want!

 

[nelly]

Nelly, I'm a bit confused here. In your Post 172 you said

thank you Julia that is exactly what i was trying to say....
cheerful

And now you say I've completely missed what you wanted to say, as has Visual. Perhaps you can clarify what you did want to say?

Julia

My mistake Julia...re-read my post and realised it sounded wonky...I didn't do the quote thingee That bit about "julia you completely misread what I wanted to say" was supposed to be a quote from visual....sorry.
Just to clarify for last time [4 whoever cares]
I am sad Irwin died............I realise we have lost an exceptional person in that he helped the tourist trade etc I feel sad for his family......
But I think we should put it all into the big picture, so to speak. Prospector and Julia said it very well.....there are a lot of other well deserving people out there passing away with little or no recognition, compared to the hype surrounding Irwin's death.
This is general chat isn't it....?

 

[barney]

My mistake Julia...re-read my post and realised it sounded wonky...I didn't do the quote thingee That bit about "julia you completely misread what I wanted to say" was supposed to be a quote from visual....sorry.
Just to clarify for last time [4 whoever cares]
I am sad Irwin died............I realise we have lost an exceptional person in that he helped the tourist trade etc I feel sad for his family......
But I think we should put it all into the big picture, so to speak. Prospector and Julia said it very well.....there are a lot of other well deserving people out there passing away with little or no recognition, compared to the hype surrounding Irwin's death.
This is general chat isn't it....?

Amen! Now that's the real Nelly! Goodonya....Barney