CMC Markets vs. Bell Direct - New online trading a/c

[titl4]

...................

There was talk that IB will be able to offer CHESS sponsorship on ASX equities by the end of this year.

I also heard that some months ago (without the action date) but I can't find anything 'official' to support the information. The pricing would be interesting if it happens but it might also force some platform changes on the locals .

 

[SaberX]

The ASX page re: CHESS

http://203.15.147.66/products/shares/how/how_settlement_works.htm

There was talk that IB will be able to offer CHESS sponsorship on ASX equities by the end of this year.

Hmm what is with that link? With an ip address at the front it doesn't appear ASX related (which should be http://www.asx..... etc etc). Not to mention my antivirus went straight off and blocked something malicious via the link. So I'd advise caution to others and to yourself glenn_r in the case that link may have infected you.

THat said, the info on the page, if legit does put some light on things. SO i guess essentially CHESS Sponsorship for a broker just means they can use CHESS , and therefore as CHESS deals with transfership of your legal ownership/owner title between two parties, we'll be all safe if our broker falls apart the very next day?

THat said would there be/why would there be brokers who aren't CHESS sponsored? In that scenario how would legal ownership/transfer of shares between parties be officially/legally recognised?

 

[tahpot]

I have trading accounts with Comsec, Netwealth, Interactive Brokers, CMC Markets (Stockbroking), Trader Dealer and Bell Direct.

Here are my thoughts:

Comsec & Netwealth: Free live data on refresh, crap platform

Comsec: Expensive

Netwealth: $17.99 minimum / trade

IB: Cheap, but not shares, they only offer CFDs so there is third party risk (I hear they are looking to offer shares in the future)
Bell Direct: Cheap for shares ($15.00), not a horrible platform, but nothing special. Biggest concern is they force you into their own cash account product that isn't protected if they go under - ie: you will likely lose all your money!

Trader Dealer: Good pricing if you day trade (19.95 per contract on each side of the market up to around $200k I think.) Interesting platform, I haven't traded on it yet, but they have built it themselves. Looks basic, but could become quite good if they keep improving it. Tries to emulate a desktop platform in a browser. You have a choice of 3 bank accounts to hold your cash (one of which is Macquarie), so your money should be safe and covered by the govt. guarantee.

CMC Markets: 9.90 minimum / trade. I have previously built a web-platform for an Australian CFD provider and am very impressed with the CMC platform - it is the best I've seen. Cash account is a Bankwest account so your money is safe. Shares are in your name so they are safe.
CMC have a very bad reputation as a CFD provider (which is warranted), however it is very difficult to fault their share offering product. This may be because they purchased it outright a couple of years ago.
Market data is $10 / month for refresh, standard ASX rates for live, which updates live in the browser, shows you your orders and can expand every depth level.

Hope that helps!

 

[titl4]

............
CMC Markets: ........... Cash account is a Bankwest account so your money is safe. .............

This thread has got me curious about CMC. I've had a look and from what I've seen it seems good to me.

I'm not so convinced about the government guarantee applying as according to the blurb "your CMC Markets Cash Account held with Bankwest" and elsewhere that CMC manage the account. Such statements suggest its an account with Bankwest, owned and operated by CMC, but with the client (us that is) as the account name. Lack of identification needed to open an account (no 100 point check) supports this.

All this may not matter for much longer as I seem to remember that the government guarantee was a temporary measure for the GFC.

 

[lenny]

Hi titl4, I have previously traded with comsec,nab,first prudential,e-trade
and i am happy with what i have seen atm compared to the above brokers, Simple but effective.

As for openring an account i was required to send them a 100 points of certified identification after i completed my online application.

Lenny

 

[cogs]

Hope you have read the PDS on all these operators.

CMC:
A CFD is not traded on an exchange. This means
it is an over-the-counter (‘OTC’) product, and
you are trading with CMC Markets as the
counterparty to all transactions you undertake.

Nothing new about this but you need to know how OTC operators work.

Commsec although very illiquid, poor operating hrs, limited markets and awkward platform, you are going long or short against another trader on CFD's or shares, not necessarily always against a market maker..

 

[lenny]

Cogs, This thread is not about CFD's, Its discussing cmc markets share broking division compared with Bell direct which is also a share broker.


Lenny

 

[tahpot]

This thread has got me curious about CMC. I've had a look and from what I've seen it seems good to me.

I'm not so convinced about the government guarantee applying as according to the blurb "your CMC Markets Cash Account held with Bankwest" and elsewhere that CMC manage the account. Such statements suggest its an account with Bankwest, owned and operated by CMC, but with the client (us that is) as the account name. Lack of identification needed to open an account (no 100 point check) supports this.

All this may not matter for much longer as I seem to remember that the government guarantee was a temporary measure for the GFC.

Read the PDS and FSG, it specifically states that it is covered by the Government guarantee.

 

[cogs]

Apologies lenny.

Still recommend reading the PDS, but that's up to you.

 

[titl4]

Hi titl4, I have previously traded with comsec,nab,first prudential,e-trade
and i am happy with what i have seen atm compared to the above brokers, Simple but effective.

As for openring an account i was required to send them a 100 points of certified identification after i completed my online application.

Lenny

Hi Lenny

I don't have an issue with CMC. I have no reason to suspect that they will fail or be less than correct in their dealings. My concerns were more related to other comments here that such accounts were totally 'safe'.

:error: I also stand corrected by others with more knowledge re the government guarantee on these accounts. My reference to the '100 points' was based on CMC's banner
"You can apply online in minutes. Your driver’s licence may be all we need to verify your identity and give you immediate access to the platform" but that is probably a bit of hype and only for 'demo' access.

Its just my opinion but I don't believe any account is 100% safe where - in CMC's words -

"Authorised Operator means the Broker, and any other officer or employee of the Broker, authorised and nominated in writing to us by the Broker, to have access to and operate the account. Broker means the stockbroker you have authorised to open and operate your account on your behalf."
and -
"Withdrawals can only be made electronically by your Broker (including on closure of the account)"
as any adverse action by 'your broker' (agent?) is not going to be insured by the government guarantee.

But - as I said I see no reason to not invest through CMC while accepting that, as in most things, a small residual risk exists. Accounts such as these are after all not unusual.

I might yet end up as a client - I just don't have enough reason to move.

Cheers ....... Alan

 

[tahpot]

My reference to the '100 points' was based on CMC's banner
"You can apply online in minutes. Your driver’s licence may be all we need to verify your identity and give you immediate access to the platform" but that is probably a bit of hype and only for 'demo' access.

No, that is correct for a full account. A certified copy of a drivers licence is the minimum AML requirements for individuals.

"Authorised Operator means the Broker, and any other officer or employee of the Broker, authorised and nominated in writing to us by the Broker, to have access to and operate the account. Broker means the stockbroker you have authorised to open and operate your account on your behalf."
and -
"Withdrawals can only be made electronically by your Broker (including on closure of the account)"
as any adverse action by 'your broker' (agent?) is not going to be insured by the government guarantee.

The above text you have quoted is standard in all broker PDS documents and is necessary for them to provide automated trading capabilities. Your main risk is associated with fraud on CMC's behalf and that would be a criminal offence (among other things) as occured at Sonray. In that case however, you may have access to the ASX insurance fund.

 

[Chesty]

I recently applied online with CMC. Scanned and emailed all of the documentation they required. Haven't heard **** from them. Sent another email, 2 days ago asking what's going on, still nothing. All of this after following a spam from Aussie Stock Forums about $9.90 brokerage.

Should I phone them ? or go with another broker ? I currently have an account with Halifax but they are in bed with someone who I don't like.



Cheers

 

[tahpot]

I'd give them a call. I phoned them two days after posting my application and I was given access to the platform straight away and was trading the following day once $ has cleared.

 

[lamclennan]

I have bell direct. However, CMC Markets is good. Conditional orders are a little more basic though.

 

[burglar]

Guys, You have failed to convince me to go to either CMC or BellDirect.
But let it be known that ETrade has reduced from $29.95 to $19.95
and Commsec has it's beaut Birthday Offer.
Also Netwealth is surveying its members re customer satisfaction (first time in a decade)

Something has put the wind up 'em.

Apologies to Lenny if this is ever so slightly off topic

 

[bbon]

For people who are thinking about going with Bell direct: if you are an RAC member, they give you $200 and every 10th trade for free, so make sure to sign up through the 'rac member form'.

 

[yanni]

hi everyone. i just signed up to the forum a few days ago and have been busy reading all the great information going around. im new to online trading and so am trying to get as much infomation and knowledge as i can.

at the moment i havent opened an account as ive been trying to decide who to open it with. after reading this im leaning towards belldirect (although i was a bit worried regarding what i read about losing money if they go under). What about Etrade? this seems to always pop up in google when i search.

i also wanted to know how much money is needed to start up? i assume you open an account and transfer money from existing bank account. whats the minimum start up amount required?

thanks for your help

 

[yanni]

and i was reading bell directs terms and conditions. said something about only taking orders between 10am and 4pm. what does this mean? basically, i work full time and want to trade as well to hopefully generate extra income/capital. so ill be doing out of work hours. should i trade in foreign markets? that will be open when aus is closed, ie nights as i need to trade out of work hours

 

[yanni]

and would you suggest staying with the free account or upgrading to silver for just $10 per month


https://www.belldirect.com.au/TradeNow/tradingstyle/

 

[Slipperz]

I have been using bell direct for a couple of years and they are excellent.

Minimum buy is 500 dollars but you can do little sell orders under that when you make a profit.

Pay the 10 dollars a month so you get live market data.

The cost per trade is low and conditional orders are free.

So for example if you buy 5 000 dollars worth of share x for 1.00 and it goes to 1.05 you have made a 250 dollar profit.

You could then sell say 250 of said shares and then transfer the cash back to your bank account. Less the $30 dollar cost of trade the rest is money for jam.

I do a lot of this in and out of stocks all the time for a bit of supplemental using bell direct whilst I use commsec for my SMSF where I trade less frequently in larger amounts.