China a Failed State and a Rogue State to the rest of the World

IFocus said:

Exactly, US puppet while being bent over...tariffs !

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we can thank old Gough and Bob for putting us in to this postion

IFocus said:

Exactly, US puppet while being bent over...tariffs !

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Are you two claiming this was in "the Chinese Seas". Not sure why. All we know is that it was in the South China Sea that about 10 countries claim to own part of. What we've been told is that it was in 'international airspace'. We're supporting international laws. I'm sure we're monitoring Chinese military vessels at the same time outside of Nth Korean cargo vessels, but it doesn't warrant a fighter jet putting flairs in front of a surveillance aircraft over international waters. I'm really confused as to how this is an Australian caused problem.

qldfrog said:

... our navy as loyal lackeys are playing chicken with the Chinese on contested areas and islands.

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Why the hell do you think we're contesting them qldfrog? Is it because they are not CCP owned assets and the CPP's diplomatic modus operandi is thuggery? They draw their stupid 9 dash line in international waters and expect the world to obey it? Your apologist attitude to this aggressive totalitarian state is strange considering you are quite a pleasant moist amphibian generally

finicky said:

Why the hell do you think we're contesting them qldfrog? Is it because they are not CCP owned assets and the CPP's diplomatic modus operandi is thuggery? They draw their stupid 9 dash line in international waters and expect the world to obey it? Your apologist attitude to this aggressive totalitarian state is strange considering you are quite a pleasant moist amphibian generally

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Australia needs a wake up call as to its actual position in the world.
We are a fly playing in a bears and lions arena, moreover we willingly fully embedded our economy with China, down to even food supplies
If we could at least be realistic and have a clear position.
All the money spent playing second rate GI Joe vs China would be better spent getting a bit more independence from China economically .
We had a taste of our irrelevance during covid, and i have a feeling we went even further down since, isn't it saline solution and still antibiotics that are in shortage now?
Saline solution...hardly more than sterile salted water...
Should we mention petrol reserves
Or all these green energy grid supplies,?
So let's keep Australia safe(r) first..

We're not nothing and we have allies. You are new here. We're not safer by not pulling on our oar with our allies. We've always done that. We're not New Zealand. The French tossed in the towel early in WW2, lol, and formed a Quisling government. China is a ruthless adversary that will walk all over weakness and appeasement.

finicky said:

We're not nothing and we have allies. You are new here. We're not safer by not pulling on our oar with our allies. We've always done that. We're not New Zealand. The French tossed in the towel early in WW2, lol, and formed a Quisling government. China is a ruthless adversary that will walk all over weakness and appeasement.

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The Yanks didn't necessarily come here to protect Australia, they came here because it was a geographical strategy. They couldn't fly a plane directly to the South Pacific without refuelling in those days and being vulnerable. Aussies WW11 veterans hated the Yanks, they fought like hell against each other, look up 'The Battle of Brisbane". I was lucky enough to meet people who served in WW11 when I was a kid, my Auntie used to take them in and care for them and they all told the same story.

I didn't want to get involved in this tittle tatt but the truth matters here.

finicky said:

We're not nothing and we have allies. You are new here. We're not safer by not pulling on our oar with our allies. We've always done that. We're not New Zealand. The French tossed in the towel early in WW2, lol, and formed a Quisling government. China is a ruthless adversary that will walk all over weakness and appeasement.

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I wish we were NZ, w/o Jacinta of course ...
(For your information after the irrelevant snipe and because urban legends are truly alive and the victors draw history
France lost 217,600 military personnel in World War II.
Nearly all of them in the first couple of months in 1940 during the actual invasion
So yes they were beaten flat ,charging panzers with horses and bombarded by planes they did not have but as opposed to the British view of non fighting gutless french troops, reality was different..
Feel free to check yourself if you do not believe me.
Per comparison, the Brits lost 383k military personnel on the whole wwii duration, inc Africa wars for a similar population.)
The question there is should an economic slave of China play tarzan with big toys against China, or should we not better try to sort our own mess, removing liabilities and dependences to be able to make independent decisions if need be.

TimeISmoney said:

.. but the truth matters here.

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You don't say. I don't really see see where the big disagreement is. I don't have to have met WW11 vets as my father and uncle served in that war to the great cost of my father. Not claiming any credit in that for myself.

You don't have to be lovey dovey to be allies, sure it was an alliance of mutual benefit.

The stuff about Yanks and Aussies hating each other in Brisbane is a trivial distraction and probably overblown to fill newpapers at the time. Incidents did happen - my daffy mother was a Brisbane girl and dated U.S servicemen and mentioned the animosity. She loved Americans and enjoyed a lovely war at the same time that my teenage father, whom she hadn't met yet, was a slave in a Japanese POW camp for four years after his ship was sunk in the fall of Singapore. Australians were/are a bit xenophobic and some boofheads I guess took offence at being outplayed in the 'dating' game by Americans who were exotic, had more finesse, and had heaps of money to spend. But that's a nothing burger, the issue is state alliances for mutual defense.
Also I am not a glib cynic, I tend to believe there are fraternal relations between the U.S and Oz.

Sorry for my crude sledge about France's surrender and the Vichy government @qldfrog, I was having a dig. There was a brave resistance, France was unprepared for Nazis.

*sledge

AI Overview

"Sledge" is an Australian slang term that means to verbally abuse or criticize someone. It's often used in a sporting context, especially in cricket.

Origin:

• The term "sledge" comes from the word "sledgehammer".
  
  
• It was first recorded in the mid-1970s in a cricketing context.
  
  
• The practice of sledging is as old as cricket itself.
  
  
• The term "sledge" is thought to have originated at Adelaide Oval during the Sheffield Shield competition in the 1960s.

How it's used:

• "Sledging" is an informal term for when a sports player insults another player during a game to make them angry.
  
  
• The goal of sledging is to mentally disintegrate the opponent, lol

finicky said:

Sorry for my crude sledge about France's surrender and the Vichy government @qldfrog, I was having a dig. There was a brave resistance, France was unprepared for Nazis.

*sledge

AI Overview

"Sledge" is an Australian slang term that means to verbally abuse or criticize someone. It's often used in a sporting context, especially in cricket.

Origin:

• The term "sledge" comes from the word "sledgehammer".
  
  
• It was first recorded in the mid-1970s in a cricketing context.
  
  
• The practice of sledging is as old as cricket itself.
  
  
• The term "sledge" is thought to have originated at Adelaide Oval during the Sheffield Shield competition in the 1960s.

How it's used:

• "Sledging" is an informal term for when a sports player insults another player during a game to make them angry.
  
  
• The goal of sledging is to mentally disintegrate the opponent, lol

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If it wasn't for the gutless PM of Britain at the time of believing Hitler and giving him carte blanche and the Americans lack of being involved in WWII then maybe the capitulation of several countries to the Nazis may never would have happened.

finicky said:

We're not nothing and we have allies. You are new here. We're not safer by not pulling on our oar with our allies. We've always done that. We're not New Zealand. The French tossed in the towel early in WW2, lol, and formed a Quisling government. China is a ruthless adversary that will walk all over weakness and appeasement.

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You must have strange nightmares using such language lol.

China is a country that has in all of its history never relied on military strength or conquest. Look - they just aren't good at it and don't like it. Everyone who has a brain knows this. They used gunpowder for fireworks rather than guns. They built walls rather than siege towers. They didn't even lifting a finger against Japan who basically r*ped their country and 100s of millions of people in WW2.

They have weaknesses and flaws but the utter huge miscalculations and misinformation from the American-led western media will have negative consequences for everyone in the west and China.

I will give a few examples:
- Saying China is this violent genocidal monster of a country is a such a gross miscalculation that one should take it as a joke. Since it is probably one of the SAFEST, most non-violent and non-confrontational nations if you could scale a nation up to their size. I would be scared to see how 1.4 billion Nigerians would be like. 1.4 billion Maoris. 1.4 billion Saudis. 1.4 billion Americans!
- Saying they care about conquest, have military ambitions rather than just wanting to trade and build their own wealth
- Saying they stole IP because... why? Their phones are supposed to look different to iPhones and Samsungs? Because they build things on the back of other inventions? That's like saying everyone who reads a book is a thief

Fact: the only threat China has is against the mega corporations that feel they are being under-cut from making mega profits. That's it.

Such gross miscalculations and "cozying" up instead with true nationalistic countries like India that have opposing cultures and standards of civilized behavior will bring huge problems for Australian society in the future MMW. In fact it already has to some degree. I doubt the China misinformation and corporate shilling is worth the slow degradation of Australian society and the global society.

joeno said:

Since it (China) is probably one of the SAFEST and most non-violent

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What planet are you on? The New York Times? Tell that to the Tibetans, the Uyghurs, Falun Gong, Protestant Christians, Hong Kong, any Chinese individual who steps out of line. You think an extreme surveillance state is non violent? Where to be accused of a crime is to be automatically guilty.Tell it to the Filipinos who are seeing their islands infested by 'fishing fleets'. Why the intense miltary build-up - for defense? You think Xi Jinping is a peacenik? What about unleashing Covid on the world from their bio warfare lab and not a faint gesture of contrition but a menacing attitude to governments that wanted accountability? Why are they pouring fentanyl into western countries? They've killed heaps of us.