CBA - Commonwealth Bank of Australia

[qldfrog]

There are a lot of hoops to jump through.

Also lets even mention the insane fees for converting one currency to another or paying by credit card overseas etc.

For example if you want to withdraw $50,000 in cash from a bank branch these days you need to give 48 hours notice. Most banks also have transaction limits for accounts on how much money you can send to another account in one transaction.

Also many banks in Australia put limits on sending money to crypto currency accounts.

Not to mention bank transfers are still often slow especially for larger amounts between different banks can still take 1 - 2 business days to clear which is completely unacceptable in the digital age. You are literally just moving numbers around in a software system its not like physical cash is being carted around so why should;d it take up to 2 business days?

If you want to move big amounts of money fast (it still takes hours though) you can do a wire transfer in Australia banks generally charge $30 or $35 for that. With Bitcoin and other cryptos you can do it much faster for a much smaller fee not to mention you are dealing with Austrac bull**** by sending crypto from one cold storage wallet to another.

Name one single way in which traditional banking is technologically superior for customers than crypto or enables them more freedom than Crypto?

With some big 4, more than 48h warning for $20k, and then you have to justify why you want the $20k..yours..in cash
When my neighbour, upset , replied to buy a second hand car, the teller told him..show me the ads..
He is swiss guy in his 70s, not exactly crook like and wanted the cash to bargain a machinery tractor lawn..big stuff
He exploded..as i would
The funny thing, the teller then told him: you are lying to us, we refuse your cash withdrawal...
I believe it is the same in all big banks

 

[Value Hunter]

With some big 4, more than 48h warning for $20k, and then you have to justify why you want the $20k..yours..in cash
When my neighbour, upset , replied to buy a second hand car, the teller told him..show me the ads..
He is swiss guy in his 70s, not exactly crook like and wanted the cash to bargain a machinery tractor lawn..big stuff
He exploded..as i would
The funny thing, the teller then told him: you are lying to us, we refuse your cash withdrawal...
I believe it is the same in all big banks

Trying to explain all this to guys like Value Collector is a lost cause. People like him will schill for the system to no end.

 

[qldfrog]

With some big 4, more than 48h warning for $20k, and then you have to justify why you want the $20k..yours..in cash
When my neighbour, upset , replied to buy a second hand car, the teller told him..show me the ads..
He is swiss guy in his 70s, not exactly crook like and wanted the cash to bargain a machinery tractor lawn..big stuff
He exploded..as i would
The funny thing, the teller then told him: you are lying to us, we refuse your cash withdrawal...
I believe it is the same in all big banks

And btw, make me pay $3, no issue from me, if i can withdraw my own money freely .
CBA or others, you do not really own your money .people have to realise this quickly before **** happens...

 

[eskys]

...and let's unruffle some feathers, and stroke in the right direction

how charming it is to see the two Value prepositions hijacking another thread with their inane point-scoring nonsense.

 

[qldfrog]

...and let's unruffle some feathers, and stroke in the right direction

Mr @Dona Ferentes is quite a pro in this domain
As they say in the US: " no offence but.."

 

[eskys]

So, is a pro a fortune teller? He can see the future? Any other different opinions or thoughts are not valid?

Mr @Dona Ferentes is quite a pro in this domain
As they say in the US: " no offence but.."

 

[Bellcose]

you do not really own your money

Ha. I haven't considered it actual money for ages. Just a digitised advice as to how much the bank owes you. Just had a look at one of them I use. $100k daily limit, unlimited BPay. It doesn't have any physical branches nor does it transact in cash or cheques though.

 

[qldfrog]

Ha. I haven't considered it actual money for ages. Just a digitised advice as to how much the bank owes you. Just had a look at one of them I use. $100k daily limit, unlimited BPay. It doesn't have any physical branches nor does it transact in cash or cheques though.

If ok, can you pm me the bank?
CBA after 2 days on the phone is 100k etf, Million BPay or wire transfer with fees, delays..and justification..

 

[Value Collector]

For example if you want to withdraw $50,000 in cash from a bank branch these days you need to give 48 hours notice.

I think that has always been the case, and they would need an Armed guard to make a special trip to drop that off, but you don't think thats worth a $3 fee???

 

[Value Collector]

Name one single way in which traditional banking is technologically superior for customers than crypto or enables them more freedom than Crypto?

The banking eftpos machines / credit card transactions can process hundreds of thousands of transactions a minute bit coin can't do that, if you tried to get bit coin to replace eftpos transactions you could have wait times of hours to get the transactions processed, because bit coin can only process 420 transaction a minute globally. Master Card alone did 330,000 transactions per minute last year, at to that Visa, American Express and the billions of standard eftpos.

also, if I lose my banking login in details I can contact the bank and identify myself and gain access to my account, if you lose your Bitcoin log in details the coin can be lost forever apparently, there are many stories of people that have millions of bit coin that is now dead to them and the system.

 

[TimeISmoney]

With some big 4, more than 48h warning for $20k, and then you have to justify why you want the $20k..yours..in cash
When my neighbour, upset , replied to buy a second hand car, the teller told him..show me the ads..
He is swiss guy in his 70s, not exactly crook like and wanted the cash to bargain a machinery tractor lawn..big stuff
He exploded..as i would
The funny thing, the teller then told him: you are lying to us, we refuse your cash withdrawal...
I believe it is the same in all big banks

The answer to this is simple, it's always hookers and cocaine.

 

[Bellcose]

If ok, can you pm me the bank?
CBA after 2 days on the phone is 100k etf, Million BPay or wire transfer with fees, delays..and justification..

It's no secret. Macquarie. Check out its website to see if it's OK for you.

Funny thing all this discussion made me realise I have been in the digital fund world for 40 years at least. I worked for the Government (Boo Hiss) and as soon as it introduced in the late 1970's or thereabouts the ability to have pay made to your account rather than handle cash, I was all for it.

And in order to resolve the debate about fees, let's re-introduce the Bank Accounts Debit tax and the Financial Institutions Duty.

 

[Value Collector]

Financial Institutions Duty.

they did reintroduce that in 2017, they just call it the "Major Bank Levy" now, but its at the same amount 0.06% of deposits, and they are looking to raise it by 10%

for those that don't know, for every $1000 you hold in the bank, they government charges the bank $0.60 in tax per year, rising to $0.66 soon, its called the major bank levy, because only institutions with over $100 Billion of deposits pay it.

 

[Sharkman]

The banking eftpos machines / credit card transactions can process hundreds of thousands of transactions a minute bit coin can't do that, if you tried to get bit coin to replace eftpos transactions you could have wait times of hours to get the transactions processed, because bit coin can only process 420 transaction a minute globally. Master Card alone did 330,000 transactions per minute last year, at to that Visa, American Express and the billions of standard eftpos.

Crypto != (or <> if you prefer) bitcoin. Value Hunter mentioned the former, not the latter.

Bitcoin is just one form of crypto, albeit the largest and most well recognised. It's not meant for frequent transactions, these days it's more viewed as a store of value (digital gold, as some say).

There are other forms of crypto (such as Ethereum, Solana, or my preferred pick, Kaspa) that are more adapted for frequent transactions, those coins can (or will be able to, if future development goes to plan in the case of Ethereum) support thousands of transactions per second. Solana and Kaspa in particular have sub-1 cent transaction fees and transactions are settled within seconds. No matter where the sender and receiver are. I have used both and the first time I transacted in those blockchains it was an eye opening experience to see how quickly and seamlessly it all happens compared to moving fiat. I sign the transaction using my self custodial wallet, and by the time I open up a browser window and navigate to the blockchain explorer to check it, it's already there.

So what some crypto users do is hold the bulk of their digital net worth in the form of bitcoin, put it in cold storage for safekeeping, then periodically do a Defi swap to a high throughput coin like Solana, and use that for frequent transactions to take advantage of the sub-1 cent fees and sub-1 minute transaction settlement times.

For the record, I consider myself a crypto enthusiast, but not a crypto fanatic. I'm treating it as a highly speculative component of a core-satellite portfolio and have only put 1% of my net worth into it (though it currently sits at about 1.3% from the recent rally). If the rally can keep going, I will sell off half once it gets to 2% of net worth to recoup my original capital, then ride the rest to wherever it goes.

 

[Value Collector]

Crypto != (or <> if you prefer) bitcoin. Value Hunter mentioned the former, not the latter.

Bitcoin is just one form of crypto, albeit the largest and most well recognised. It's not meant for frequent transactions, these days it's more viewed as a store of value (digital gold, as some say).

even a 1 minute wait time is huge compared to Mastercard, which most of the time would be less than 5 seconds.

He asked for one way the traditional banking systems technology is superior, I gave him one. I think you would agree being able to process over 1,000,000 transactions per minute would be considered superior, to a system that can only do 420, to put it in perspective thats 40 hours to process the transactions with bitcoin that Master card, Visa card etc do in a minute.

Whether you find other pros that offset this major con is up to you, but as I said VH just asked for one example, so I gave it to him. (actually I gave him two)

I don't am not a crypto expert, but do you know any that can currently perform anything close to 1,000,000 transactions a minute.

 

[Sharkman]

It's no secret. Macquarie. Check out its website to see if it's OK for you.

Yep I recently moved back to Aust having lived overseas for many years, and after checking thru Canstar and the like as part of the process of setting up my life all over again, the Macquarie transactional/savings accounts seemed to be far and away the best offerings, so I went there too. Pretty happy with them so far, instant xfers between the two accounts, zero fees at all big 4 ATMs, and decent 5% interest on the savings a/c with no hoops to jump thru (which is important for me as a FIRE retiree, since I don't have a salary anymore and therefore can't use those high interest accounts that only give you the good interest rate if you have your salary deposited into it every month). Can definitely recommend.

 

[Sharkman]

even a 1 minute wait time is huge compared to Mastercard, which most of the time would be less than 5 seconds.

He asked for one way the traditional banking systems technology is superior, I gave him one. I think you would agree being able to process over 1,000,000 transactions per minute would be considered superior, to a system that can only do 420, to put it in perspective thats 40 hours to process the transactions with bitcoin that Master card, Visa card etc do in a minute.

Whether you find other pros that offset this major con is up to you, but as I said VH just asked for one example, so I gave it to him. (actually I gave him two)

Oh I agree that there are advantages to the existing system, I wouldn't be leaving 99% of my assets in it if I thought it had no advantages whatsoever. I was just pointing out that whilst it is correct to say bitcoin cannot do more than a few transactions per second (though it sort of can, thru L2s like lightning network), it is not correct to say that crypto cannot. There are some blockchains that can.

For daily over the counter/shopping type transactions, yes Mastercard and the like can confirm it in seconds. But it's the large and/or international bank transfer type transactions that I think Value Hunter et al are mainly getting at. I'm going thru this myself right now, having just moved back to Aust and trying to repatriate a bunch of funds from overseas. I send a transaction, and then I don't know for sure whether it's arrived or not until 1 or 2 business days later in the traditional system.

Heck I even got locked out of one of my overseas accounts after I tried to access it online from here, with the bank's garbage system citing some "identity verification breach". I had to make several (international) phone calls, fill in some forms and send them (overseas by snail mail!) to get it sorted and regain access to my funds, causing me an enormous amount of stress. This is after I had informed the bank whilst I was still living overseas that I would be moving to Aust soon, so it's not like they didn't know and this was a "block an unusual login for fraud prevention purposes" kind of thing. There are huge downsides with the traditional system, and there's a real life example of it.

Whereas high throughput cryptos have the same few second confirmation, no matter what the amount is and no matter where the sender and receiver are. And it operates 24/7. None of this waiting 1 or 2 business days for your funds to arrive. And they don't come with any nonsense denying you access to your own funds, provided that you practice self custody - with crypto you retain full control of your funds, if you retain full control of your private keys.

To be clear, I'm not saying that I'd use crypto for my own high value / international transactions. I wouldn't. I think that it's far too risky and volatile for that at the moment - but that doesn't mean it can't become viable for those things at some point in the future. Have to wait and see how things shake out.

I don't am not a crypto expert, but do you know any that can currently perform anything close to 1,000,000 transactions a minute.

Yes, I mentioned two of them in my last post, Solana and Kaspa. There are probably others, but those are two that I personally hold, and have used, in self custodial wallets.

 

[divs4ever]

I think that has always been the case, and they would need an Armed guard to make a special trip to drop that off, but you don't think thats worth a $3 fee???

LOL

not when i did it ... took out the majority of the account and put it every where ( ankle wallets ) money belt in an army vest under the shirt/coat and a sad old laptop carry-bag ... ( looked like i didn't have a pot in which to p*** )

and THEN got onto the council bus to go to a bank THAT CARED ( about customers )

worth the bus fare .. absolutely ( just for the look on the face of the new bank manager )

 

[TimeISmoney]

LOL

not when i did it ... took out the majority of the account and put it every where ( ankle wallets ) money belt in an army vest under the shirt/coat and a sad old laptop carry-bag ... ( looked like i didn't have a pot in which to p*** )

and THEN got onto the council bus to go to a bank THAT CARED ( about customers )

worth the bus fare .. absolutely ( just for the look on the face of the new bank manager )

I can still recall doing the banking for the business I worked at in the 90s, the local banks had multiple armed hold-ups in the area at the time.

It was a quick scope of the car park for any suspect looking people and then a quick walk to the bank with the white bag full of cash and checks from a week's takings.

Nervous times when you had over 20K in a white cloth bag that most knew what was in there.

Let someone rob you, you knew you weren't getting paid for a few weeks, so you guarded that bag with your life.

 

[Value Hunter]

even a 1 minute wait time is huge compared to Mastercard, which most of the time would be less than 5 seconds.

He asked for one way the traditional banking systems technology is superior, I gave him one. I think you would agree being able to process over 1,000,000 transactions per minute would be considered superior, to a system that can only do 420, to put it in perspective thats 40 hours to process the transactions with bitcoin that Master card, Visa card etc do in a minute.

Whether you find other pros that offset this major con is up to you, but as I said VH just asked for one example, so I gave it to him. (actually I gave him two)

I don't am not a crypto expert, but do you know any that can currently perform anything close to 1,000,000 transactions a minute.

You are comparing apples to oranges. Visa and MasterCard are not a final settlement layer. They are a layer 2 solution. They just tally up all the transactions then later settle it with the banks. The equivalent in the Bitcoin world would be the lightning network which is very fast and can handle 1 million transactions per second.