Benefits of ETF in SMSF as opposed to Superannuation fund

[IFocus]

Don't believe everything one may read about costs, especially if it comes from a group which may have a self-interest against SMSF's - sticky fee money.. A claim of $3k for an audit is audacious. The cost to the SMSF of which I am the Trustee was $880.

Could depend on the complexity involved however.

I see the inflated costs thrown out all the time re SMSF's my fees are the same $880 and like SP that covers both my wife and myself, converting to pension phase cost $0.

 

[Belli]

I see the inflated costs thrown out all the time re SMSF's my fees are the same $880 and like SP that covers both my wife and myself, converting to pension phase cost $0.

Yes. I guess it's a matter of where some groups see lots of money which is held by others they want it. Obviously those holding the money are incompetent investors as they are not professionals and need to be shown the path to righteousness.

A response along the lines of Rack Off springs to mind.

 

[Warr87]

I see the inflated costs thrown out all the time re SMSF's my fees are the same $880 and like SP that covers both my wife and myself, converting to pension phase cost $0.

I've looked into this a few times. Are your fees only $880 because of your SMSF structure? If you don't mind sharing, what kind of structure do you have? My goal is to use funds to trade shares and property eventually, but want to leave the trust open to using all available investment options such as Options, Futures, Overseas Equities, basically anything if I want to.

As it's been stated, I've seen quoted fees for SMSF as being much much higher ($5,000 to $7000 after audit and accounting fees). Though I have seen $100,000 as being quoted as the absolute minimum, not $200,000. But obviously the greater the starting the less fees will drag on the account.

I also didn't know about the Direct Investment options that are available too. That is certainly a idea!

 

[sptrawler]

I've looked into this a few times. Are your fees only $880 because of your SMSF structure? If you don't mind sharing, what kind of structure do you have? My goal is to use funds to trade shares and property eventually, but want to leave the trust open to using all available investment options such as Options, Futures, Overseas Equities, basically anything if I want to.

As it's been stated, I've seen quoted fees for SMSF as being much much higher ($5,000 to $7000 after audit and accounting fees). Though I have seen $100,000 as being quoted as the absolute minimum, not $200,000. But obviously the greater the starting the less fees will drag on the account.

I also didn't know about the Direct Investment options that are available too. That is certainly a idea!

You obviously need to research different providers, they all offer different services, I mainly have cash and stocks so a simple online super provider is all i require.
Having said that an elderly friend of mine has a similar fund, but uses an accounting firm, his costs are $5,000p.a.
But he would rather just take all the paperwork to the accountant and get them to do everything, rather than learn how to use a computer and email the info.
So a lot probably comes back to the elderly, being to a degree, computer illiterate.
But I am finding with the company I use, which is quite small, their software is making life easier all the time.
Now instead of having to scan and pdf all the share transactions, dividends etc, the accountant gets them direct. So the only time I have to send anything is by exception, not by rule.

 

[Warr87]

I have a family trust and have an accountant for that, so I will use them. There fee's for the trust have been pretty good. The investment for the SMSF will be simple as well, but I will make sure with the deed that I keep all options for the future.

Some good info in this thread

 

[Belli]

I have a family trust and have an accountant for that, so I will use them. There fee's for the trust have been pretty good. The investment for the SMSF will be simple as well, but I will make sure with the deed that I keep all options for the future.

Some good info in this thread

Probably telling you how to suck eggs but an FP cannot legally prepare or amend a Trust Deed. Nor can they advise on estate planning. It's all legal stuff.

Bloody rabbit warren.

 

[Warr87]

I can't remember but I'm pretty sure the accountant helped me source all that last time, not the FP. Not a big deal though. I'll sort it all out when the time comes (hopefully within 12months?). This thread has certainly helped clear up a few things though.

 

[Belli]

I can't remember but I'm pretty sure the accountant helped me source all that last time, not the FP. Not a big deal though. I'll sort it all out when the time comes (hopefully within 12months?). This thread has certainly helped clear up a few things though.

Possibly your accountant referred it to a law firm such as DBA or similar.

 

[fiftyeight]

Hi fiftyeight, I changed over to QSUPER. I needed somewhere where I could buy and sell my own ETF's or stocks and QSUPER allows this and their fees were much less than ING.

They have what they call "Self Invest" you can buy most of the ASX top 300 plus a range of ETF's, 27 I think. Self Invest has it's limitations and I have contacted them about that but there has been no change with that.

Pros: Low Fees, 27 ETF's, invest inmost of the top 300 stocks, fees are capped at $900 p/a (not including ETF/shares and brokerage), they have several of their own structured funds, no audits, no reporting to the ATO as they handle all paperwork including capital gains and annual reports, reversionary pension arrangement or binding arrangements. Basically all I do is pick what I want and they do the rest.

Cons: Brokerage is a bit high (for me not an issue as I don't trade much), Can not invest in LIC's (asked but no action), Not enough ETF's (I like A200, not on the list), need to have 13 Months in pension payments in one of "their funds" so they can draw on it.

Generally I like QSUPER a lot. I've changed super funds a number of times and I have found QSUPER to be the best so far. Hope that helps.

Link to list of available ETF's: https://qsuper.qld.gov.au/investments/options/self-invest/exchange-traded-funds
and
While fees are necessary to cover the cost of managing your money, QSuper has an annual cap on administration fees.2 If you ever pay more than $900 a year, we'll refund the difference in July of the following financial year as a rebate – meaning more money towards your retirement.
https://qsuper.qld.gov.au/our-products/our-fees/fee-details

Thanks for the info, sent me on the right path and I am now having a much closer look.

At this stage ING is looking OK, but I have emailed re one set of fees may change things.

Yet to look too closely, but speaking to the guys I work with my life and TPD insurance is the cheapest by far, better check what I am covered for haha

While looking around I did come across the below. Fees are higher, but capped and provides heaps of choice.

https://www.bt.com.au/personal/superannuation/solutions/bt-super-invest.html

 

[IFocus]

I've looked into this a few times. Are your fees only $880 because of your SMSF structure? If you don't mind sharing, what kind of structure do you have? My goal is to use funds to trade shares and property eventually, but want to leave the trust open to using all available investment options such as Options, Futures, Overseas Equities, basically anything if I want to.

As it's been stated, I've seen quoted fees for SMSF as being much much higher ($5,000 to $7000 after audit and accounting fees). Though I have seen $100,000 as being quoted as the absolute minimum, not $200,000. But obviously the greater the starting the less fees will drag on the account.

I also didn't know about the Direct Investment options that are available too. That is certainly a idea!

I use Esuper have a read through their website its fairly straight forward.

My SMSF is like SP cash and stocks with myself and wife as members I hold an IP but outside of the SMSF.

Its all online and 99.9% of the admin is done by Esuper very straightforward and well organised.

I previously used an accountant, costs were around $2K per year but found Esuper to be better all round.

 

[sptrawler]

I use Esuper have a read through their website its fairly straight forward.

My SMSF is like SP cash and stocks with myself and wife as members I hold an IP but outside of the SMSF.

Its all online and 99.9% of the admin is done by Esuper very straightforward and well organised.

I previously used an accountant, costs were around $2K per year but found Esuper to be better all round.

A couple of guys from work used esuper and they were happy with the service. I use online super fund, been using them for a long time and happy with the service, plus local (Perth).
With the advances in online software everything is getting easier.

 

[goponcho]

Have popped back into the forums after a few years.
Quick update on what i did - recently moved to Hostplus Choice option.
Allowed 80% of funds to be invested in several ETF/ASX300 stocks, with max of 20% in particular investment. The remaining 20% had to be in one of their packaged options eg balanced.
Found the transaction costs were reasonably large, but with a plan to transact infrequently it would work well.
Bought a few broad market indexes so works well, given the ease of running and learning curve to go the SMSF route.

Cheers

 

[Under_The_Value]

They introduced a massive fee increase and as I warned them at the time customers would leave. When I pulled out my account surprise surprise they called me and asked if I could come into their office and have a talk about why I left. It was all too late, I would only give them 1 star now. Have a look at a website called productreview.com.au and check out ING Living Super and you will see what I mean, cheers.

Hi Bill, thanks for your advice which is really useful for me.

One question comes out of my head. How did you transfer your stocks from ING Living to Qsuper? Did you have to sell all your stocks before you can make a transfer?

 

[Bill M]

Hi Bill, thanks for your advice which is really useful for me.

One question comes out of my head. How did you transfer your stocks from ING Living to Qsuper? Did you have to sell all your stocks before you can make a transfer?

Hi and welcome to the forum. I wasn't really giving any advice as by law and forum rules we are not allowed to do that. It was just my honest opinion but I know what you meant.

To transfer super funds I had to liquidate all shares into cash and then drop it back into accumulation phase. (I was in an account based pension at the time). Once that was all done I went to the QSuper website and signed up online. After all the checks were done I just did an ATO search on their website where it showed my ING Super, so I clicked transfer the whole lot over to QSuper. It was so easy to do and within a couple of weeks the whole ING account was transferred over. It was well worth the process and I am still with QSuper and I am very happy with them.

 

[Under_The_Value]

I was looking for an approach which could give me the freedom to invest my super without too much effort on the management like SMSF and your reply pointed out the way.

That make sense! Like all other super transfering, it still needs to liquidate all your investment which makes the first choice of the super fund important. Selling stocks too often, I guess will triger too much on the tax though in the long run. I will look them in detail. Thanks.

 

[Beaches]

This is BT's direct investment option super account and this message is not what you want to log into first thing on a Monday morning. Not even an apologgy.

The Panorama site is currently offline.​

The planned weekend outage has been extended. We anticipate your online access will be available from 9am, Tuesday 23 March 2021 AEDT. Please visit our website for more information.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

The Panorama site is currently offline. The planned weekend outage has been extended. We anticipate your online access will be available from 9am, Tuesday 23 March 2021 AEDT. Please visit our website for more information.

the explanation I have heard is along these lines: They are transferring a pile of clients over from BT Wrap, and its taking a little longer than they thought.