Baby Boomers are 25% of the population and control over 50% of the wealth!

[insider]

Before Buster or any other person wants to go on another bashing, tell me where in this thread I have actually said that my generation has had it harder than anyone elses? In fact I've said that the baby boomers will be pretty badly off. I haven't begrudged anyone anything.

And investing is a zero sum game. For someone to win, someone has to lose. And I certainly do not plan to be one in the flock.

You're right... most humans engage in win/lose behavior everyday (like my EX) and very few make the effort to make win/win situations (like me, I voluntarily offer my seat to those that need it on public transport for example)... but with money there is always at least one loser for every winner... there's a psychological trade that goes on behind everything... It's human nature...

No offense but it's seems like you've begrudged your parents, that's why they're confused and bashing you...

This is to everyone... Sigment Freud once said "character is destiny". I always say "success is the bi-product of good character". So if you're negative then you wont be successful because that's not your character... If your positive and optimistic then you'll be more successful... Most of the oldies here will agree... So drop any bad feelings because that's wasted emotional energy... energy that would be better spent on other things... BB's and X's and Y's kiss and make up... I'm warning you :

 

[chops_a_must]

No offense but it's seems like you've begrudged your parents, that's why they're confused and bashing you...

This is to everyone... Sigment Freud once said "character is destiny". I always say "success is the bi-product of good character". So if you're negative then you wont be successful because that's not your character... If your positive and optimistic then you'll be more successful... Most of the oldies here will agree... So drop any bad feelings because that's wasted emotional energy... energy that would be better spent on other things... BB's and X's and Y's kiss and make up... I'm warning you :

If I wasn't positive, I don't think I would be alive. Wow, this is getting Freudian isn't it? Largely, I get along with my parents. They will just need to learn their lesson, like the children they act like. Lol!

 

[insider]

my folks told me that this was good music - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQqubH1fltQ&mode=related&search=
or this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVtcIjy6SPM&mode=related&search=
Paul MCCartney was a long haired git lol
generation X Y etc should be locked up and flogged until they acknowledge how tolerant we are !!

PS Insider - this has something in common with "foggy dew"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkPr_iXsTO8&mode=related&search= baby its cold outside

That actually wasn't bad.

 

[Julia]

Not really interested mate, as you've (again Royal You, not just 'you' you) already illustrated in the majority of the posts in this thread, not only are you willing to take the perceived 'advantage' that you begrudge the Baby Boomer, you are prepered to go much much further.. to the point where you would gleefully accept gain at the expense of others, all the better at thier misery.

However, I guess that is the point of being 'young'.. lacking the wisdom or emotional development normally associated with adults, or not yet having attained the perfection of a later, or fully developed, style.

Personally some of the attitude in this thread sickens me..

Again, let me point out that I'm NOT old enough to be labelled as a Baby Boomer, and thankfully I also dont fit into, nor subscribe to the poisonous and vengeful view of some of the 'younger' posters in this forum who believe they are owed everything having contributed nothing.


Buster.

Thanks, Buster, for saying so well what I'm feeling. Some of the malice and bitterness from some of the young people in this thread has really taken me by surprise and disappointment.

Julia

 

[insider]

Thanks, Buster, for saying so well what I'm feeling. Some of the malice and bitterness from some of the young people in this thread has really taken me by surprise and disappointment.

Julia

I'm not malice or bitter... I wish you all luck

 

[nizar]

I tell my parents that I don't care about any inheritence, I just don't want to have to pay for them when they're old.

Saying this, I have taken an active part in helping them secure the funds they need for their retirement.

They gave everything for you when you were younger.
Some people are just so ungrateful.

I cant wait to have money so i can give my parents the life they deserve.

Seriously, i mean, come on guys, your parents...

 

[Julia]

I'm not malice or bitter... I wish you all luck

Insider:

My comment was absolutely not directed at you. On the contrary.

All the best
Julia

 

[insider]

They gave everything for you when you were younger.
Some people are just so ungrateful.

I cant wait to have money so i can give my parents the life they deserve.

Seriously, i mean, come on guys, your parents...

Same here... I already give them heaps all ready (not money but my time)... My parents never bought me a car because I didn't want them too... it's too generous... When they're gone They will leave me and my brother and sister their house. That's more than enough and I certainly hope to never see that day.

 

[Julia]

They gave everything for you when you were younger.
Some people are just so ungrateful.

I cant wait to have money so i can give my parents the life they deserve.

Seriously, i mean, come on guys, your parents...

Good for you Nizar.

Julia

 

[chops_a_must]

They gave everything for you when you were younger.
Some people are just so ungrateful.

I cant wait to have money so i can give my parents the life they deserve.

Seriously, i mean, come on guys, your parents...

What if they put you out on the streets?

I don't think it's bitter at all. I haven't lost my faith in human kindness. I'm just not going to be stupid about it.

You wouldn't go and look after an abusive ex-husband would you?

 

[insider]

You know what EVERYONE... clearly this is an issue that'll go around in circles so my solution is... Learn to mother and father yourself so that you can stop relying on other people and so you won't be affected... When you find people that you like then stick with them... But don't set your goals based around them because that is a recipe for failure... take it as it comes... You are the most important person in your life...

I heard Dr Phil has a position available... I might take him up on it :

 

[Smurf1976]

Smurf:

Could you explain just exactly what we baby boomers should have been doing on a personal basis to not "run down the infrastructure capital".

How, exactly, have we been "taking without giving". We've paid plenty of taxes and surely it's up to successive governments to ensure the maintenance of and provision for future infrastructure.

And on the subject ot "taking without giving", that is frankly an extremely judgmental and erroneous generalisation. I've given a great deal of my time and energy (and some skills I hope) to the community on a purely voluntary basis since I was in my mid 30's, continue to do so now, as do most of my friends.
I'd really like you to be specific as to just what you think we should have been doing to date and what you think we should be doing now and in the future, and why.

Julia

Julia, my comment wasn't directed at anyone personally and I hope you didn't take it that way. My appologies if it didn't come across the way I intended.

My point is basically this. Up to the mid-1980's in Australia, we invested vast amounts in all kinds of infrastructure. We built or at least committed firmly to building most of the railways, highways, power stations, hospitals, dams, schools and so on largely during that time.

But about 20 years ago all that changed. We stopped spending anywhere near as much on infrastructure for tomorrow. We had enough for now and decided not to invest much for the future. Instead, we funded all manner of tax cuts, financial booms and other things which generally resulted in a shift from "invest for tomorrow" to "consume it now".

It was the boardrooms and to a greater extent government which made those decisions, not ordinary individual people.

The overall effect is that for the past two decades or so we've had the benefit of previous generations investing in infrastructure but we haven't been investing anywhere near as much for the benefit of future generations. Hence my comment that collectively as a nation we've been taking (the benefits of past investment) without giving (back something for the next generation).

What should we have done? At a personal level there's not much we COULD do individually and that's not the issue I'm getting at.

But as a nation we ought to be making sure we have enough hospitals and trained staff to run them, enough transport capacity, enough water for the cities, enough power, a quality education system and so on. It will take decades to build these things back up to the standard they were at their peak if we don't keep up the required investment.

Right now in Tasmania there's a debate about building a new major hospital. The only way anyone can think of to fund it being to sell off some asset built by a previous generation.

Now let me get this straight. Previous generations built roads without modern machinery. They built railways with pick and shovel. They built dams and power stations, also without modern construction machinery, in the midst of a depression and both world wars. And they built the existing hospital too. And those alive today inherited all of that in the best condition the previous generations could hand it to us.

And yet we have a far higher overall standard of living but can't bring ourselves to pay the cost keeping the hospital up to the required standard. It was handed to us in a condition appropriate for the time. All we had to do was keep it going and replace buildings etc gradually over the years. But we're not prepared to pay even though those who worked under far more difficult conditions (physically) and had a far lower overall standard of living managed to build it and all the other things as well. Something is very, very wrong with the attitude we have today...

There are plenty of similar examples in the other states too. Just look at Sydney's trains or Brisbane's water. Previous generations built massive projects that kept us all well supplied for decades. But we haven't been investing enough to keep them up to standard.

 

[Buster]

Before Buster or any other person wants to go on another bashing, tell me where in this thread I have actually said that my generation has had it harder than anyone elses? In fact I've said that the baby boomers will be pretty badly off. I haven't begrudged anyone anything.

Not bashing *YOU* mate. As I’ve posted a few times in this thread “Royal You, not just 'you' you” as in not you personally, but the mentality that appears on this thread by some ‘seemingly' young posters.. I wonder if some of the animosity in this thread and those like it is actually posted from those of the BB generation that may have missed the boat..

What amazes me is the constant ‘woe is us’, ‘ look at the situation you’ve left us in’ and ‘just realise what you’ve done’ posts followed up by this..

Is anyone else in their early 20s actually rubbing their hands together over this? I'm hoping to snap up property (along with a few I know) after just about everyone in Perth goes bust. This will all be insignificant in another few years. There is opportunity in the misery of other people.

There are other examples of ‘I cant wait to screw over those that have been screwing me’ type posts (from various posters).

Surely you can see how hypocritical these views/posts are..

As I’ve pointed out before, I'm NOT old enough to be labelled as a Baby Boomer, and I certainly didn’t have a silver spoon hanging out of my ring bit.. I started with nothing. I live a comfortable lifestyle now (not a wealthy lifestyle) which stems from some discipline and control in my earlier years (read: going without some luxuries). And I can tell you those small sacrifices then (which seemed significant) are more than worth the quality of life I live now.. more importantly my ‘success’ (obviously measured differently by each individual) has certainly not been achieved at the detriment of others..

Each to their own..

Cheers,

Buster

 

[Kimosabi]

They gave everything for you when you were younger.
Some people are just so ungrateful.

I cant wait to have money so i can give my parents the life they deserve.

Seriously, i mean, come on guys, your parents...

I'm not ungrateful at all. I think it's called being smart.

I have put a huge amount of effort into helping my parents plan for their retirement and with the selling of their business, getting rid of my leach sister and her d1ckhead husband out the business who nearly sent them broke and took without permission, a sh1tload of money.

I have no expectation of getting anything from my parents, I'm more than happy for them to blow it on themselves if they so desire.

All I care about, is I don't want to wind up paying for them when they retire. I also don't expect anyone to pay for me when I retire either.

We should have them out of debt in the next few months, house over their head paid for, cashed up, ready to ride out the bust and then we might be able to pick up some bargains on the other side and ride the next Bull.

 

[chops_a_must]

There are other examples of ‘I cant wait to screw over those that have been screwing me’ type posts (from various posters).

Surely you can see how hypocritical these views/posts are..

If they were expressed by someone else, yes, but I haven't said in this thread that it is wrong for BB's to be making money. I'm not out to screw people over, just make money.

Given that I conduct my business in an ethical and compassionate manner (charging clients far less than my worth so they are still able to receive treatment) I don't think I will encounter problems with screwing renters over. I don't feel sympathy for those in positions of disadvantage due to their own decisions i.e. people in too much debt, but do for people in disadvantage due to circumstance i.e. young, inexperienced worker on minimum wage.

 

[The Snorkler]

Just joined the discussion....

Good points all round. There is money to be made here. They may control a disproportionate share of the wealth but we will be the ones who extract the ore back off them in the next 20 years as their bodies and minds begin to whither and they become as helpless children.

Go long on rubber gloves, go long on nursing homes, go long on sedative pills...

go long son.

go long.

 

[Riesling]

All I care about, is I don't want to wind up paying for them when they retire.

Lucky you to have that expectation. Myself and at least two of my friends have had to buy our parents homes to live in, and those parents will be living on the pension when they are too old to go to work (all are mid 60s and still working), with spending money provided by their children.

I'm 33, classic X-er, and have paid off that house, which I bought/built in 2002/3.

Pretty much anyone with an education/trade could do this. You can't be too risk averse.

I went to London, got a job, and lived pretty cheap (plenty of people live cheaper) I worked as an accountant, boring as hell but good money.

I'm a terrible saver, but in my early 20s, when I had terrible credit card debt, that I am quite good at paying off debt when required.

So instead of trying to save a deposit (which required self-discipline), I got some credit cards (so easy to do in the UK) and cash advanced GBP30k. (Yes it took a while!) Then I switched to new cards every 6 months and kept balance transferring to new 0% intro deals so I didn't have to pay interest.

With that A$75k I bought a block of land on the NSW far north coast, closest I could find to where my oldies were living on the Gold Coast that I could afford. I was earning GPB52k/year so I paid off the land in just over 12 months (here doing the same job I would earn about A$70k so that gives you some idea of the better money that can be made in London in some (not all) professions). I also bought a horrible tiny flat in London on a 100% mortgage, renovated every day from 6pm till 1am for 4 weeks, and sold it at about A$60k profit.

After that I did the same thing again. So I had A$75k in cash to start building a house, and I got a mortgage for $75k. My dad did the owner-building thing and we used every mate and mate's mate and cost cutting exercise we could to build a 2 story brick 4 bed 2 bath house for about $145k. (Sure prices have gone up a bit since then, but that would just mean another year in London)

I paid off the UK credit cards in the second year, then moved back to Oz in 2005. I didn't like being an accountant (being an X-er - you know we don't like to stick to anything) so I borrowed A$100k against the house and started a bar - it wasn't rocket science, anyone could do it, but it was long hours and hard work. I sold it after a year for $300k.

So now I have paid off the house and have $100k (by the way, I rent myself as it's way cheaper than owning in my chosen suburb LOL! - but now I am too scared to change apartments because the rents all round have gone up!) My parents will be living in the house till they pop their clogs, as they collectively have less than $100k in super and no other assets. I don't begrudge this as without them I wouldn't have gone to uni etc so had the ability to do the above.

So, in this case the BBs have got bugger all. And like I said at least 2 other of my friends have done the same thing for their olds (who knows how many others, generally we don't like to talk about it).

I don't relate the above to show how amazingly sensational I am, far from it, I am fairly ordinary (albiet having a uni education).

I relate it to show how easy it is to do, and I don't understand why more people in their mid/late 20s don't do it (unless you've got a job like science reserach or whatever that pays woefully throughout the world - sorry about that.)

 

[2020hindsight]

just to digress , but expectations differ so much between generations.
My folks (who had kids either side of WWII - lived through tough times, depression etc) never travelled overseas for instance - so they own their house - I'm a BB and spent years roaming the world, and my kids expect it as well. If I'm broke now, so be it. If someone is richer than me financially, I'm jealous to a degree, but not as jealous as I am of someone who has really done something interesting during their youth.
Then again, Go long on youth maybe !! I know 60 and 70 year olds doing the Milford track etc. (and lol - nothing so humiliating as being passed by a 90 year old on heartbreak hill during city2surf)

 

[Prospector]

Adelaide Bank has just released a new loan that 20% comes from another source, meaning that the buyer can borrow up to 80% and only pay the mortgage repayments on that 80%. When it comes to selling, the 20% loaner receives 40% of the CG, the owner gets the other 60%.

Then they said that meant that new home buyers could buy a home that was 20% more than what they could originally have bought. Or, as some others have said, Buy the Plasma, subscribe to Foxtel etc etc.

Young people expect more these days. They have probably been living in their parents home, which over the years of working have probably accumulated the large TV's, internet broadband, Foxtel, nice furniture, etc etc. And then expect to have all that when they move.

A 25 year old employee of ours recently built a new home; just like we did maybe 30 years ago. Except hers had to be prewired for Foxtel and broadband, and also had to have a room with no windows - ie the Entertainment Room! Within a month of moving in, that room had an overhead projector, Plasma 50 inch TV and the latest sound system all wireless - no ugly black wires for them! She was a receptionist, he works in an assembly line - how could they expect all that stuff! Wen we married we were both employed in professional (ie degree professions) and we had to borrow a TV, had newspapers for curtains, and bare plank (not nice timber btw!) floors, and we were quite happy to accumulate when we could afford it.

We are the baby boomers (although I distinctly recall when I was growing up that people of my age when reading of baby boomers were talking about people much older than me - when did the age criteria change?) yet our expectations in our 20's were way below what this generation thinks they need. And I bet our parents said the same thing about us!

 

[wayneL]

Adelaide Bank has just released a new loan that 20% comes from another source, meaning that the buyer can borrow up to 80% and only pay the mortgage repayments on that 80%. When it comes to selling, the 20% loaner receives 40% of the CG, the owner gets the other 60%.

Then they said that meant that new home buyers could buy a home that was 20% more than what they could originally have bought. Or, as some others have said, Buy the Plasma, subscribe to Foxtel etc etc.

Young people expect more these days. They have probably been living in their parents home, which over the years of working have probably accumulated the large TV's, internet broadband, Foxtel, nice furniture, etc etc. And then expect to have all that when they move.

A 25 year old employee of ours recently built a new home; just like we did maybe 30 years ago. Except hers had to be prewired for Foxtel and broadband, and also had to have a room with no windows - ie the Entertainment Room! Within a month of moving in, that room had an overhead projector, Plasma 50 inch TV and the latest sound system all wireless - no ugly black wires for them! She was a receptionist, he works in an assembly line - how could they expect all that stuff! Wen we married we were both employed in professional (ie degree professions) and we had to borrow a TV, had newspapers for curtains, and bare plank (not nice timber btw!) floors, and we were quite happy to accumulate when we could afford it.

We are the baby boomers (although I distinctly recall when I was growing up that people of my age when reading of baby boomers were talking about people much older than me - when did the age criteria change?) yet our expectations in our 20's were way below what this generation thinks they need. And I bet our parents said the same thing about us!

The banks were a bit more responsible about how much they lent out then but.

It's actually quite liberating to shun all that rubbish and live humbly by choice.

Bohemia is much cooler than Bourgeois.