Tony Abbott - Indigneous envoy

[sptrawler]

Firstly let's not make this a thread to degrade, or make disparaging comments, because of pre conceived biases.
So in other words don't post unless it is about his current role. I believe Abbott hasn't deserved the constant endless barrage of bad press and media coverage, that he has received, also the task of indigenous Australian's plight is well recorded.

So I think if Abbott can bring about a change in their outcomes, it will be a huge step forward for Australia, at least the Government has made it a front and centre issue.

Time will tell how it goes, but there is no doubting Abbott's ability to take on a challenge, I for one hope he can bring about change.
The flak has already started: it will be interesting to monitor the progress.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/...-liberal-leadership-coup-20180829-p500ib.html

 

[luutzu]

Firstly let's not make this a thread to degrade, or make disparaging comments, because of pre conceived biases.
So in other words don't post unless it is about his current role. I believe Abbott hasn't deserved the constant endless barrage of bad press and media coverage, that he has received, also the task of indigenous Australian's plight is well recorded.

So I think if Abbott can bring about a change in their outcomes, it will be a huge step forward for Australia, at least the Government has made it a front and centre issue.

Time will tell how it goes, but there is no doubting Abbott's ability to take on a challenge, I for one hope he can bring about change.
The flak has already started: it will be interesting to monitor the progress.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/...-liberal-leadership-coup-20180829-p500ib.html

You have way too much optimism Homer. And ScoMo has a screwed up sense of humour.

Well, it's quite serious if the intention is to do nothing. I mean, no one's asking those people to choose to live far away, right? That and God said we should all be White, European and Christian.

This is almost like Trump letting his son-in-law, and childhood family friend of Israeli's PM, being a "peace envoy" to seek... peace?

You really can't make these stuff up.

 

[sptrawler]

You have way too much optimism Homer. And ScoMo has a screwed up sense of humour.

Well, it's quite serious if the intention is to do nothing. I mean, no one's asking those people to choose to live far away, right? That and God said we should all be White, European and Christian.

This is almost like Trump letting his son-in-law, and childhood family friend of Israeli's PM, being a "peace envoy" to seek... peace?

You really can't make these stuff up.

Well Iuutzu, I've worked in remote communities and it isn't an easy gig, there is no easy answer, if there was it would have been found.
You can make light of it, all you like, but it is something that really needs addressing.
Sitting back on a keyboard in Sydney, taking the piss, hasn't cut it yet.

I was hoping for constructive comment, not just repeating the same regurgitated garbage, sorry Iuutzu but it deserves more than that. IMO
To put it your way, just because you speak broken English, doesn't mean you speak Noongar.

 

[luutzu]

Well Iuutzu, I've worked in remote communities and it isn't an easy gig, there is no easy answer, if there was it would have been found.
You can make light of it, all you like, but it is something that really needs addressing.
Sitting back on a keyboard in Sydney, taking the piss, hasn't cut it yet.

I was hoping for constructive comment, not just repeating the same regurgitated garbage, sorry Iuutzu but it deserves more than that. IMO
To put it your way, just because you speak broken English, doesn't mean you speak Noongar.

Of course it deserve more than keyboarding. Sure as heck deserve more than Abbott in charge of it.

And how is it garbage to think Abbott is not the right pick? There are things you don't need to wait and see. Benefit of the doubt we given and long gone... remember when he was the PM?

There are things you just don't do. Like leaving boys alone with Catholic priests. Not all priests are paedophile a-holes, just it's not the kind of risk you'd want to take on kids.

 

[sptrawler]

Of course it deserve more than keyboarding. Sure as heck deserve more than Abbott in charge of it.

And how is it garbage to think Abbott is not the right pick? There are things you don't need to wait and see. Benefit of the doubt we given and long gone... remember when he was the PM?

There are things you just don't do. Like leaving boys alone with Catholic priests. Not all priests are paedophile a-holes, just it's not the kind of risk you'd want to take on kids.

I must say, I'm a bit shocked with the venom, I've asked several times if someone can show me anything that shows Abbott as anything other than respectful.
Just because the media paints a picture, doesn't mean you don't question it, you of all people I would have thought would look past the stereotyping.
Maybe you should google Abbott interviews, there was one recently posted about the NEG with Leigh Sales, he was polite and had good points to make.

I find it strange when you stand up for people who are maligned, yet you don't have any problem doing it yourself, when it suits.

Like I said post up something, or you are no better than those you hold in contempt, this is really the problem with Australia.

 

[luutzu]

I must say, I'm a bit shocked with the venom, I've asked several times if someone can show me anything that shows Abbott as anything other than respectful.
Just because the media paints a picture, doesn't mean you don't question it, you of all people I would have thought would look past the stereotyping.
Maybe you should google Abbott interviews, there was one recently posted about the NEG with Leigh Sales, he was polite and had good points to make.

I find it strange when you stand up for people who are maligned, yet you don't have any problem doing it yourself, when it suits.

Like I said post up something, or you are no better than those you hold in contempt, this is really the problem with Australia.

I just gave you two examples of Abbott's attitudes towards Indigenous Australians already.

Didn't he, as PM, cut funding to assistance for those in the outback? Saying that it's not "our" problem if "they" choose to live in isolated places?

But alright, fair go.

 

[sptrawler]

I just gave you two examples of Abbott's attitudes towards Indigenous Australians already.

Didn't he, as PM, cut funding to assistance for those in the outback? Saying that it's not "our" problem if "they" choose to live in isolated places?

But alright, fair go.

To be perfectly honest, it is true, many of the communities need relocating to nearby larger communities.
If the subject was addressed in an orderly manner, it would be obvious, but vested interests become involved and it can't be done.
Apparently some communities are all but abandoned, but still require water, electricity, housing and everything else, even though what is there is vandalized pillaged.
It is impossible to supply those marginal communities with medical, educational and social assistance.
To relocate them to nearby larger communities, where schools, nursing posts and social welfare is available has to help improve their situation.
Area centralisation of communities, is probably the only way of providing decent services, to help improve their living standards.
If you wanted to live away from the nearest community, should it be covered by the taxpayer? Especially if we are talking in the middle of no where, when there is a larger community in the middle of nowhere nearby?
It is a bit like a town of 10 people, living 100klm away from a major town, sooner or later the Government will shut down the school,CES and the electricity(if it isn't on the grid) and the water.
The difference is if it was a normal Australian small Town, it wouldn't rate the news and if the locals complained. Everyone would say "get a life".

 

[luutzu]

To be perfectly honest, it is true, many of the communities need relocating to nearby larger communities.
If the subject was addressed in an orderly manner, it would be obvious, but vested interests become involved and it can't be done.
Apparently some communities are all but abandoned, but still require water, electricity, housing and everything else, even though what is there is vandalized pillaged.
It is impossible to supply those marginal communities with medical, educational and social assistance.
To relocate them to nearby larger communities, where schools, nursing posts and social welfare is available has to help improve their situation.
Area centralisation of communities, is probably the only way of providing decent services, to help improve their living standards.

 

[sptrawler]

Yes that's great emotive stuff that explains that the Aboriginals are in poverty, even though more money has been pumped into their plight than any other.
I loved near the end where he said, it could be turned around almost overnight, if they had basic services etc.
If it was that easy Roeburn in W.A wouldn't have a problem, the Town has been there for a long time. It is close to the mining Towns, I played inter school sports there when I was 12 years old, it was a great place.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-29/roebourne-the-heart-in-the-darkness/8842220

Anyway obviously a bad thread to start, best just sweep it under the carpet, as usual.
I'm done

 

[luutzu]

Yes that's great emotive stuff that explains that the Aboriginals are in poverty, even though more money has been pumped into their plight than any other.
I loved near the end where he said, it could be turned around almost overnight, if they had basic services etc.
If it was that easy Roeburn in W.A wouldn't have a problem, the Town has been there for a long time. It is close to the mining Towns, I played inter school sports there when I was 12 years old, it was a great place.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-29/roebourne-the-heart-in-the-darkness/8842220

Anyway obviously a bad thread to start, best just sweep it under the carpet, as usual.
I'm done

Top line money figures all go directly to those who's supposed to get it is it? No middle man, no abuse and misdirection?

Who wouldn't want to live in a comfortable home, with running water and all that?

It's like those typical poly-speak about helping struggling Aussie mums and dads, helping the Aussie battlers. Every election those are promised... and still, for some reason, they just refused to see the incentive to work hard and get ahead in life.

I guess there are certain truths in life, believe it or not.

1. All politician lies.
2. There are class hierarchies. Yes, even in Western democracies.
3. There are racism. In some places it's more accepted; in most places it's not civilised to be openly racist so you wrapped it in nice words, good religion and a couple photo-ops.

 

[SirRumpole]

Abbott was right about "subsidising people's lifestyles", it wouldn't happen for anyone else (apart from baby boomers with their tax free super. ).

But as far as an 'envoy' goes, that person is supposed to represent indigenous people, and if they don't want him then he shouldn't get the job.

 

[SirRumpole]

An interesting aside on the appointment of "envoys".

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-30/could-abbott-and-joyce-have-a-section-44-problem/10179944

 

[Darc Knight]

This whole evolution of Tony Abbott is very interesting. He was the head kicker in the Howard Government, doing the dirty work. Pauline Hanson described him as the architect behind her jailing. I think there was talk of a dirt fund being set up to go after Hanson, I assume due to her spliting the conservative vote.
I certainly viewed Abbott as the grubbiest Politician in my memory.

Now Abbott has taken on this Statesman like image bringing us to this position. Interesting to say the least.

Which one (the grub or the Statesman) is the real Abbott?

 

[Tisme]

The problem I have is that I don't understand what the govt objectives are with indigenous affairs.

Is it humanitarian, is it assimilation, preservation of a primitive culture, white man guilt, a romantic ideal, political football, ...... ad infinitum.

And what is more important the integration and quota policies for part aboriginals in the urban white collar environment or the state housing dwellers in suburbia or the bush mobs?

 

[SirRumpole]

The problem I have is that I don't understand what the govt objectives are with indigenous affairs.

Is it humanitarian, is it assimilation, preservation of a primitive culture, white man guilt, a romantic ideal, political football, ...... ad infinitum.

And what is more important the integration and quota policies for part aboriginals in the urban white collar environment or the state housing dwellers in suburbia or the bush mobs?

I heard that aboriginals get about 6 times the welfare payments of others. If so I think enough has been done already and maybe its time for the aboriginals to take more responsibility for themselves.

 

[Skate]

An interesting aside on the appointment of "envoys".

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-30/could-abbott-and-joyce-have-a-section-44-problem/10179944

What a long bow assigning section 44 to newly appointed parliamentary positions.

Luke Beck is an associate professor of constitutional law at Monash University - thus a timely reminder: Those who can, do - those who can't, teach

Skate.

 

[sptrawler]

Top line money figures all go directly to those who's supposed to get it is it? No middle man, no abuse and misdirection?

Who wouldn't want to live in a comfortable home, with running water and all that?

You obviously haven't been out to the communities, or settlements, you should it would supprise you. Even try just going for a run out to Walgett.

It's like those typical poly-speak about helping struggling Aussie mums and dads, helping the Aussie battlers. Every election those are promised... and still, for some reason, they just refused to see the incentive to work hard and get ahead in life.

I guess there are certain truths in life, believe it or not.

1. All politician lies.
2. There are class hierarchies. Yes, even in Western democracies.
3. There are racism. In some places it's more accepted; in most places it's not civilised to be openly racist so you wrapped it in nice words, good religion and a couple photo-ops.

When you don't know what you're talking about, just throw crap.

 

[luutzu]

You obviously haven't been out to the communities, or settlements, you should it would supprise you. Even try just going for a run out to Walgett.

When you don't know what you're talking about, just throw crap.

Most things should be judged by its results right?

It's been how long since Europeans arrived? How rich is Australia as a nation?

But somehow, with all the great intentions and serious effort to help the Aborigines, most of them living in poverty.

So it's either the aborigines are inept, extremely lazy... or...

 

[PZ99]

This whole evolution of Tony Abbott is very interesting. He was the head kicker in the Howard Government, doing the dirty work. Pauline Hanson described him as the architect behind her jailing. I think there was talk of a dirt fund being set up to go after Hanson, I assume due to her spliting the conservative vote.
I certainly viewed Abbott as the grubbiest Politician in my memory.

Now Abbott has taken on this Statesman like image bringing us to this position. Interesting to say the least.

Which one (the grub or the Statesman) is the real Abbott?

If I was Turnbull / Morisson I'd have put Tony Abbott up as defense minister. It would've been the incentive to for him to play for the team yeah?

To be fair, whatever his faults or views, he does put Australia first. I'll give him that.
And who better to defend the country than the guy who stopped the boats?

: Insert a grabs_a_ sausage_sanga _and_bolts emoticon here:

 

[moXJO]

This whole evolution of Tony Abbott is very interesting. He was the head kicker in the Howard Government, doing the dirty work. Pauline Hanson described him as the architect behind her jailing. I think there was talk of a dirt fund being set up to go after Hanson, I assume due to her spliting the conservative vote.
I certainly viewed Abbott as the grubbiest Politician in my memory.

Now Abbott has taken on this Statesman like image bringing us to this position. Interesting to say the least.

Which one (the grub or the Statesman) is the real Abbott?

I don't know about "grubbiest", Obeid, Dastyari and a few other sellouts probably take that title.
Probably number 1 headkicker. He took out 3 PMs.