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Gay parenting

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SirRumpole said:
I think it is up to the gay community who are not biologically equipped to have children without outside assistance to prove that their version of parenting produces the same our better outcomes for children as a well balanced natural family would produce.

However what I object to is children being used as part of a social experiment by a minority group to try and prove that they can do things that nature has not equipped them to do.

The first priority of scientific experiments that involve human beings is to get volunteers for the study. As it's impossible to get informed consent from the children involved, then this is an experiment that should not be attempted in the first place imo.
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You have to be able to prove something is harmful before it can be banned.
 
SirRumpole said:
So maybe we can test some new drugs on you without your consent to see if they are harmful or not.
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That's a bit OTT..... as if an adult would risk his own welfare; he might have kids, a wife and a psychiatrist to support....

I fear the tribal partisanship just won't allow objective consideration for children DELIBERATELY manufactured to be the embodiment of an emotional protest against the rest of society.

Like it or not those primary schoolers who are held up as the paragon of innocence and acceptance of kids with two mums or two dads, will find that nature and hormones will have the final say on how they feel about survival of the fittest and their society.

As for the kids who have to cop the teasing and the silence for the rest of their lives, well they have no choice but form another community subset and demand some kind of special recognition .... just wait and see.
 
Tisme said:
As for the kids who have to cop the teasing and the silence for the rest of their lives, well they have no choice but form another community subset and demand some kind of special recognition .... just wait and see.
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Another "Stolen Generation" ?
 
SirRumpole said:
Another "Stolen Generation" ?
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They will have to stay in line, because the next logical step is already in train:

scientists are already having success in taking a body cell from one mammal species and fusing it to an enucleated egg from another. The cloned embryos are then implanted into the uterus of the donor species.

So, given how we are going with the whole life is cheap thing, we (hopefully not me) should be seeing third world breeder women carry a rebirthed version of "Tiddles" the cat, probably some surrogate sheep carrying a hipster couple's fashion accessory child, .... the potential is endless ..... and anyone who protests will be a xenophobe or hateful bigot.

Hate to be the Indian women who gets the elephant egg.:(
 
Tisme said:
They will have to stay in line, because the next logical step is already in train:

scientists are already having success in taking a body cell from one mammal species and fusing it to an enucleated egg from another. The cloned embryos are then implanted into the uterus of the donor species.

So, given how we are going with the whole life is cheap thing, we (hopefully not me) should be seeing third world breeder women carry a rebirthed version of "Tiddles" the cat, probably some surrogate sheep carrying a hipster couple's fashion accessory child, .... the potential is endless ..... and anyone who protests will be a xenophobe or hateful bigot.

Hate to be the Indian women who gets the elephant egg.:(
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There is a science fiction book of short stories called Dangerous Visions edited by Harlan Ellison in the 80s I think which has women producing all sorts of items with their wombs. All coming true.
 
Knobby22 said:
There is a science fiction book of short stories called Dangerous Visions edited by Harlan Ellison in the 80s I think which has women producing all sorts of items with their wombs. All coming true.
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Wouldn't be the first time life imitates art. I might have to look that book up.
 
SirRumpole said:
Yes, they might actually do some good.
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You have to be able to prove something is harmful before you can restrict people's rights.

We know that a certain percentage of drugs are going to turn out harmful, having bad side effects or not have the positive effects the makers hope, that's already been proven over the years, hence we have a rule that before we unleash them on the market, they must prove that they are safe.

Do you see the difference, we already know that drugs in a lot of cases turn out harmful, so they are restricted until proven safe.

You have no evidence that confirms gay parenting is harmful, so it doesn't diserve to be restricted, unless you can prove that gay parenting causes harm.
 
Value Collector said:
You have to be able to prove something is harmful before you can restrict people's rights.

We know that a certain percentage of drugs are going to turn out harmful, having bad side effects or not have the positive effects the makers hope, that's already been proven over the years, hence we have a rule that before we unleash them on the market, they must prove that they are safe.

Do you see the difference, we already know that drugs in a lot of cases turn out harmful, so they are restricted until proven safe.

You have no evidence that confirms gay parenting is harmful, so it doesn't diserve to be restricted, unless you can prove that gay parenting causes harm.
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People have a right not to be experimented on without their consent, whether harm can be proven or not.

Testimonials from people bought up this way who would have preferred not to have been is evidence that there may be harm in the process, therefore it should not proceed, and should not be endorsed or promoted by society.
 
Value Collector said:
You have no evidence that confirms gay parenting is harmful, so it doesn't diserve to be restricted, unless you can prove that gay parenting causes harm.
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tell that to the thousands of women in Africa who are dying from AIDS due to their children's father poking his into another man. Tell the kids how lucky they are to have a homosexually active father.
 
Tisme said:
tell that to the thousands of women in Africa who are dying from AIDS due to their children's father poking his into another man. Tell the kids how lucky they are to have a homosexually active father.
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Firstly, aids in Africa is spread mostly by heterosexuals, if a man brings home aids to his wife, he is far more likely to have got it from a female prostitute.

Secondly, if you ended the stigma, and laws against homosexuality in those countries gay men wouldn't need to hide in fake relationships.
 
SirRumpole said:
People have a right not to be experimented on without their consent, whether harm can be proven or not.

Testimonials from people bought up this way who would have preferred not to have been is evidence that there may be harm in the process, therefore it should not proceed, and should not be endorsed or promoted by society.
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It's no more of an experiment than any other form of up bringing, and as discussed earlier, you are simply counting the negative testimonials and not the positive ones.
 
Value Collector said:
It's no more of an experiment than any other form of up bringing
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It is an experiment because gays are not biologically or genetically equipped to have children without some sort of fabrication, they just want to pretend that they are "just like anyone else", which in the case of parenting they definitely are not.
 
Geez, Gays have got propaganda everywhere.

Is anyone else getting ads for "Gay Ski Week" in NZ at the bottom of this thread ?
 
Value Collector said:
Firstly, aids in Africa is spread mostly by heterosexuals, if a man brings home aids to his wife, he is far more likely to have got it from a female prostitute.

Secondly, if you ended the stigma, and laws against homosexuality in those countries gay men wouldn't need to hide in fake relationships.
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Oh so when a man pokes another man in the anus it's hetrosexual because he then sticks the same penis into a woman's vagina, or into his many wives of his polygynous harem? Many of those men force themselves on their wives because it is their right to do so.

There are serodiscordant and discordant relationships, whatever, males are by far and away the greater risk of giving aids to a woman through natural method intercourse than a woman giving it to a male. You start putting the old fella up someone's ar5e and there is a real risk of pushing gunk pneumatically up the penis and viola you're dead and the world should feel sorry for you.

There must be a lot of your prostitutes in Africa to infect upto 30% of some countries sexually active populations.

You need to talk to some of those social workers who go over and try to help those women and they will tell you what the men get into.
 
SirRumpole said:
It is an experiment because gays are not biologically or genetically equipped to have children without some sort of fabrication, they just want to pretend that they are "just like anyone else", which in the case of parenting they definitely are not.
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The same can be said for many heterosexual couples, who for one reason or another can not have their own biological children, and therefore turn to adoption and Other options.

also as pointed out, a lesbian having a child without a man is no different to a single woman having a baby, except she probably has more help because she has a partner.
 
Tisme said:
Oh so when a man pokes another man in the anus it's hetrosexual because he then sticks the same penis into a woman's vagina, or into his many wives of his polygynous harem? Many of those men force themselves on their wives because it is their right to do so.

There are serodiscordant and discordant relationships, whatever, males are by far and away the greater risk of giving aids to a woman through natural method intercourse than a woman giving it to a male. You start putting the old fella up someone's ar5e and there is a real risk of pushing gunk pneumatically up the penis and viola you're dead and the world should feel sorry for you.

There must be a lot of your prostitutes in Africa to infect upto 30% of some countries sexually active populations.

You need to talk to some of those social workers who go over and try to help those women and they will tell you what the men get into.
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Only 1% of any given population is going to be gay, so if large numbers of wives are getting aids, you can't blame it on the gays, I don't think gays are going around raping everyone's wives.

Also, this would be completely eliminated if society accepted gays and didn't force them into hiding in fake hetero relationships.

as I said, if large numbers of women are being infected with aids, it has to be coming from their straight husbands, prostitution is the most likely cause, think about it, is the town gay going around raping everyone's wives, or is the town hooker infected and the husbands are sleeping with her and then later doing their wives?

The church inspired banning of condoms in some communities also doesn't help.
 
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