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Where in the hell is Australia heading?

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springhill said:
BOB BROWN, GREENS LEADER
"This today is a world-leading outcome. It is going to lead to better outcomes at Durban and for the next international conference on climate change."

This sums it up perfectly, these people are megalomaniacs, full of their own self-importance.

Do they honestly think because little old Oz has a carbon tax, the rest of the world will follow? Our importance in the Australasia region has seriously gone to our heads.

We will be laughed at for being the country with every advantage in the world, and threw them all away for a false ideology. The rest of the world will prey upon our competitive disadvantage.

A sad, sorry turn of events.
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Yes, the power has made the Greens quite delusional. It will encourage them to push for more and more of their wacky wishes and the government, having set this precedent, will dutifully fall into line to save their skins.
Just so depressing.
 
The fall out from this with regard to descretionary spending will be interesting. I certainly wouldn't like to be a landlord, commercial or residential, for the next two to three years.
IMO the fall out will be dramatic and have a huge negative effect on standard of living for all Australians.:eek:
 
Here is a curly one for you to chow down on.

From an energy point of view:- Would I be better off buying plastic plates and disposing of them in landfill or am I better off eating off china plates and running through the dishwasher?

The answer: Plastic plates of course. They are made in China that doesn't have a carbon tax silly.
 
trainspotter said:
Here is a curly one for you to chow down on.

From an energy point of view:- Would I be better off buying plastic plates and disposing of them in landfill or am I better off eating off china plates and running through the dishwasher?

The answer: Plastic plates of course. They are made in China that doesn't have a carbon tax silly.
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China plates come from China!:D
 
One of the more irritating mutterings from economists et al is the assertion that the tax will change behaviour. They seem blissfully unaware that many Australian households are already struggling to meet energy bills so have already cut back as much as they can.
This sort of elitist assurance from people who will be in a position to easily cope with additional charges is very off.
 
Julia said:
One of the more irritating mutterings from economists et al is the assertion that the tax will change behaviour. They seem blissfully unaware that many Australian households are already struggling to meet energy bills so have already cut back as much as they can.
This sort of elitist assurance from people who will be in a position to easily cope with additional charges is very off.
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The underlying problem I see Julia, is this has the potential to substantially reduce our living standards.
If we are the only country in the SE Asia to impose these extra costs on our manufacturing industries, what is the incentive to stay in business.
The resulting loss in jobs will force downward pressure on wages yet the tax will force upward pressure on costs. It is an absolute recipe for disaster.
The only way it will work is if the rest of the region adopts the tax, which is highly unlikely as they will have another competitive edge.
It appears to me we are going the socialist way of everyone goes down to the lowest common denominator. That is unless you are a politician then your pension is indexed to the cost of living. Lets have another chorus of that great Labor song "The working class can kiss my (how does it go)"
The real laugh is, they think the lower income earners won't see through the the old give with one hand and take back with the other.
Also increasing the tax free threshold to $18,000 is a classic, there will be so many people on piecemeal part time jobs to make ends meet, it would cost the tax dept more to proccess them than just let them go. They are picking up the tax anyway, just through a different vehicle.
My rant for the day LOL
 
I don't like the idea that we are going to buy carbon credits from overseas to tell you the truth. When this sinks in we will basically be throwing money to other countries to save us carbon on something that will do nothing to affect the actual carbon in the air. Yup get rid of jobs then give our money away. And what happened to this carbon tax being revenue neutral, it's about $4billion in the hole.
 
moXJO said:
I don't like the idea that we are going to buy carbon credits from overseas to tell you the truth. When this sinks in we will basically be throwing money to other countries to save us carbon on something that will do nothing to affect the actual carbon in the air.
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lol... thats exactly why the carbon scare campaign was pushed so hard in the first place mate! the very ppl causing the panic (gore etc) are the ones who will make a killing when the carbon trading bullsh*t is implemented via there carbon trading schemes.....

blind freddy can see through this, its like 'chicken little' meets 'the emperor's new clothes' :banghead: what a massive bloody fraud!
 
Who does Al Gore buy his carbon credits from? Why the carbon credit company he founded himself of course.

General Investment Management LLP. http://www.generationim.com/about/

Generation is an independent, private, owner-managed partnership with offices in London, New York and Sydney. The firm was co-founded in 2004 by Al Gore and David Blood.
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Anyone want to suck the lollipop of truth? :rolleyes:
 
sptrawler said:
Also increasing the tax free threshold to $18,000 is a classic, there will be so many people on piecemeal part time jobs to make ends meet, it would cost the tax dept more to proccess them than just let them go.
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This is another great con. With the low income tax offset the effective tax free threshold was around $16,000 anyway. So there's little difference, plus I understand the % payment rates are being raised, so no actual benefit at all. What ***** smoke and mirrors.

I think they're very foolish to indulge in this sort of attempt at pulling the wool over the electorate's eyes. People are not as silly as they seem to think, and the realisation that the government is again attempting to dupe us will only increase the disgust.
 
Julia said:
...I think they're very foolish to indulge in this sort of attempt at pulling the wool over the electorate's eyes. People are not as silly as they seem to think, and the realisation that the government is again attempting to dupe us will only increase the disgust.
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Agree, Julia, and I think it is the reason Gillard slows her voice down when talking down to her constituents as if they are in kindergarten.

Maybe an election when the people vent their disgust will bring her to her senses...:rolleyes:
 
tayser said:
Mortlake has a Gas 500MW station U/C right now - and with the incentive to now invest more in this type of generation, more will come along allowing a phased shut down of Hazelwood (1600MW) to occur in the medium term.
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And then we need to build a gas pipe from Qld coal seams to Vic to keep the gas-fired power stations running once Bass Strait reserves are depleted (which will happen rather rapidly if we start relying on it for electricity).

Then Victorians realise that all of a sudden, their gas bills have risen in addition to rising electricity costs.

Then realise that Mortlake is being built to cater for rising consumption. If it's used to replace Hazelwood instead, then we need to build another one.

Then the gas companies point out how valuable the stuff is once the Gladstone LNG plant is built. Just like what happened in WA - hence that's state's fairly recent investment in new coal-fired generation.

Due to all of this, the first environmental opposition to electricity generation in Victoria (back in the 1970's) was in fact to the construction of Newport D gas-fired station. And the primary reason for opposition was simply that it runs on gas - if you take out CO2 then coal makes a lot more sense in terms of resource use which even environmentalists understand. Unions had similar concerns at the time, something they have repeated more recently - gas is not a long term sensible option for large scale baseload generation.

Hazelwood's ongoing operating cost is somewhere around $3.50 per megawatt hour by most estimates (the exact figures are confidential). Even the lowest estimates for new gas-fired generation are 11 times that amount. And that's assuming current low gas prices can be maintained in the face of greatly increased demand.
 
Why can't we let the status qou operate? Keep coal fire power staions BUT BUT BUT plant more trees to offset our carbon footprint?
 
Here's an idea.

A cat always lands on its feet. Buttered toast always lands buttered side down. Now strap a piece of toast, buttered side up, to the back of a cat. The toast will constantly try to land buttered side down and the cat will try to land on it's feet, thus creating a perpetual motion machine.

No emissions and lots of energy. Problem solved. :)
 
Julia said:
One of the more irritating mutterings from economists et al is the assertion that the tax will change behaviour. They seem blissfully unaware that many Australian households are already struggling to meet energy bills so have already cut back as much as they can.
This sort of elitist assurance from people who will be in a position to easily cope with additional charges is very off.
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yes, cate blanchett immediately springs to mind
 
white_crane said:
Here's an idea.

A cat always lands on its feet. Buttered toast always lands buttered side down. Now strap a piece of toast, buttered side up, to the back of a cat. The toast will constantly try to land buttered side down and the cat will try to land on it's feet, thus creating a perpetual motion machine.

No emissions and lots of energy. Problem solved. :)
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A slinky on an escalator is my preferred option. They go forever.

On a serious note why cannot each wheel of a car be turned into a magneto/generator? Either by having magnets inside the rim of the tyre (magneto) or by having a generator attached or even wired into the axles of the car instead of the motor running the electrical charging components? Sort of like a dynamo on a bike to run the light but on a much larger scale except for UNLIKE a dynamo there is no friction as the turning parts do not touch.

As soon as the car moves (by battery of course) the actual MOTION of the vehicle is creating an electrical current thusly charging the battery. (perpetual motion)

It is so simple I do not know why this has not been done before? Now especially with geared reduction electrical engines it would be highly plausible to do so?

*TS sneaks off to shed to start inventing his perpetual motion car*
 
on.jpg

Will the tax help this man?
 
trainspotter said:
On a serious note why cannot each wheel of a car be turned into a magneto/generator? Either by having magnets inside the rim of the tyre (magneto) or by having a generator attached or even wired into the axles of the car instead of the motor running the electrical charging components? Sort of like a dynamo on a bike to run the light but on a much larger scale except for UNLIKE a dynamo there is no friction as the turning parts do not touch.

As soon as the car moves (by battery of course) the actual MOTION of the vehicle is creating an electrical current thusly charging the battery. (perpetual motion)

It is so simple I do not know why this has not been done before? Now especially with geared reduction electrical engines it would be highly plausible to do so?

*TS sneaks off to shed to start inventing his perpetual motion car*
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Sounds great, however there there is no such thing as a free lunch ts.

When you run a wire through a magnetic field it induces a current - ala the dynamo. The generated current also produces a magnetic field that opposes the field of the magnet that the wire passes though and creates resistance. It would work well in conjunction with braking but will use more energy than it creates if engaging it while accelerating or cruising. Back to the drawing board :D
 
In the spirit of saving the world here is another wacky idea;

there are thousands of power poles connected by wires around the place right. What about if we manufactured lots of little windmill generators that clamped on top of each existing power pole (no need for additional ugly and carbon producing poles/structures), and fed the power they generate into the wire that is conveniently going right past it, thus reducing the power input reqd at the supply end when the wind is blowing?
 
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