NBN Rollout Scrapped

[tothemax6]

Pretty sure there would of been a similar argument about the car replacing the horse and electric lights replacing whale oil powered lamps....seriously.

The first cars were slow and cumbersome, noisy made strange smells and drove on roads designed and built for horses and cost alot of money, there would of been alot of opinion in favour of the good old trusty horse, probably would of made more short term financial sense to stick with horses too.

You Can't Stop Progress...its inevitable.

Key difference here - nobody was forced to buy a car. This was back in the good ol' days of 'free enterprise'.

Regarding stopping progress, I shall quote:
"Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things."
Russell Baker

 

[sptrawler]

Like I have said in previous posts, the $40 billion would be better spent on critical infrastucture. Every one over the Easten States will be screaming when the Cooper basin gas reserves run out, they are seriously depleted already.
Maybe then they will say the money would have been better spent running a gas pipe from the N.W.Shelf. Or running water from the north of the country down to the south and creating a food bowl in the Pilbara and central west coast. The soil around there will grow anything if you can keep the water up to it.
That sort of thing is productive and nation building. Making the internet faster has negligable net worth to Australia. Water and Fuel are going to be the major issues and throwing in desalination plants is only making the so called greenhouse problem worse.
They could even try putting in wind farms and have hydrogen plants next to them so that the fuel is being made by renewable energy. Then the hydrogen could be used as an energy storage medium. No that would be too sensible. Lets make the internet faster instead. Fools run by Fools

 

[white_goodman]

Fools run by Fools

the state of modern western societies... thats at the best case, in the worst case they are being terrible for ulterior motives

 

[So_Cynical]

Key difference here - nobody was forced to buy a car. This was back in the good ol' days of 'free enterprise'.

Regarding stopping progress, I shall quote:
"Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things."
Russell Baker

tothemax6 please tell us how you get around your tax dollars being spent on roads im fascinated....and who the hell is Russell baker and why should i give a toss about what he says?

Did I hit a raw nerve yesterday ?

Raw nerve...no, i just get a little cranky when people such as your self post dishonestly in what can only to assumed to be a very deliberate act of disinformation to push your particular political agenda.

 

[tothemax6]

tothemax6 please tell us how you get around your tax dollars being spent on roads im fascinated....and who the hell is Russell baker and why should i give a toss about what he says?

Russell baker is 'some dude'. Just had to put his name under the quote, citation and all that, y' know .

Firstly, your implication is that if something is big and nation-wide, it should be government owned. We should have public rail, electricity, water, telephony, gas, TV, cable, you name it. But then, is not retail big and nation wide? Or mining? Should the government not provide supermarkets, to 'provide for a growing nation' or whatever?
The answer is no, the USSR tried all that.
I would love private roads. Logically, how would private roads compete? If Bobs private road is a slow, congested, bumpy piece of ----, and Jane's private road is a smooth, free-flowing dream-to-drive-on, with no traffic lights and high speed limits, who will go out of business? With public roads, the government effectively maintains a monopoly on roads - a private road has to compete with 'free' public roads, which is completely unworkable.
Sure, there are limits to the types of roads which can be privatized, such as the small residential type roads. But big roads - we should be able to buy shares in the things.

 

[prawn_86]

But big roads - we should be able to buy shares in the things.

You can, and a lot of the toll road operators have gone broke. Roads are too expensive to maintain for the amount of tolls charged and motorists are not willing to pay more as they feel they should be free (or paid for by our already high taxes)

Personally i think health, education, transport should all be available free up to a 'good' standard. I think the benefits outweigh the costs. But thats for another thread...

 

[sptrawler]

Russell baker is 'some dude'. Just had to put his name under the quote, citation and all that, y' know .

Firstly, your implication is that if something is big and nation-wide, it should be government owned. We should have public rail, electricity, water, telephony, gas, TV, cable, you name it. But then, is not retail big and nation wide? Or mining? Should the government not provide supermarkets, to 'provide for a growing nation' or whatever?
The answer is no, the USSR tried all that.
I would love private roads. Logically, how would private roads compete? If Bobs private road is a slow, congested, bumpy piece of ----, and Jane's private road is a smooth, free-flowing dream-to-drive-on, with no traffic lights and high speed limits, who will go out of business? With public roads, the government effectively maintains a monopoly on roads - a private road has to compete with 'free' public roads, which is completely unworkable.
Sure, there are limits to the types of roads which can be privatized, such as the small residential type roads. But big roads - we should be able to buy shares in the things.

Actually toothemax6 roads used to be put be put in by the government Main Roads Department and local councils used to maintain roads in their shires they also used to put in new sub divisions and drainage and the government used to put in the power and telephone.
Now all of that has been handed over to the private sector and you pay heaps more for your block of land to the developer. You have toll roads, you pay heaps more for your power and telephone.
NOW have your council rates gone down, NO ARE you paying less tax now that all these things have been removed from government SERVICES.NO
YOU PAY MORE FOR THE SAME.

 

[drsmith]

Raw nerve...no, i just get a little cranky when people such as your self post dishonestly in what can only to assumed to be a very deliberate act of disinformation to push your particular political agenda.

The speed difference between NBN entry and ADSL2+ was discussed between another poster and yourself yesterday, so there's little point re-covering that ground.

What will make more people cranky over time is paying more for quota when the general trend has been in the other direction. That though is what we get from the bunch of incompetent socialist retards that is our current government.

 

[sails]

You can, and a lot of the toll road operators have gone broke. Roads are too expensive to maintain for the amount of tolls charged and motorists are not willing to pay more as they feel they should be free (or paid for by our already high taxes)

Personally i think health, education, transport should all be available free up to a 'good' standard. I think the benefits outweigh the costs. But thats for another thread...

Health, education and roads used to be paid for by taxes and vehicle regos and then made made available for all to use with no further expense. However, it seems that governments have become so money hungry that the funds originally designated for these purposes have been diverted to other schemes leaving the taxpayer having to pay more than once for the same essential services.

I don't remember our rego being decreased when road building was taken over by the private sector. I wonder what our rego is used for now?

I can't see NBN being any different. The consumer will most likely pay for this thing through increased taxes and also be charged quite heavily for using it...

 

[trainspotter]

The speed difference between NBN entry and ADSL2+ was discussed between another poster and yourself yesterday, so there's little point re-covering that ground.

What will make more people cranky over time is paying more for quota when the general trend has been in the other direction. That though is what we get from the bunch of incompetent socialist retards that is our current government.

*Hear hear* :iagree:

 

[sptrawler]

Your right on the money sails, but guess what, we must keep a lid on wages or inflation will become rampant. . But fortunately that is the benefit of having 75% of ministers ex union bosses they just call in the favours.
Throw the plebs $3000 two years ago and now tax directly and indirectly $5000 out of them. It will be interesting to see if they can pull it off. I personaly think the electorate is better informed and the N.S.W election seems to support that. Bad Government won't cut it just by thinking the electorate is stupid.
The N.B.N was stupid in its conception and I've seen nothing yet that changes my belief. It is a waste of oppurtunity and money that could be used to build something that doesn't enable kids to do online gaming at a faster speed.
Maybe I am just old fashioned and think food, water and shelter is more important.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

It's dead.

Deceased.

Gone to meet it's mayka.

gg

 

[sptrawler]

Priceless...... Witty comedy is funny. Half witted politics isn't.

 

[drsmith]

For the "Bill Gates's", this might be of interest,

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1675718&r=28860688&u=408887#r28860688

 

[So_Cynical]

The latest announcement from the NBN site below.

"NBN Co announces first service providers for mainland Australia 08 April 2011

NBN Co is on track for the September commencement of commercial super-fast broadband services with the signing of the first retail service providers to connect to the new network for trials on mainland Australia."

http://www.nbnco.com.au/wps/wcm/con...service-providers-for-mainland-Australia.html

 

[joea]

A plan to connect every new home built after January 1st. with fibre cable to the home has been abandoned.
As we have heard before the last bit will be copper.

The plot thickens.

 

[drsmith]

4 Corners will make for interesting viewing tonight.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...oid-compensation/story-e6frg90f-1226037015201

FTTN was effectively dead once Telstra was rejected from the tender process.

"The government could spend $15 billion to build a fibre-to-the-node network (and) pay $15 to $20 billion to Telstra for compensation," Senator Conroy told ABC's Four Corners program due to screen on Monday night.

"Then Telstra could take that money and build a fibre-to-the-home network past you and strand 70 per cent of $15 billion on the side of the road."

 

[IFocus]

What will make more people cranky over time is paying more for quota when the general trend has been in the other direction. That though is what we get from the bunch of incompetent socialist retards that is our current government.

Which part of the current labor party would you say acts along the lines of the Wiki quote of Socialist

From Wiki

Socialism is an economic and political theory advocating public or common ownership and cooperative management of the means of production and allocation of resources.[1][2][3] A socialist society is organized on the basis of relatively equal power-relations, self-management, dispersed decision-making (adhocracy) and a reduction or elimination of hierarchical and bureaucratic forms of administration and governance, the extent of which varies in different types of socialism.[4][5] This ranges from the establishment of cooperative management structures to the abolition of all hierarchical structures in favor of free association.

 

[drsmith]

Which part of the current labor party would you say acts along the lines of the Wiki quote of Socialist

Perhaps the part that wants to build a government owned NBN.

You've declined to question incompetent retards, so, as Meatloaf woud say, 2 out of 3 ain't bad.

 

[sails]

I understand that Ms Gillard was (and possibly still is)a Fabian and, since her MPs have to toe the line even if they don't agree with her policies, I would think we are seeing more of the Fabian influence with a substantial mix of Green. Still, whatever is behind labor's policies, their track record of managing anything is becomming more dismal by the day.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_Society

The Fabian Society is a British socialist movement, whose purpose is to advance the principles of democratic socialism via gradualist and reformist, rather than revolutionary, means....

Today, the society is a vanguard think tank of the centre left. It is one of 15 socialist societies affiliated with the Labour Party. Similar societies exist in Australia (the Australian Fabian Society)...

and looks like Swan is into it too: http://www.fabian.org.au/1.asp

Image above of the Fabian "Wolf in Sheeps Clothing" logo from:
http://www.australiamatters.com/fabian.html